The Yamaha BB mega-thread

[Al Krow]

16 minutes ago, hypercarrots said:

what's wrong with a 35 year old bass?

Maybe just my misplaced nervousness that with time both guitars and basses (unlike e.g. violins and cellos and @CameronJ with due respect there is no comparison between a double bass and an electric bass in their construction) have a greater propensity of deteriorating, in particular:

- necks can warp / twist;

- the electrics become worn and replacement parts become difficult to source.

Obviously they become road worn with use, but that's largely just cosmetic.

Am I just being too cautious?

Edited September 4, 2018 by Al Krow

[hypercarrots]

4 minutes ago, Al Krow said:

Maybe just my misplaced nervousness that with time both guitars and basses (unlike e.g. violins and cellos and @CameronJ with due respect there is no comparison between a double bass and an electric bass in their construction) have a greater propensity of deteriorating, in particular:

- necks can warp / twist;

- the electrics become worn and replacement parts become difficult to source.

Obviously they become road worn with use, but that's largely just cosmetic.

Am I just being too cautious?

are you able to play it before buying?

[Al Krow]

Just now, hypercarrots said:

are you able to play it before buying?

That's definitely the best approach I agree. The guy unfortunately is based 250 miles away.

A cautionary tale for me was one of my BC buddies who bought a circa 10 year old Warwick Streamer, which looked great in the pics, but found a host of probs with its condition (he'd not had a chance to try before buying) post purchase. He realised the only way he could have spotted the issues with the rod / neck warping is if had loosened all the strings to see how the neck was without the string tension being applied. Not sure how many sellers would be keen to allow you to do that (or indeed whether I would be able to easily spot neck warping unless it was very obvious, without the assistance of someone more expert). 

[Al Krow]

Update: the seller of the BB1200S wanted nearly £1k posted and for me to also sort out the courier ('cos he clearly couldn't be derrière*d) and wasn't willing to move on price. All of which helpfully deflated my GAS - so perhaps I should be grateful to him  

No takers from anyone else either at that price and the bass ended up unsold...

Edited September 5, 2018 by Al Krow

[hookys6stringbass]

22 hours ago, Al Krow said:

That's very helpful, thanks. Just checked @hypercarrots earlier post and you mentioned that the BB1200S were 82 to 85, the one that has come up FS is an 83 model. I'll definitely be departing from my comfort zone in getting a bass that's 35 years old if I go for this (all my basses are all currently < 5 years old)  

I'm presuming that all the 1200S were MIJ basses?

How would you say your 1200S stacks up against more modern BB's - I guess that's a tricky question given that that e.g. the BB 1024 has a P/J configuration and is purely passive whereas the 1200S is both active and passive but just has a (reverse) P? 

I have the BB 734a...

It's a great bass in its own right... I try not to compare it to the 1200s as I'll find faults in the 734a... ie no reverse pup... body shape... 

It's in the 1200s ball park...  

I think the Hooky signature will be closer still...fingers crossed...

The BB 1200 is a great bass ...keep you're out for one of those...

I have two of those ...

[Al Krow]

26 minutes ago, hookys6stringbass said:

I have the BB 734a...

It's a great bass in its own right... I try not to compare it to the 1200s as I'll find faults in the 734a... ie no reverse pup... body shape... 

It's in the 1200s ball park...  

I think the Hooky signature will be closer still...fingers crossed...

The BB 1200 is a great bass ...keep you're out for one of those...

I have two of those ...

So if you had to choose between a 1200 and 1200S which would it be? 

And I noted that the 734a is nearly there but doesn't quite match up to its illustrious forbear the 1200S

The guy selling the 1200S described it as both active and passive - is that correct? 

Edited September 5, 2018 by Al Krow

[hookys6stringbass]

9 minutes ago, Al Krow said:

So if you had to choose between a 1200 and 1200S which would it be? 

And I noted that the 734a is nearly there but doesn't quite match up to its illustrious forbear the 1200S

The guy selling the 1200S described it as both active and passive - is that correct? 

Yes that's right it's active and passive...

If I had to choose it would be the 1200s

[hypercarrots]

Just get a BB300 and call it a day. 

[Al Krow]

4 hours ago, hypercarrots said:

Just get a BB300 and call it a day. 

