If you could only choose one octave pedal

[Al Krow]

[quote name='lee650' timestamp='1507234492' post='3384186']
wow Al you didn't keep that T65 long!! I absolutely love mine to bits (I even got rid of my beloved OC2 to get it-no regrets). What did you get in trade? I used to have an Aggie Octamiser and it had a fantastic tone,however I wasn't keen on its tracking. Id still have another though
[/quote]

You're right! That's simply 'cos I found that the COG [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]T16 that I already had was better [/font][/color][color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]for what I need - which is a clean octave down that sits well with the other effects, and I don't really need the additional functionality of the T65, including the effects loop, so I thought I might as well move that one on and keep the T16! (You'll have seen my A/B above). But then the guy I'd promised to sell the T16 a few days back came back to me and said he'd nearly cobbled all the cash together and I didn't have the heart to say I've changed my mind and had decided to keep it... [/font][/color]

[color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]Anyway I've swapped the T65 for something completely different - GisserD's Aggie Chorusaurus. All part of the educational journey, right? (And a LOT cheaper than renting - lol!) GD has also got a Mad Prof Snow White - Bass Wah just in, which I'm also really looking forward to hearing about![/font][/color]

[Al Krow]

[quote name='dannybuoy' timestamp='1507235287' post='3384198']
Just buy all the octavers, Al.
[/quote]

Hah! No point when you and Cam already have; just need to pick your brains and wait for you both to have one of your regular clear outs

In the meantime I need to hear back from Dood the Dude.

[Dood]

[quote name='Al Krow' timestamp='1507230244' post='3384141']
Ok, dear dood (btw we spell that "dude" in the UK), here's the thing: someone has decided to swap me another delicious dinosaur pedal for my COG T65 and as I'd previously listed my lovely COG T16 (in anticipation of getting the T65) I recklessly promised a struggling bass player in Reading, with no money, my COG T16 for a senslessly low price (I guess I was feeling particularly generous 'cos our East End London pub landlord, where my two bands get regular paid gigs, offerred us a £30 a gig pay rise without us even asking and told us that was the "new going rate" - bless him!) and Reading bassist is busily trying to cobble together the cash by selling some of his other pedals, so I kinda feel duty bound to keep my promise to him (always a good thing to do in life, right?). So...that means I could shortly be without any octave pedal!

Now Cameron would historically have said get an Aggie Octamizer, but that would be the FOURTH Aggie pedal on my board and I'd end up being regarded as some sort of inadvertent Aggie groupie, which I'm not. But Cam's swapped his Aggie O for his COG T16 (so he clearly agrees with me that they are the biz!). Dannybuoy would probably recommend a 3Leaf Octavbre mini (which are a snip at £225). However you seem to have reached octaver nirvana with the TC Sub'n'Up:
- an octave pedal that tracks down to a low E and below;
- with the right Dood toneprint sounds as warm as the best analogue;
- can blend in clean;
- has minimal latency;
- costs just £109 new for the full fat and £98 for the mini.

So you've got me tempted! 3 Qs (and apologies I think you recently answered these elsewhere)
1. Can I get the Dood toneprint to work on the mini (I assume "yes" otherwise you wouldn't have bought the mini)?
2. Is there any point getting the full fat version (I assume "no" otherwise you wouldn't have bought the mini)?
3. How the heck can I get hold of the Dood toneprint and get it uploaded onto my Sub'n'up? Is this something you can upload onto a USB and send to me (and I'd cover your costs, including something for your time effort and IP?)
[/quote]

Al, I love your posts!! I love a proper discussion and you deliver!

I've had a seriously long day today and hoped to reply properly earlier, but I'm ready to flake out. Just wanted to quickly post to say I will get back to you!

