Experience Why Is It Important When Hiring A New Band Member

[blue]

This might be a worthwhile discussion.

Anyone have any thoughts on why current relevant gigging experience should be important to a working band.

How can you screen out those who have embellished their resume.

We've all seen;

"30 years experience" or " I have years of playing under my belt" Those statements could mean anything.

This discussion is open to Originals Bands, Pub Bands, Bar Bands, Functions Bands, Pros whatever.

Ok, what are your thoughts?

Blue

[blue]

I'll start.

It depends on what a band is looking for.

Here's an example, a national touring band, let's say they're headlining 250-500 seat venues.They are booked for 4 months, East coast,West coast and the Midwest. Then another month in Europe.They're looking for a bass player.

I'd be very hesitant to to audition as I have no touring experience.

Blue

Edited January 3, 2017 by blue

[Number6]

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1483407775' post='3206954']
I'll start.

It depends on what a band is looking for.

Here's an example, a national touring band, let's say they're headlining 250-500 seat venues.They are booked for 4 months, East coast,West coast and the Midwest. Then another month in Europe.They're looking for a bass player.

I'd be very hesitant to to audition as I have no touring experience.

Blue
[/quote]

However to get experience of auditioning as long as you're clear on your level of previous knowledge it may prove worthwhile.

Edited January 3, 2017 by Number6

[Cato]

I've gigged with kids who've only been playing for a year who are significantly better than others who have been playing for 20.

Experience is no guarantee of quality. IMO.

[blue]

[quote name='Cato' timestamp='1483421945' post='3206962']
I've gigged with kids who've only been playing for a year who are significantly better than others who have been playing for 20.

Experience is no guarantee of quality. IMO.
[/quote]

The 20 year old is better in what way?

And I'm certainly not going to take sides with 20 years of experience.

Playing for 20 years means nothing to me. It could mean 20 years of laziness, floating in and out of one band to another and generally being a pain in the arse.

Many of you are well aware of these types of "20 years experience" guys.

Just making a point.

Blue

Edited January 3, 2017 by blue

[Cato]

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1483423133' post='3206965']


The 20 year old is better in what way?

And I'm certainly not going to take sides with 20 years of experience.

Playing for 20 years means nothing to me. It could mean 20 years of laziness, floating in and out of one band to another and generally being a pain in the arse.

Many of you are well aware of these types of "20 years experience" guys.

Just making a point.

Blue
[/quote]

I think we're both making the same point.

Enthusiasm and raw natural talent can be more fun to play alongside than the guy who's been plodding along in the same rut for years.

Edited January 3, 2017 by Cato

[Mykesbass]

Right temperament would trump experience any day for me.

[LukeFRC]

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1483407775' post='3206954']
I'll start.

It depends on what a band is looking for.

Here's an example, a national touring band, let's say they're headlining 250-500 seat venues.They are booked for 4 months, East coast,West coast and the Midwest. Then another month in Europe.They're looking for a bass player.

I'd be very hesitant to to audition as I have no touring experience.

Blue
[/quote] In that example I would encourage you to go for it - but be really honest about your non-touring experience.

[Phil Starr]

I've been involved in a number of start up bands and am just about to have another go. Both bring their challenges but i think you'd be foolish to make assumptions without an audition and a lot of chat.

The experienced player is likely to bring a lot of extra skills, not least that of being able to play in a band, all those practical things of coping with a singer who goes for the wrong verse or the drummer breaking a stick and so on. Bedroom players often keep fairly poor time at first and get flustered when a mistake occurs. Far too many experienced players at my end of the feeding pool bring a lot of inflexibility over what and how they play however, wanting to recreate their old band and wanting to use the songs they have nailed rather than learn anything new. Against that you have to set generally higher skill levels and a huge back catalogue of songs (I only ever play covers, well so far anyway), decent gear and often good stagecraft.

The less experienced player can find adapting to a band tricky, stagefright can be a problem as can all the practical things, like adjusting your tone and volumes to suit the band rather than what sounds good at home. They'll have trouble moving from song to song without a break, sometimes stamina and all sort of little things. It's probably going to take longer to get them rehearsed up to the levels you'd like.