Nah - better still, is to be content with the BB425, 1025 and NE2 that I already have

You'll appreciate that a BB1200S does have a 'lure' being BB royalty but I'm not sure I'd get too much 'more' from any of the other older (4 string) range. Particularly as today's BB734a seems to get pretty close to its legendary forbear. 

[2elliot]

The 734a has been used live by Hooky and Jack for quite some time... the feed back was that it sounded right. I believe the previous attempt from Yamaha at recreating the 1200s was shot down in flames by Peter Hook. 

Obviously Hooky now has a very special custom job but Jack and the current bass player with Peter Hook and  the Light still use the 734a. They do have an awesome sound, I only wish the neck was 38mm. I've owned mine for a year, gigged loads and recorded an album with it but I feel it'll next on the block. I've had several Yamaha basses in the last few year and this one is bar far the most versatile. 

 

 

[hypercarrots]

the bb300 sounds more like classic new order than the 734a. peter hooks sound has evolved. 

[2elliot]

BB300 is a nice bass, it's simple and it produces a great sound. As Peter Hook used passive Yamaha basses previous to the 1220s it will sound similar. Yamaha have recently released a couple of short videos with Hooky on Youtube, he talks about them in the interview.

The BB300 is a bargain of a bass, big old beast though.

 

[hookys6stringbass]

6 minutes ago, 2elliot said:

BB300 is a nice bass, it's simple and it produces a great sound. As Peter Hook used passive Yamaha basses previous to the 1220s it will sound similar. Yamaha have recently released a couple of short videos with Hooky on Youtube, he talks about them in the interview.

The BB300 is a bargain of a bass, big old beast though.

 

+1 re the BB300... fantastic bass...

I wish Yamaha had corrected Hooky on the dates though... he was off his tits most of the 80s so it's not  surprising he got the dates wrong...

[hypercarrots]

7 hours ago, 2elliot said:

BB300 is a nice bass, it's simple and it produces a great sound. As Peter Hook used passive Yamaha basses previous to the 1220s it will sound similar. Yamaha have recently released a couple of short videos with Hooky on Youtube, he talks about them in the interview.

The BB300 is a bargain of a bass, big old beast though.

 

the bb1200 sounds much closer to a bb1200s than a bb300 but they are all similar. the 734a sounds quite different. i'm only basing this on playing 3 bb300, a bb450 (doesn't sound like the others at all), a bbVI (this sounds similar to a bb300), 3 bb1200, 4 bb1200s and 2 734a though. a wider sampling may prove otherwise...

[BassApprentice]

31 minutes ago, hypercarrots said:

a wider sampling may prove otherwise...

😂😂😂😂

[Al Krow]

A history lesson?

I think we're mostly agreed that of the pre 2000 Yammy basses the BB1200S was very probably where Yamaha "peaked"?

But it seems a slightly strange thought that the "spiritual" successor to the BB1200S may not actually be a Yamaha bass!

The key features of the BB1200S that jump out at me, that were its "USPs" were:

- neck through

- reverse P pups

- active and passive

- 3 band EQ 

There's nothing in the current line up that ticks the boxes with the BB734A coming closest, but it isn't neck through and is a P/J rather than reverse-P. 

The modern Warwick Streamer Stage 1 - German "Teambuilt" version (rather than the ridiculously expensive "Masterbuilt") or its US 'forerunner' the Spector NS2, both tick all the boxes other than having a 2 band EQ

...hmmm the Spector first came out in 1977 which predates the BB1200S. Maybe it was Yamaha (and Warwick) that cottoned to a good thing when they saw it, rather than the other way around?!

[pete.young]

3 hours ago, Al Krow said:

A history lesson?

I think we're mostly agreed that of the pre 2000 Yammy basses the BB1200S was very probably where Yamaha "peaked"?

 

I don't agree - the TRB5P and TRB4P from the early nineties were better and more versatile instruments imo.

[2elliot]

Don't get hung up on the through neck. I own a Streamer Stage 1,  it's nothing like any Yamaha I've owned.  Not in feel, sound or playability. Same with the Spector it sounds and feels like a Spector.  

All great, all different. 

BB3000 or BB1200s that's the fight. The quality of the early Japanese Yamaha basses is remarkable. 

[Al Krow]

19 minutes ago, 2elliot said:

Don't get hung up on the through neck. I own a Streamer Stage 1,  it's nothing like any Yamaha I've owned.  Not in feel, sound or playability. Same with the Spector it sounds and feels like a Spector.  