[CameronJ]

[quote name='dannybuoy' timestamp='1507235287' post='3384198']
Just buy all the octavers, Al.
[/quote]

[quote name='Al Krow' timestamp='1507235850' post='3384206']
Hah! No point when you and Cam already have
[/quote]

Sad but true

[Dood]

[quote name='Al Krow' timestamp='1507230244' post='3384141']
Ok, dear dood (btw we spell that "dude" in the UK), here's the thing: someone has decided to swap me another delicious dinosaur pedal for my COG T65 and as I'd previously listed my lovely COG T16 (in anticipation of getting the T65) I recklessly promised a struggling bass player in Reading, with no money, my COG T16 for a senslessly low price (I guess I was feeling particularly generous 'cos our East End London pub landlord, where my two bands get regular paid gigs, offerred us a £30 a gig pay rise without us even asking and told us that was the "new going rate" - bless him!) and Reading bassist is busily trying to cobble together the cash by selling some of his other pedals, so I kinda feel duty bound to keep my promise to him (always a good thing to do in life, right?). So...that means I could shortly be without any octave pedal!

Now Cameron would historically have said get an Aggie Octamizer, but that would be the FOURTH Aggie pedal on my board and I'd end up being regarded as some sort of inadvertent Aggie groupie, which I'm not. But Cam's swapped his Aggie O for his COG T16 (so he clearly agrees with me that they are the biz!). Dannybuoy would probably recommend a 3Leaf Octavbre mini (which are a snip at £225). However you seem to have reached octaver nirvana with the TC Sub'n'Up:
- an octave pedal that tracks down to a low E and below;
- with the right Dood toneprint sounds as warm as the best analogue;
- can blend in clean;
- has minimal latency;
- costs just £109 new for the full fat and £98 for the mini.

So you've got me tempted! 3 Qs (and apologies I think you recently answered these elsewhere)
1. Can I get the Dood toneprint to work on the mini (I assume "yes" otherwise you wouldn't have bought the mini)?
2. Is there any point getting the full fat version (I assume "no" otherwise you wouldn't have bought the mini)?
3. How the heck can I get hold of the Dood toneprint and get it uploaded onto my Sub'n'up? Is this something you can upload onto a USB and send to me (and I'd cover your costs, including something for your time effort and IP?)
[/quote]

1. Sadly it's not possible to share ToePrints with other users, something I would love to see be integrated in to the app at some point. However, by a long drawn out process of screen prints it'd possibly be able to copy what a person has made for themselves.
2. Ah actually yes! The full fat has a switch that allows you to flip between one of two built in programs and your custom Tone Print. There's also an extra knob for the -2 Octave filter, which of course can be reassigned to whatever you want in the TonePrint app. I just needed to go small!
3. All of the settings, except those for the 4th knob are shared between the Full-Fat and the Mini, but again, see 1. for how sharing is a problem right now!
4. I've also discovered that if there's an IT..ehem.. 'mistake', all of those settings get lost. Yup, your custom presets can't be restored from the app if they aren't there and there's no way to extract the tone print from the pedal. (See the TonePrint thread currently open)

I will be working on rebuilding the TonePrint as I kinda know what it was. I could probably improve it at the same time.. along with the HyperGravity preset I made too. Live and learn, live and learn...

[Al Krow]

[quote name='dood' timestamp='1507486851' post='3385816']
1. Sadly it's not possible to share ToePrints with other users, something I would love to see be integrated in to the app at some point. However, by a long drawn out process of screen prints it'd possibly be able to copy what a person has made for themselves.
2. Ah actually yes! The full fat has a switch that allows you to flip between one of two built in programs and your custom Tone Print. There's also an extra knob for the -2 Octave filter, which of course can be reassigned to whatever you want in the TonePrint app. I just needed to go small!
3. All of the settings, except those for the 4th knob are shared between the Full-Fat and the Mini, but again, see 1. for how sharing is a problem right now!
4. I've also discovered that if there's an IT..ehem.. 'mistake', all of those settings get lost. Yup, your custom presets can't be restored from the app if they aren't there and there's no way to extract the tone print from the pedal. (See the TonePrint thread currently open)

I will be working on rebuilding the TonePrint as I kinda know what it was. I could probably improve it at the same time.. along with the HyperGravity preset I made too. Live and learn, live and learn...
[/quote]

1. That's a real shame TPs can't be shared. The Dood the Dude TonePrint that turns a bland characterless (but amazingly good at tracking low) digital device into the usurper of analogue originality and would be a big factor in me braving the world of computer interfaces, for the sake of optimising just one pedal, which I could usually do so much more easily with the quick turn of analogue dials.
2 and 3. Ok sounds like the extra £11 for the full fat is worth the money. But sadly I only have space for the mini (and then only if it is literally as small as a COG T16).
4.Ooooh no!! That is very frustrating for you that the TonePrints settings are getting lost. And seems like it's not possible for bespoke created TonePrints versions such as yours to be backed up on a computer, otherwise I am sure you would have done?

