Popping my build cherry.

[LowMoFo]

Hi all,
Much like many other BCers, I have for some time been dreaming of my very own, unique, hand built basses.
You know the drill, beautifully figured woods, stunningly stained, good hardware, all of which combine to produce a tonal range to die for, but it all looks too damn gorgeous to even dare taking fingertips to it.
Well I'm about a lifetime away from being able to do that, so decided to start cheap, meaning that as & when I mess up, it won't break the bank, just my will to live.

Finding what I'm after didn't take too long: Every bass kit supplier on the planet seems VERY insistent that buyers WILL want a P or J bass.
Not true.
So finding someone who supplies different shaped bodies etc became fairly simple: It appears there's only one.

kitbuiltguitars.co.uk

A few (v helpful) chats with Mike @ KBG later, and I ordered this:
[attachment=239383:IMG_0340.JPG]

I've ordered an Artec pre-amp unit to replace the kit's passive wiring, and will upgrade hardware as I go along. All good.

But the bit that slows me down is the body. Or rather, how to colour it.
I've been thinking about bursting the body, going from a red/brown centre (think Ibanez's CNB finish), out to either a VERY dark brown or black edge.
The joins in the three-piece body are off-centre (see pic), so I'm thinking the back should be solid brown/black.
[attachment=239385:IMG_0341.JPG]
[attachment=239386:IMG_0344.JPG]

However. Being the least experienced builder on the planet, I thought it would be prudent to seek suggestions and advice from those who know FAR more than I do.
I also want to darken the fingerboard, but don't want to 'ebonise' it.

All thoughts, tips, warnings etc are more welcome than you could possibly imagine.

S

Edited March 22, 2017 by LowMoFo

[TheGreek]

If you want that "unique" look you really have to alter the body - Andy's been doing contours on basses resulting in weight loss and more comfort - the work he did on my Silk Bass makes it feel so playable and comfortable.

Personally, looking at the body you have I'd be inclined to shorten the bottom horn a couple of inches. If you draw a line (with your eye) through the top of the bottom scallop and the bottom of the top horn the tips of the two horns should be parallel to this line. By shortening the bottom horn you can achieve this and would create more pleasing lines.

I'd also think about sloping the back of the body forward (how a Jazz evolved from a Precision) for a sleeker line.

[URL=http://s1167.photobucket.com/user/FairfaxAikman/media/26f31aed-3e3b-4c61-bdd1-9facb0dd5846_zpstrwyj6k5.png.html][IMG]http://i1167.photobucket.com/albums/q639/FairfaxAikman/26f31aed-3e3b-4c61-bdd1-9facb0dd5846_zpstrwyj6k5.png[/IMG][/URL]

Edited March 1, 2017 by TheGreek

[Andyjr1515]

You can probably get this cheaper locally, but for your CNB, I would recommend getting a trial pack of Chestnut Spirit Wood Stains (Go for Wood Colours, not their similar Rainbow Colours pack). This is the slightly more expensive eBay offer but at least you can see what I'm talking about: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/SSW-Chestnut-Products-Spirit-Stain-Sample-Pack-Wood-Colours-/132076487345?hash=item1ec05f42b1:g:sdYAAOSwnHZYigOv

You get 12 small bottles of different coloured stains and I'm sure there are the colours you need amongst them. Each small bottle would easily do a whole guitar or bass, so you only need one pack.

You need to sand the body first - sometimes there is a coating of oil on kit bodies which might inhibit the stain soaking in, then apply the stain with a cloth. Experiment on the back with a very small wipe of each to see what they look like - then having chosen the best colours, just sand back down to wood again before the final staining.

Start with your best reddish stain, then at the edges move to the best browner option (Probably the mahogany or rosewood stains will probably the best - I think there are at least 3 mahogany shades in the pack)

Where the transition is, just go over the brownish stain with the reddish one to soften the transition. Same for the darker stain you might want to choose for the back.

Tip - the colour of the stain when it is still damp is the best indication of how it will look when you apply the final clear finish.

Hope this helps

Edited March 1, 2017 by Andyjr1515

[LowMoFo]

Hi guys,
Thanks loads for the replies.

The Greek: Yes I intend to do some reshaping, definitely. The horns, for example, need more contouring. If one were to cut the tips of the horns off, the resulting cross-section would look triangular, like a plectrum. I'm thinking of something more 'teardroppy' in the cut-outs.
The back of the body has a nice smooth curve to it already, but I do intend to slope a 'belly pocket' into it.
As for the horns, I hadn't considered shortening the lower one, but I do like the rake you have suggested on your diagram.
You now have my grey cells bubbling away...

