Amp Ambivalence

[Danuman]

Welp. I finally completed my set of nice and efficient 112 cabs, and what I'd already feared is now abundantly clear:

My amp does not have what it takes.

I was hoping some of you might have a few suggestions. I'm looking for something reasonably lightweight (I.e. not too heavy) and durable (I.e. no output valves), but with plenty of push.

I've been thinking of the Aguilar AG 500 SC and the Eden WT550. I've played both, but never at levels where they had to work up a proper sweat. However, my current band is one where I really need to be able to push the drummer.

So... anything to recommend?

[markstuk]

What amp do you currently have ?

[Danuman]

I currently have an Eden WTX500. The eq is limited, which is only an issue in difficult rooms as its core sound is really quite good. Not nearly enough power to push a powerful drummer though.

[Kev]

Interesting combination of realisations, efficient 112 cabs and underpowered head I would have though inefficient cabs would have highlighted this, or visa versa.

I sincerely recommend you look at Class D amplifiers. GK MB Fusion series are a really good starting point, none of the Class D stereotypes and the 500w version I had was plenty loud enough with 112 cabs.

[Chupacabra]

500W RMS isn't enough to compete with your drummer? I'd look into that, rather than your rig...

[Danuman]

I know, it's a pretty loud band.
It's worth mentioning though that I hooked up an Ampeg SVT 3 pro, which i believe is around 285 watts. That one did provide enough oomph, although only just...

[markstuk]

I suspect there maybe something wrong with your amp.. let's say you go for something thunderous like an orange BT1000, it's not going to be hugely louder although a couple of dB can make a big difference in the mix.. what cabs do you have?

[markstuk]

The newer generation D classes are worth a look at - the ones in the 800w range. I love my thunderfunk 750 which has edged out my rh750..

Slightly left field is the Quilter bass block 800.. but it's a power stage i think it's safe to trust..

[Danuman]

I checked and the svt 3 pro is rated higher, but the one I used was a little below 300 at 4 Ohms.

Cabs are Vanderkley. The WTX seems to have a bit of a reputation for being... let's say modestly powered.

[xgsjx]

Seems strange that your map isn't giving you enough volume, but it goes to show that watts don't really give any indication of how loud it can go.

I used to play in a really loud band with just a 2x10 Markbass combo & never struggled to be heard (though most of the venues never held much more than 300 people).

[quote name='markstuk' timestamp='1487025173' post='3236432']
The newer generation D classes are worth a look at - the ones in the 800w range. I love my thunderfunk 750 which has edged out my rh750..
[/quote]
As you probably know, the RH750 isn't able to put out 750 watts.

[markstuk]

[quote name='xgsjx' timestamp='1487026096' post='3236443']
Seems strange that your map isn't giving you enough volume, but it goes to show that watts don't really give any indication of how loud it can go.

I used to play in a really loud band with just a 2x10 Markbass combo & never struggled to be heard (though most of the venues never held much more than 300 people).


As you probably know, the RH750 isn't able to put out 750 watts.
[/quote]

But it is damn loud which sort of plays to your first point 😁

[xgsjx]

[quote name='markstuk' timestamp='1487026234' post='3236449']
But it is damn loud which sort of plays to your first point
[/quote]
I wouldn't say no to a RH750 as my amp, though I'd rather have the Thunderfunk. Both (even stacked on top one another) are a damn sight lighter than the valve amp I have.

[Painy]

I use an AG500 through a pair of 112 cabs (Aguilar DB112s) in a very loud pub rock covers band but we also play some slightly larger venues (maybe 4-500 capacity)
Our drummer is definitely a hard hitter (think John Bonham) and is also miked up through the (all Peavey apart from the desk) PA which is 2 pairs of 4Ohm UL115 top cabs and a pair of UL215 bass bins all powered by 2 Peavey 2600 power amps. Both guitars are also each running 100w Marshall valve heads through 4x12 cabs.
Even up against all that I'll generally run the head with the master volume between 10 and 11 o'clock and that's WITHOUT running it through the PA! Cuts through loud and clear with plenty of weight to the note (see how I avoided the 'H' word there) and plenty of headroom to spare.

Hope that helps.

[Danuman]

Ooh, John Bonham, that's exactly how I'd describe the drummer of my band. (He plays Ludwig too!)

Thanks Painy, you're describing what I'd be hoping for. I played the AG through a GS112. Sounded nice and focused in all the right places.