Fyi - possibly even a bigger loss to humanity if the original Dood the Dude SnU TonePrint has been lost to bass players for all eternity and all we will be left with are approximations to the original magic, even if the author says they are as good or better, how can we ever know the veracity of such assertions? Maybe something for you to consider reporting to the intergalactic bass players federation (although if this loss is made known to TalkBass, that's pretty much the same thing right)?

I did hear word of the IT glitch on the SnU's before (maybe even earlier on in this thread), but I had been led to believe it was a (i) power supply issue and (ii) had been fixed. Seems not.

Ok four (sadly) good reasons for sticking with the COG T16 for now...

Edited October 8, 2017 by Al Krow

[Dood]

[quote name='Al Krow' timestamp='1507488223' post='3385829']

4.Ooooh no!! That is very frustrating for you that the TonePrints settings are getting lost. And seems like it's not possible for bespoke created TonePrints versions such as yours to be backed up on a computer, otherwise I am sure you would have done?

Fyi - possibly even a bigger loss to humanity if the original Dood the Dude SnU TonePrint has been lost to bass players for all eternity and all we will be left with are approximations to the original magic, even if the author says they are as good or better, how can we ever know the veracity of such assertions? Maybe something for you to consider reporting to the intergalactic bass players federation (although if this loss is made known to TalkBass, that's pretty much the same thing right)?

I did hear word of the IT glitch on the SnU's before (maybe even earlier on in this thread), but I had been led to believe it was a (i) power supply issue and (ii) had been fixed. Seems not.

Ok four (sadly) good reasons for sticking with the COG T16 for now...
[/quote]

Stupidity on my part, I've upgraded my iPad and made sure I had everything I needed before wiping the old one and passed it on. Neeaarrrrrly everything. The only way of getting them back I suppose would be to restore from backup the original iPad and then copy the settings (by screen print it seems) as users settings have no 'cloud' to be saved to. I guess I found another limitation in the app, the hard way. The good news is that creating a new TonePrint isn't going to be that hard I don't think, if you'd seen what is available in the application. It's not like trying to re-write Lord Of The Rings word for word from memory.

[CameronJ]

Had a little gig at the theatre I've been working at for the past 7 months and the had gone right back onto the board. I just have far more confidence in it when dealing with a busy mix!

[Al Krow]

[quote name='CameronJ' timestamp='1507504160' post='3385971']
Had a little gig at the theatre I've been working at for the past 7 months and the [color=#ff0000][b][??][/b][/color] had gone right back onto the board. I just have far more confidence in it when dealing with a busy mix!
[/quote]

I'm guessing that wasn't your[color=#ff0000][b] ["current collection of 5 different envelope filters"][/b][/color] but probably a polite product made by Aguilar?

[CameronJ]

[quote name='Al Krow' timestamp='1507505150' post='3385973']


I'm guessing that wasn't your[color=#ff0000][b] ["current collection of 5 different envelope filters"][/b][/color] but probably a polite product made by Aguilar?
[/quote]

Ha! I may or may not have been mildly drunk when writing that. Aguilar octamizer is the name missing from that post!

[Owen]

Octave bods! I am just wondering which pedal gives the best sound for a standalone bass sound if I were to use a guitar and a 2 octave down all wet/no dry setting. I am not looking to replace my basses, just thinking of potential different flavours.

Edited October 9, 2017 by owen

[dannybuoy]

If you are after trying to get the most realistic bass guitar sound out of a guitar with flawless tracking, I say Digitech Whammy V. Also the Whammy Ricochet as it's smaller, but I feel it has slightly more latency than its bigger brother (I have both and AB'd them recently!).

[Al Krow]

DB is more than likely going to be spot on with his recommendation, Owen, given his extensive knowledge of all matters pedal!

For my tuppence worth, I'd suggest you focus exclusively on digital rather than analogue so that you have the ability to do polyphonic tracking of chords.

I'm guessing Dood the Dude will be along soon to recommend a TC SubnUp, which I suspect will also tick a lot of the boxes you're looking for.