All of this can be sorted out in rehearsal though. It quickly becomes fairly clear if you've got a grumpy old git (I'm 64) who can't change or a youngster who isn't up to the mark. You just have to be honest about what is expected. All the experienced players were once joining their first gigging band. Most of it is about personality though, if someone is willing to give it a go and work on what they lack, relishing the challenges a new band brings then you can make it work whatever their age and experience.

[FinnDave]

If I was looking for a new band member, I'd be very wary of taking on someone without a proven track record, just playing well is not enough, they need to be able to be reliable, to work well as part of the band and be used to giving up weekend nights to drive, set up, and play with enthusiasm.

If someone says they have 'years of playing' under their belt, I'd expect there to be solid evidence of that, around here, we'd already know them.

[blue]

[quote name='Cato' timestamp='1483429553' post='3206983']


I think we're both making the same point.

Enthusiasm and raw natural talent can be more fun to play alongside than the guy who's been plodding along in the same rut for years.
[/quote]

I'd say that's an element of the package.

Blue

[blue]

[quote name='Mykesbass' timestamp='1483430324' post='3206984']
Right temperament would trump experience any day for me.
[/quote]

Agreed, temperament and a granular understand on what it takes to be in a band.

Blue

[blue]

[quote name='FinnDave' timestamp='1483432161' post='3206994']

If someone says they have 'years of playing' under their belt, I'd expect there to be solid evidence of that, around here, we'd already know them.
[/quote]

Exactly and personally I have no problem asking a candidate;

When was your last gig? Tell us a little about that gig.

How many gigs did you play in 2016


What type of gigs, high profile, bar or pub gigs, theatre gigs?

Blue

[Cuzzie]

I can speak as a late thirties guy who took up bass a couple years ago.
I did this because some guys near me needed a bassist, so I said I would give it a go, now fortunately we are all friends with kids at the same school etc. And they were patient.
I try my best, i practice as often as I can, this is all of ours hobby and what has gone from me playing root Notes only, I can now do a bit more with bass lines.
We have done a couple cover type gigs for friends etc. And now want to write our own stuff and see where it goes.
I was fortunate that I played musical instruments before so had some idea of timings, playing in a group etc.

I think the main thing is that we all get on, luckily our wives get on too.
If something changed I had to play with different people it would be no hassle for me and I would rather take a solid guy, reliable who you can have a beer with any day over a virtuoso who was flaky.
If it's something that's for proper money generation instead of a hobby, then there is a balance that can be struck and you don't need to be buddies, but everyone needs to buy in to the ethos

[FinnDave]

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1483432919' post='3207002']
Exactly and personally I have no problem asking a candidate;

When was your last gig? Tell us a little about that gig.

How many gigs did you play in 2016


What type of gigs, high profile, bar or pub gigs, theatre gigs?

Blue
[/quote]

Yep, if it wasn't someone I knew, I'd definitely be asking those questions. I'd also want to know how many bands they've played in over the last ten years, and why they left. Some people have been chucked out of more bands than most of us have played in!

[NancyJohnson]

My main band has undergone a few upheavals in the last year and while I'd stress that losing our guitarist (to another project) was just plain sad and awful, even he's admitted the new guy is a far better fit.

From the experience perspective, we've all been doing it for decades; the new drummer and guitarist both have what qualifies as experience but for one reason or another neither had played in about a year. With both guys, I spoke to them at length on the phone and circulated audio ahead of the first get together, but if either of these guys had been asshats, it would have been apparent during the first conversation and they wouldn't have been invited along. I'd rather play with guys who want this to be fun rather than virtuoso fret-w***ers.

Obviously with the prevalence of social media, it is quite routine to do some online checking to support any credentials - just a few minutes ago I read a Facebook entry on a musicians wanted page where some guy said he's played 'over a thousand gigs in the last ten years'. Clicking on his photos showed up loads of photos of trees and his dog, but not one of the guy playing with anything other than a football. What does that say?

[bazzbass]

I know musicians who have played for 20 plus years, constantly gigging, but can't get their act together, turning up late, broken gear, no spare anything.
Experience doesn't mean they're gonna be good, but most people learn SOMETHING after all those years.

I've been lucky enough to have always played in bands with people I was friends with already, bringing in one new person maybe.

It's more important that the new member gels with the band than whether they've played in bands for a long time, assuming the talent is there.

[chris_b]

The last audition I did that got me into a band was in 1985. Since then it's been a long list of one door closing and two doors opening.