Andy: Wasn't even aware that these sample sets existed. Now in my Ebay basket, so thanks loads for that, as well as the procedure tips.
Think I'm also gonna hunt down some scrap Ash upon which to make multiple mistakes...

Gentlemen, thank you for taking the time to reply, 'tis very, VERY much appreciated.

[Grangur]

Looking good. I like the body shape as it is. I wouldn't change the over all shape.

What I would spend time on is small refinements. Spend a lot of time just holding the body. Become familiar with it. Rub your hands all over it and use fine glasspaper to get it really, really smooth. Sand off and rough edges and knobbly bits. Get it so it feels seriously smooth and organic.

You might also like to watch the series done by Crimson Guitars where they take a kit and make it great.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EJzvQFWwO9w&list=PLp6z5fUMeeAZngXaTKxTKgHvM_pUxeH2z

[Harryburke14]

[quote name='Grangur' timestamp='1488397807' post='3248660']
Looking good. I like the body shape as it is. I wouldn't change the over all shape.

What I would spend time on is small refinements. Spend a lot of time just holding the body. Become familiar with it. Rub your hands all over it and use fine glasspaper to get it really, really smooth. Sand off and rough edges and knobbly bits. Get it so it feels seriously smooth and organic.

You might also like to watch the series done by Crimson Guitars where they take a kit and make it great.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EJzvQFWwO9w&list=PLp6z5fUMeeAZngXaTKxTKgHvM_pUxeH2z
[/quote]

Yeah watch that up until they install the ipad thing because "oooooh that guy from Muse has one in his guitar". It goes off course from that point on.

[LowMoFo]

Hey guys,
I've watched a few Crimson Guitars vids on YouTube, very interesting, although I hadn't yet stumbled across this particular series, so thanks very much!
I've found a few spots on it where curves need a little smoothing here and there (in addition to wanting to 'teardrop' the plectrum-profiled horns), and I must confess to spending quite some time 'molesting' the body, eyes shut, neck in place & body only. Gotta say I can kinda feel where it feels right, and where I want to tweak.
So I was looking at wet&dry earlier, and am wondering about grades. What do you guys recommend? Kinda thinking 320, 600 & 1200?

Gents, thanks for the advice, incl regarding the gimmick tail-off!

[Norris]

If your body is ash you'll find that the dark debris from wet and dry paper will stick in the pores of the wood. It even does it with finer grained wood such as maple. I've had very good results with 400 grit sterated aluminium oxide paper that I got from eBay. It's Silverline brand and came in a 5m roll. It's remarkably clog-free on non-oily woods. Part number 993057.

You'll probably want to use something like 120 grit for gentle shaping and then use the 400 for final finishing

Edited March 2, 2017 by Norris

[Norris]

If you're dyeing the wood you'll probably want to source a clear grain filler if you're intending a gloss lacquer finish. Dye, fill, then lacquer.

[Grangur]

[quote name='LowMoFo' timestamp='1488418932' post='3248838']
Hey guys,
I've watched a few Crimson Guitars vids on YouTube, very interesting, although I hadn't yet stumbled across this particular series, so thanks very much!
I've found a few spots on it where curves need a little smoothing here and there (in addition to wanting to 'teardrop' the plectrum-profiled horns), and I must confess to spending quite some time 'molesting' the body, eyes shut, neck in place & body only. Gotta say I can kinda feel where it feels right, and where I want to tweak.
So I was looking at wet&dry earlier, and am wondering about grades. What do you guys recommend? Kinda thinking 320, 600 & 1200?

Gents, thanks for the advice, incl regarding the gimmick tail-off!
[/quote]

Yes, that's the kind of thing. Closing your eyes does help. It might sound a bit kinky though, to those who've not been there and done it.

With respect to glasspaper. I use 80 grit for shaping then down to 250 and anything I can get my hands on that's finer to finish. At the moment I've got some nice 2500 grit. As Norris says, I'd steer clear of wet & dry. It's OK to use it dry, but wet is really for finishing a painted surface.

[Norris]

For finer grained wood such as maple you could try some 0000 grade wire wool but it snags too much on ash

[LowMoFo]

Hi guys, thanks for the tips. To be honest, I thought aluminium oxide [i]was[/i] wet & dry. Was only going to use it dry anyway, kinda wanting the only 'water' hitting it to be the staining. But I'm glad i asked now, thanks guys.
Have ordered the stain set recommended by Andy, now on a mission for Silverline.
Thanks again, all!