Edited October 9, 2017 by Al Krow

[Owen]

I dunno if I want to pretend to be a bass guitar. In reality I have not thought it through so am open to suggestions

[dannybuoy]

The Sub'n'Up is a good shout also, one of the few that do two octaves down.

[CameronJ]

As has been mentioned, whether you'd like the pedal to track chords or not will have a big impact on what you should go for.

[Quatschmacher]

Holy cow, the Octo-Nøjs is fantastic. I went to my local shop to check one out and ended up getting it (I almost had to fight the bass guy in the shop for it after he heard me playing it).

Cameron, you’ll prove the ruin of me! :-)

[Quatschmacher]

“If you could choose only one octave pedal… you wouldn’t be in the precarious financial situation you’re currently in.”

[Al Krow]

[quote name='CameronJ' timestamp='1505476938' post='3372207']
I reckon the Okto Nøjs is my most frequently stomped pedal at the moment. Both of its circuits are just fantastic. But please, nobody else buy one. I'm the only one on Basschat with these toanz right now
[/quote]

[quote name='Quatschmacher' timestamp='1507999375' post='3389273']
Holy cow, the Octo-Nøjs is fantastic. I went to my local shop to check one out and ended up getting it (I almost had to fight the bass guy in the shop for it after he heard me playing it).
Cameron, you'll prove the ruin of me! :-)
[/quote]

He's already proved my ruin!

Have you bought it? It does look REALLY good! (See [url="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AIM8YoC_fLE"]YouTube clip[/url])

Analogue - warmth and minimal latency
No faffing with TonePrints that then get erased due to software glitches
Two separate pedals:
Okto - Tracks down to the open E (!!) [[color=#0000cd]UPDATE - it apparently doesn't manage to come close to this][/color]
[color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]Nøjs - octave / fuzz / synth - large tonal palette![/font][/color]
[color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]£165 - broadly same price as a COG T65 and a fair bit less than the Aggie Octamizer and 3Leaf Octavbre [/font][/color]

[color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]My only question is can the [/font][/color][color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]Nøjs be dialled right down to nil to eliminate any grit so that it's possible to get a really clean octave down if needed? [/font][/color]

[color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]I can get this on my COG T16, which doesn't have a separate dirt, and I find consequently sits better with my other pedals in the chain. But as we've found, between us with other pedals that combine dirt with a main effect, it can be difficult to dial the dirt down to nil to get a fully clean main effect (be the main effect octave or synth wah or whatever).[/font][/color]

[color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]If it can get a fully clean octave down, then I'm struggling to think of a good reason not to trade up to this from my T16 - cheers both!...[i]Tracks down to an open E, and it's analogue, really!?? [/i][/font][/color]

Edited October 14, 2017 by Al Krow

[CameronJ]

The Okto and the Nøjs are separate circuits, so just stomp whichever side you want to hear. Or stack them, up to you. One thing I discovered when I tried running other octavers into the soloed Nøjs was that the actual "Nøjs" knob adds in another low octave circuit, so in order to stack a separate octaver before it you have to turn the Nøjs knob right down and use the rest of the controls on the dirt side of the circuit to get clean dirt...if that makes sense to anyone??

Edited October 14, 2017 by CameronJ

[CameronJ]

My secret plan to assimilate all bass players to the dark side of octavers is slowly coming to fruition

[Al Krow]

[quote name='CameronJ' timestamp='1508003035' post='3389300']
The Okto and the Nøjs are separate circuits, so just stomp whichever side you want to hear. Or stack them, up to you. One thing I discovered when I tried running other octavers into the soloed Nøjs was that the actual "Nøjs" knob adds in another low octave circuit, so in order to stack a separate octaver before it you have to turn the Nøjs knob right down and use the rest of the controls on the dirt side of the circuit to get clean dirt...if that makes sense to anyone??
[/quote]

You're completely on point - just noticed that both stomp pedals state they are "true bypass".

I've managed to get 2/3 of my pedals second hand, but given that you and Quatschmacher are the only two owners of this pedal in the UK and are such big fans, not looking likely that a second hand one of these is going to come up any time soon! (Unless dannybuoy buys one and then sells up within 6 weeks) Gear4Music have in stock (they're just a few £more than Andertons' list price) and also offer a 30 day return (in case it doesn't track down to that low E!).