All great, all different. 

BB3000 or BB1200s that's the fight. The quality of the early Japanese Yamaha basses is remarkable. 

But the "nothing like" is mostly down to the choice of pups and on board preamp, right? 

The Warwick was pretty much a clone of the Spector and ended up paying a fine, having been sued by Spector. So I'm not sure where the big "difference" between those two brands that you mention lies (pups and preamps again?). Similarly Sandberg being a rip off of Fender. 

I guess where I'm heading is what was the USP of the BB1200S if it's not what I listed above?

26 minutes ago, pete.young said:

I don't agree - the TRB5P and TRB4P from the early nineties were better and more versatile instruments imo.

Yup they really are wonderful basses. 

So what spooked Yamaha?

Fender never stopped making P basses; why did Yamaha end up effectively going "backwards" after making a great range of basses in the 1980s and 1990s before more recently finding its confidence again? 

Edited September 9, 2018 by Al Krow

[hypercarrots]

 

13 hours ago, Al Krow said:

A history lesson?

I think we're mostly agreed that of the pre 2000 Yammy basses the BB1200S was very probably where Yamaha "peaked"?

But it seems a slightly strange thought that the "spiritual" successor to the BB1200S may not actually be a Yamaha bass!

The key features of the BB1200S that jump out at me, that were its "USPs" were:

- neck through

- reverse P pups

- active and passive

- 3 band EQ 

There's nothing in the current line up that ticks the boxes with the BB734A coming closest, but it isn't neck through and is a P/J rather than reverse-P. 

The modern Warwick Streamer Stage 1 - German "Teambuilt" version (rather than the ridiculously expensive "Masterbuilt") or its US 'forerunner' the Spector NS2, both tick all the boxes other than having a 2 band EQ

...hmmm the Spector first came out in 1977 which predates the BB1200S. Maybe it was Yamaha (and Warwick) that cottoned to a good thing when they saw it, rather than the other way around?!

How many of these have you played?

Edited September 10, 2018 by hypercarrots

[Al Krow]

32 minutes ago, hypercarrots said:

How many of these have you played?

A very fair challenge. I've not got my hands on a BB1200S, so the comparison to the 734A (which I have played) is entirely based on @hookys6stringbass's comments who has both in his arsenal. I'm also pretty familiar with Warwicks including the SS1. 

[Al Krow]

6 hours ago, Muzz said:

...For the record, I loved the BB2024 I played for a while one afternoon at Bass Direct, and might have bought it were it not £2.5k...

 

Hey - taking the liberty of pulling you over to the BB thread given your earlier comment above. Have you seen the used BB2024 in the FS section?

And @M@23, who has recently got a new BB P35, would likely recommend checking out a BB P34 too; as the successor to the BB2024 they're priced a LOT more competitively.

 

[Muzz]

Yeah, the 2024 (and 1024) were both drastically reduced towards the end of their run (the 2024 could be had for £1600 and as low as £650 for a 1024) which kinda left the S/H values at little at sea.

Is the P34 comparable with the 2024 or the 1024?

[Al Krow]

1 hour ago, Muzz said:

Yeah, the 2024 (and 1024) were both drastically reduced towards the end of their run (the 2024 could be had for £1600 and as low as £650 for a 1024) which kinda left the S/H values at little at sea.

Is the P34 comparable with the 2024 or the 1024?

The P34 is the replacement for the 2024

It is their current flagship MIJ passive. 

Edited September 23, 2018 by Al Krow

[Al Krow]

Took the plunge with a 5er for the first time tonight for a full 2 x 1 hour live set.

@M@23 - I finally get what you've been going on about! Yammy BB bass, in my case the BB1025 which I had on P/J setting, + Markbass rig with a full band, just totally worked! Less aggressive than my Ibby SR Premium for sure, but I definitely was loving the sound tonight, in fact much more than I was expecting to, because I generally do like more 'aggressive' pups such as the Nord big singles on the Ibby.  And the sound that was bringing a grin to my face was also given the thumbs up by both our drummer and mates in the audience.

My Markbass combo is currently in the FS 'cos I felt I couldn't justify having three bass rigs. But after tonight I'm definitely not feeling anything like as strongly about wanting to see it gone!

Edited October 14, 2018 by Al Krow