Effects loops??

[chrisanthony1211]

Maybe I should have found out the answer to this question before now as I've playing for 20 years..
Anyway I've never quite worked out the purpose of an effects loop, I only use a few effects, and at the moment use the Tech 21 fly bass rig, however I have always just inserted effects into the signal path between bass guitar and amp, I've never used the effects loop, am I missing something? Does the effects loop have any advantages im unaware of?

[police squad]

A good fx loop is great for modulation fx such as chorus, delay, flanger. But not so good for fuzz fx.
However, the FX loop on my ampeg PF500 is rubbish. I have, for the first time since 1996, started to use a chorus and octave pedal (for Sledgehammer, owner of a lonely heart and a muse song) and it sounded muddy. So I just stuck them in the signal path and they don't seem to rob my normal sound (much). A small difference but not really worth worrying about.
When Victory amps bring put their bass amp, I have been assured that the FX loop will be fine. ( I play in 2 bands with Martin Kidd, the ex Cornford and now Victory designer)

[dmccombe7]

Aalways just use signal path. Not sure advantage of effects lop unless its rack mounted effects and can all be done in the rack kind of thing.
I'm def no expert in effects tho.

Dave

[pete.young]

Effects loops normally run at line level voltage and are intended for studio rack effects. This is a lot higher than the instrument level voltage that most pedals are designed for. Some pedals cope with this, others don't. Unless you know the pedal can handle line level voltage, the best place for it is in the signal chain.

The other thing you need to know is whether the loop is parallel or serial. Parallel gives you a blend, usually 50/50 , of clean and effected signal. This may not be what you want, for example if you are trying to compress the whole signal. Some amps can be switched from parallel to serial (Markbass LMII and III can), some can't.

[BigRedX]

Effects loops are most useful on amps with valves in the pre-amp, so that you can run the effects that sound best post-distortion in the appropriate place.

[arthurhenry]

I think of them as a way of keeping all the electronics together and the bass separate. They can be useful if you prefer to keep effects on top of the amp. It's really just another way of organising things.

[uk_lefty]

Glad someone asked. I hate having my cable length shortened by using fx loops! Never felt any benefit of them.

[Leonard Smalls]

I use my FX loop as a means of blending the sound of the bass with the sound of the FX.
And I'm about to try splitting that loop into 2 with a Palmer fx loop splitter so I can drive chains of FX cleanly, and also blend them with each other and the clean bass if needed. It's all an excuse for extra fiddling and twiddling!

[pete.young]

[quote name='BigRedX' timestamp='1489329238' post='3256052']
Effects loops are most useful on amps with valves in the pre-amp, so that you can run the effects that sound best post-distortion in the appropriate place.
[/quote]
All the built-in effects loops I've ever seen have the 'send' downstream of the pre-amp in the signal path, so any pre-amp distortion is going to go into the loop.

[BigRedX]

[quote name='pete.young' timestamp='1489395478' post='3256486']

All the built-in effects loops I've ever seen have the 'send' downstream of the pre-amp in the signal path, so any pre-amp distortion is going to go into the loop.
[/quote]

Exactly. You run the effects that need to go before the pre-amp drive in front of the amp and those that need to after in the effects loop.

[pete.young]

[quote name='BigRedX' timestamp='1489403365' post='3256556']
Exactly. You run the effects that need to go before the pre-amp drive in front of the amp and those that need to after in the effects loop.
[/quote]
Ah, I get it - looks like I failed reading comprehension 101 yet again :-)

[xgsjx]

[quote name='pete.young' timestamp='1489313658' post='3255874']
Effects loops normally run at line level voltage and are intended for studio rack effects. This is a lot higher than the instrument level voltage that most pedals are designed for. Some pedals cope with this, others don't. Unless you know the pedal can handle line level voltage, the best place for it is in the signal chain.
[/quote]

This. At least for SS amps.

If you're using rack fx, then use the loop. If you're using pedals, then don't use the loop. Some pedals are fine in the loop, but usually dirt & modulation don't work so well on the loop

Some amps have switchable fx loops to be pre/post EQ and series/parallel (Markbass are one).

[Guest bassman7755]

I think its mainly an inherited feature from guitar amps where it is very useful as guitarists tend to use distortion more and a lot of effects which are best applied after distortion e.g. time based effects like chorus/flange/phase, delay based effects and reverb.

[Naetharu]

[quote name='xgsjx' timestamp='1489412953' post='3256672']
If you're using rack fx, then use the loop. If you're using pedals, then don't use the loop. Some pedals are fine in the loop, but usually dirt & modulation don't work so well on the loop
[/quote]

I don't think that is quite right. The effects loop is just a way of putting pedals between the pre-amp and the power-amp stage. It's most important when you're getting some clipping/distortion from the pre-amp. The best way to think about it is to imagine your amp is actually two units.

The pre-amp is just like having a Sans Amp or other DI pre-amp pedal. And then you have the power amp section that gives you the grunt you need to push the speakers. By having an effects loop you separate these two parts and thereby allow yourself to place effects where you choose in the signal chain.

If you place modulation effects (chorus/phaser etc.) before the pre-amp you'll generally get a more radical effect, especially in cases where you have a distorted tone. This is the same as if you were going into a clean amp, and you used a modulation pedal before an overdrive pedal. The OD pedal exaggerates your modulation effects and gives you a very distinct and vibrant effect.

If you place the modulation effects in the effects loop section of the amp, you'll be running any gain sections first and then modulating which gives a subtler effect overall.

Which is right really just comes down to the sound you are looking for. The effects loop is just a means of allowing you to wire your signal chain as you choose, just as if you had purchased a separate pre-amp pedal and a power-amp unit. It's a good idea to try out different ways of doing it and see what gives you the sound you are after.

[xgsjx]

[quote name='Naetharu' timestamp='1489494958' post='3257369']
I don't think that is quite right. The effects loop is just a way of putting pedals between the pre-amp and the power-amp stage. It's most important when you're getting some clipping/distortion from the pre-amp. The best way to think about it is to imagine your amp is actually two units.

The pre-amp is just like having a Sans Amp or other DI pre-amp pedal. And then you have the power amp section that gives you the grunt you need to push the speakers. By having an effects loop you separate these two parts and thereby allow yourself to place effects where you choose in the signal chain.

If you place modulation effects (chorus/phaser etc.) before the pre-amp you'll generally get a more radical effect, especially in cases where you have a distorted tone. This is the same as if you were going into a clean amp, and you used a modulation pedal before an overdrive pedal. The OD pedal exaggerates your modulation effects and gives you a very distinct and vibrant effect.

If you place the modulation effects in the effects loop section of the amp, you'll be running any gain sections first and then modulating which gives a subtler effect overall.

Which is right really just comes down to the sound you are looking for. The effects loop is just a means of allowing you to wire your signal chain as you choose, just as if you had purchased a separate pre-amp pedal and a power-amp unit. It's a good idea to try out different ways of doing it and see what gives you the sound you are after.
[/quote]
From experience of the amps that I've used, I've never had it work how you describe. Though I do agree that amps can vary on how the loop works.
I've never gotten an auto wah pedal to get any response on a loop, but the best thing to do is try it (you could always put a boost pedal first in the line. If it works, good, if not, then try something else.