Every offer to me for over 30 years has been by word of mouth. I don't know any bands that advertise for new members, so IME every new person is already known, wanted and has the gig before the phone call is made. That makes it extremely difficult if not impossible to be an outsider and break in to the local band scene.

I usually get my deps from people I know or who know the guys I play with. For the few where I'm not known I'll provide Youtube's of me playing. Unfortunately that can be a double edged sword for an old git like me!

[DaytonaRik]

Experience means nothing when it comes to talent/ability but it DOES mean a whole lot when knowing what's expected of you in terms of professionalism, approach to rehearsals/learning material, spares etc.

That said, not every experienced gigging musician are particularly proficient at the professional approach either.

[TrevorR]

Genuine question...

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1483407775' post='3206954']
I'll start.

It depends on what a band is looking for.

Here's an example...

I'd be very hesitant to to audition as I have no touring experience.

Blue
[/quote]

How does someone get their first touring experience, presuming they've not come up through the "originals band schlepping round the country/state in a beat up van" career route?

[dmccombe7]

This is a good post for me as i had all the gigging experience many years ago and stopped playing in bands for about 15yrs.
To get back into playing i had to attend auditions.
What i found was that people appreciated several things like being confident on bass, good time keeping, enthusiasm, easy going personality, knowledge of the material each band was playing ie anything from heavy rock to Glam covers, originals Prog, and now loosely termed as Funk / Blues.
None of the bands i auditioned for asked about my history or experience altho i did make a point of telling them before they offered me the position.
They mainly wanted to know i could actually play well and that i was able to blend with the existing members of the band.
Out of all that i only failed one audition for a Gaelic folk band and i think that was down to not being fully committed to the style and other bass players were and got the job. (they did call me back a year later when the guy left - LOL)

I don't think there's any one thing that qualifies you for a job and it needs to be a combination of factors.

Dave

[karlfer]

In Blue's example, post #2 a lot of folk would weed themselves out anyway.

Touring US and Europe, well, it has to be goodbye to any day job. That should lead to a premise of requiring an experienced professional imo.

One of the things I KNOW I bring to a band is experience.
Even though I'm a grumpy fat old git, I can make suggestions about song arrangements that can make a difference.

Just one example, from one band and one song.
Bryan Adams, Summer of 69.

I suggested doubling the length of the lead break, with both guitars doing tapped harmonies.
It always went down very well and people nearly always kinda went "wow".

Experience helps with arrangements and pleasing crowds IMO.

[TimR]

[b]Relevant[/b] experience.

There's some crossover between different gigs but someone who is used to playing 30numbers at pub gigs in jeans may be a great player and know what's expected in that environment but expect them to put on a pair of shoes and trousers and prepare 50 numbers for a wedding gig, and I've seen a lot of musicians fall down spectacularly.

Some will take some direction but for those where 'smart' means best jeans and trainers they'll never cross over.

.

[TimR]

[quote name='karlfer' timestamp='1483443210' post='3207114']
In Blue's example, post #2 a lot of folk would weed themselves out anyway.

Touring US and Europe, well, it has to be goodbye to any day job. That should lead to a premise of requiring an experienced professional imo.

One of the things I KNOW I bring to a band is experience.
Even though I'm a grumpy fat old git, I can make suggestions about song arrangements that can make a difference.

Just one example, from one band and one song.
Bryan Adams, Summer of 69.

I suggested doubling the length of the lead break, with both guitars doing tapped harmonies.
It always went down very well and people nearly always kinda went "wow".

Experience helps with arrangements and pleasing crowds IMO.
[/quote]

Yes. In my experience messing with well known arrangements can get you into deep water when you need new members or a dep at short notice.

[mikel]

You can only truly judge someone by playing with them and finding out first hand if they are reliable, fun to be around, gig ready and suitable for the job in hand.

Unless you can check every band on someones CV, not possible I would argue, give a couple of guys 3 or 4 days to nail say 8 to 10 songs. See how early they get to the audition, how quickly they set up and get there sound and how sensitively they treat the material. If they are a fit musically have a good chat and include the whole band in this cos how you gel as personalities is equally important.

Someone could have gigged for 20 months or 20 years but the right guy will stick out, as they fit the unique dynamic that is any band.

People play with people not CVs.

Edited January 3, 2017 by mikel