[LowMoFo]

Hi all,
Thought I'd update this post with a few pics:


Re-shaping the body to make the curves smoother
[attachment=240582:IMG_2064 copy.jpg]

I intend to re-shape the heel of the neck so it sits into the joint a little more smoothly too.
[attachment=240584:IMG_2063 copy.jpg]

Aaaaannnd so to colour...
[attachment=240585:IMG_0347 copy.jpg]

Three coats of Red Mahogany, one coat of Golden Oak. 400grit Aluminium Oxide, 1 coat of English Walnut.
So far...
[attachment=240586:IMG_0348 copy.jpg]

REALLY starting to enjoy this!
Cheers!

Edited March 22, 2017 by LowMoFo

[stearstree1304]

Very nice too - I like the way the body has taken to being stained. Looks lovely!!

[Andyjr1515]

Yes - looking very good

[LowMoFo]

Thanks guys!
Yeah, I have to agree, I'm very impressed with the way the wood has responded to the staining, so much so that I'm now wondering whether I should stick with the original idea to burst it, or whether to stick with stain, seal, clear-coat.
Andy, thanks loads for your recommendation of Chestnut stains, they're really effective, and really easy for a novice to use! Sir, you're a star!

Think I might make use of this glorious afternoon & break out some mid-oak next...

[Norris]

Very nice work

[bartelby]

The finish looks great. Looks like moiré patterns...

[LowMoFo]

Thanks guys,

Have hit a snag, and I'm hoping you guys can help. I've already posted this in Repairs & Technical, but thought I'd post it here too, so apologies for any unnecessary repetition.

Probably a daft question, but here goes.

Does anyone know of anyone who supplies short-threaded barrel-jacks?
Or even some genius who can shorten one by about 4mm??

I've bought a pcb-mounted pre-amp system, which fits into the cavity & pot holes perfectly, except that the barrel-jack supplied makes contact with the edge of the board.
The threaded cylinder is approx 34mm long. I found a 'short-threaded' jack online at Guitar Mania last night, but that cylinder is 33mm long. Not quite as short as I'd hoped...
Unfortunately, there is almost no space to dremel some clearance on the edge of the board, which means I have to either find a shorter barrel-jack, or shorten the existing one.
If that option is a non-starter, I have to find a pre-amp & pots on a loom, and have a redundant pre-amp board here.
I thought about a jack plate on the outside to act as a spacer, but it would need to be bulky, and would just make the jack mount ugly.

Praying that someone among all you legends can come up with an idea or two.

Edited March 17, 2017 by LowMoFo

[Norris]

Have you already drilled the jack entry hole, or could you move it up closer to the strap button? Failing that you might need to relocate the preamp board and use flying leads (with possibly another/extended cutout)

Photos would help

Edited March 17, 2017 by Norris

[LowMoFo]

Hi Norris,
I guess I should have uploaded a pic in the first place.
The jack port is pre-drilled unfortunately, hopefully this (dodgy, sorry) pic will illustrate the problem.[attachment=240992:IMG_2076.jpg]

Edited March 18, 2017 by LowMoFo

[samhay]

As you mentioned, you can get chassis mount type 1/4" jacks with short barrels, which can be mounted with a mounting plate like in a telecaster (some mounting hardware is quite discrete too - see below).
However, you still have to be able to accommodate the length of the jack when it is plugged in. The 1/4 jack is ~ 32mm long, which is why your barrel jack is 33-34 mm long, to hide the jack when it is plugged in.
In summary - whatever you try, the jack will hit the PCB when you plug it in!

http://www.stewmac.com/Hardware_and_Parts/Jack_Plates/Electrosocket_Jack_Mount.html

[Jabba_the_gut]

You could increase the hole diameter and use something like a Neutrik latching socket which are about 27mm long including pins.

http://www.neutrik.com/en/audio/plugs-and-jacks/locking-1-4-chassis-jacks/

[Jabba_the_gut]

Just looked a the drawing from that link an it reckons 29mm long. If you do need to use a drill to make a larger hole, fill in the old one with a wooden dowel first so the drill doesn't wander. If you do use one of these sockets with a bigger diameter hole, you could move the position by a few mm which may give you a little more room i.e. The new hole doesn't need to be centred over the old one so long as it includes the old one (if that makes sense).

[Andyjr1515]

Also - if you used a standard surface mounted jack/jackplate, this gives you a few more mm:



Generally, this gives you 6-7mm proud of the surface of the instrument so the jack will only project 26mm from the surface of the bass - that will fit won't it?

As long as you go for a Switchcraft jack, it will last a LOT longer than a barrel jack. Like stated above, the hole will need to be widened for the extra width of the jack itself.

I'm assuming you would need a 'stereo' version so that the power to your pre-amp is switched on and off by inserting the jack? [url="https://www.amazon.co.uk/Allparts-EP-0155-000-Switchcraft-Input-Stereo/dp/B000NZVWVI/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1489914248&sr=8-2&keywords=switchcraft+stereo+socket"]If so, it's one of these you need[/url]