[Painy]

Well if I could describe the sound in just one word then 'focused' wouldn't be a bad choice at all.
It is quite Hi-Fi sounding which might not be for everyone (I personally really love the core sound of it) but I find I can easily warm it up with pedals if I do want that more vintage sound.

[Danuman]

I had a go on the little mark ninja and the little mark tube this afternoon. Almost a little too powerful, but I just can't seem to get on with the low mids on Markbass amps.

I would love to be the kind of badass that rolls up with something called a Thunderfunk, but it's out of my league, I'd have to admit with rather disappointed maturity.

The Quilter is probably not going to win any beauty contests, but it sure looks like it means business. I noticed they have a dealership in Antwerp. Hmm, I was planning a trip anyway...

Edited February 14, 2017 by Danuman

[doomed]

I'm liking my Quilter, it has plenty of power, I was a little dubious before it arrived but it soon dispelled any doubts.

[markstuk]

[quote name='Danuman' timestamp='1487096169' post='3237058']
I had a go on the little mark ninja and the little mark tube this afternoon. Almost a little too powerful, but I just can't seem to get on with the low mids on Markbass amps.

I would love to be the kind of badass that rolls up with something called a Thunderfunk, but it's out of my league, I'd have to admit with rather disappointed maturity.

The Quilter is probably not going to win any beauty contests, but it sure looks like it means business. I noticed they have a dealership in Antwerp. Hmm, I was planning a trip anyway...
[/quote]

You can get them from Wembley music.. [url="https://www.wembleymusiccentre.com/quilter-bass-block-800-bass-amp.html"]https://www.wembleym...0-bass-amp.html[/url]

Although out of stock at the moment - they had 4 a few weeks ago..

Edited February 14, 2017 by markstuk

[taunton-hobbit]

Class D ? Look at Crown Drivecore XLS - I've got one, and I can carry it in one hand-
loads of grunt and looks to be (fairly) indestructible......
(said he, a confirmed fanboi of Matamp valves.........)

[machinehead]

[quote name='Danuman' timestamp='1487096169' post='3237058']
I had a go on the little mark ninja and the little mark tube this afternoon. Almost a little too powerful, but I just can't seem to get on with the low mids on Markbass amps.

[u][b]I would love to be the kind of badass that rolls up with something called a Thunderfunk, but it's out of my league[/b][/u], I'd have to admit with rather disappointed maturity.

The Quilter is probably not going to win any beauty contests, but it sure looks like it means business. I noticed they have a dealership in Antwerp. Hmm, I was planning a trip anyway...
[/quote]

Thunderfunk amps can be had for £550 or so used, a little more for newer versions, so not that expensive.

A TFB550 version that I have, is still a great sounding amp, loud, solid and they can be easily repaired at component level, which is more than you can say for most amps.

There's a TFB550B for sale on basschat.

Frank.

Edited February 14, 2017 by machinehead

[Danuman]

Aww, that's tempting... I don't think I have the stones to sink 500+ pounds into a secondhand amp from Italy though.

I guess that means I'm not a badass.

(Sight unseen, I suppose I should add.)

Edited February 18, 2017 by Danuman

[Chienmortbb]

When they 1x12 Design Diary was started by Phil Starr and Stevie, the aim was to produce a 12" cabinet that would keep up with a loud drummer (i.e. 120dB). The cabinet that was designed di that and at about 250 watts if memory serves correctly. two cabinets should really be able to beat that is they are efficient.

Edited February 20, 2017 by Chienmortbb

[markstuk]

[quote name='Danuman' timestamp='1487096169' post='3237058']
I would love to be the kind of badass that rolls up with something called a Thunderfunk, but it's out of my league,
[/quote]

Trust me, no-one notices

[Danuman]

Well then, good to know my secret is safe.

To confuse matters more, I played a Little Mark III the other day, and to my surprise I really liked what I felt -- although I must admit that it was with a group of musicians that are a good bit less loud than my blues band.

It sounded a little (a lot!) more pristine than I'm used to, but If I can provide a nice beefy bottom to the band, I'm not too terribly concerned about the specifics of tone as long as it's agreeable enough.

Does anybody know how the sound of the Little Mark III compares to the black line/tube 800?

Edited February 20, 2017 by Danuman

[xgsjx]

I had the previous version, the LMII & loved it. Plenty loud enough for my loud blues rock band at the time & it was in 2x10 arrangement.