So, Cam, how come the Aggie Octamizer is still on your board when you've got this also? The tracking on that doesn't seem on paper to be as good as the [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]Octo-Nøjs - [/font][/color]which is what I'd expect given that the Aggie has been around for the best part of a decade and the [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]Octo-Nøjs is much newer tech?[/font][/color]

Edited October 14, 2017 by Al Krow

[Quatschmacher]

Al, yes I bought it. I did say as much in my post but worded it oddly.

Yes, as Cameron says, you can turn off the dirt. And have a clean octave.

I didn’t have the instruction manual when playing it in the shop so it took a while to figure out what the knobs were for. I was turning a couple that seemed to have no effect until I realised what was going on. The Nøjs side of the pedal has two subsections: the “Nøjs” knob is a dirty sub octave which has a “colour” (tone/filter) knob with it. The “Level” knob is the level of the normal octave synth tone which has a gain and a tone knob with it. The Octo side of the pedal has a knob for the sub and a filter/tone for the sub. It can also get growly with the tone turned up and quite fat with it rolled off (though not quite Octamizer fat). The dry knob puts the clean signal equally into both sides of the pedal. 

It sounds really cool with the right side engaged, the Nøjs rolled off and the gain really low on the normal synth tone. There are so many great sounds on this pedal. And stick it in front of an envelope filter (I tested it with the Discumbobulator which I’ll talk about in the big filter thread) and it sounds even cooler.

As Cameron knows, I’ve recently fallen for the 3 Leaf Doom. It sounds really synthy with the gain on low. I feel it loses its synthiness somewhat when the gain is really high and becomes a little bit more like a “normal” fuzz whereas the fuzz on the Octo-Nøjs retains its synth quality throughout the whole gain range.

As regards tracking low notes with the sub engaged, it’s on a par with the Octamizer. Lower than B on the E string and you start to get some glitching. (The MXR still beats this comfortably in this regard. I can get to low F# before I get glitching.)

I’m not sure how long it’ll take to find a used one of these. Darren at FX pedal rentals stocks these and they are a few quid cheaper than what I paid for this. I didn’t mind paying a little extra as I really wanted to support my local shop; I’ve spent several hours in there recently and the staff are great, lovely, friendly people and don’t pressure you at all. I really wanted to give them my money.

One thing about the Octo-Nøjs that’s annoying is that the jack sockets are slightly narrower than all my other pedals (metric as opposed to imperial measurements, I suspect) and one of my Planet Waves cables won’t fit in at all!

Edited May 17, 2018 by Quatschmacher

[Quatschmacher]

Bear in mind that today is the first time I’ve tried this pedal with a bass (I had a fiddle with one last weekend via a synth). I need to spend more time with it. Cameron has had one for a while so is probably more knowledgeable about how it behaves in real life.

[Al Krow]

[quote name='Quatschmacher' timestamp='1508006857' post='3389321']
Al, yes I bought it. I did say as much in my post but worded it oddly. Yes, as Cameron says, you can turn off the dirt. And have a clean octave. As regards tracking low notes with the sub engaged, it's on a par with the Octamizer. Lower than B on the E string and you start to get some glitching. (The MXR still beats this comfortably in this regard. I can get to low F# before I get glitching.)
[/quote]

Thanks for that - and btw you didn't word your comments above oddly at all; I just read over it too quickly and missed what you'd said! So congratulations on the new purchase!

Really helpful initial feedback - thanks.

A shame about the tracking low. On the [url="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AIM8YoC_fLE"]YouTube clip[/url] at 2.15 it makes the claim that it can track down with the octave to the open E on the bass, but you're saying it clearly cannot do that and I'd rather take your word for it! Although I appreciate the [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]Octo-Nøjs is [/font][/color]offering a whole lot else, having an analogue pedal that could track all the way down to low E would be a key reason for me getting it. So looks like my credit card isn't going to be required just yet! (And I also don't need to think about where on earth I was going to find space for this on my "Hong Kong density" pedal board instead of my tiny T16! - I was thinking of maybe moving my Smooth Hound underneath, does any one else do that?)

Looking like I'm still a COG man for now...