That warm valve amp sound?

[chrismuzz]

Compression and/or overdrive will get you pretty close I use a regular sansamp so the Vintage would be my personal preference of the two you've mentioned.

Edited April 8, 2017 by chrismuzz

[Al Krow]

Firstly thanks guys for the additional feedback.

Interesting that JimBob has already returned his Two Notes and I must admit having to carry around a bulky (and relatively expensive) pedal and power supply unit doesn't appeal when something more compact sounds like it will get me 90% of the way there, particularly when nobody is going to notice the remaining 10% in a live performance, right?!

Hmmm...so in terms of the less bulky / less hassle solid state options, based on your feedback so far, it seems like the ones I really need to try out are:

Sansamp VT bass (v2)
Xotic BB
Darkglass VMT

Am I missing anything marvellous /obvious?

Anyone know which is the best store in central London for bass pedals and likely to stock all three for A/B purposes? Or have any of you guys already A/B'd all three and can make a recommendation?

Edited April 8, 2017 by Al Krow

[chrismuzz]

In all honesty mate, I would buy all three second hand and A/B/C them. I actually use two sometimes three "gain" pedals (plus a compressor) stacked to get my tone

[dannybuoy]

There are a ton of candidates out there - check out some guitar pedals like the Mojomojo and Cinders by TC Electronic, OD Glove and Operation Overlord by EHX, American Sound and Orange Juice by Joyo...

Basically if you're going into a store, try everything!

[Al Krow]

I love the enthusiasm DB! And the buy everything approach CM!

So if I have got the advice straight from you both I can perhaps boil it down to "buy everything and try everything", right?! (Lol!)

Now I was kinda hoping that we could narrow the list of options down to the best 2 or 3 in terms of sound, build quality and value for money (whilst not looking for bargain basement - I know that if you pay peanuts you don't end up with the Beatles) based on your prior experience and wisdom...does my shortlist above seem about right on that score?

Edited April 8, 2017 by Al Krow

[Al Krow]

The great thing about multi fx is that they allow you to get a flavour of the "real thing" before committing to a purchase and the Zoom B3n has several quite good drive emulators. The Xotic BB emulation was too close to the distorted end for what I am looking for here, but the Darkglass B7K emulator, particularly with scooped lower mids and a touch of added reverb edited into the patch, was not far off the sound I have been looking for. I guess I need now to get my hands on the real thing!

[Bobthedog]

I have just bought an EBS Valvedrive DI. It makes a world of difference to my Glock / BT ll sound. I bought it because it is really easy to use. My only currrent downside is it size.

I have yet to try it with my Markbass but then the sound of that is already quite warm.

[Al Krow]

Congrats. It is quite a beast in terms of size you're right! But it's an actual valve pedal rather than a solid state emulator, so on the other hand it's the "real thing"! Are you having to run it at 240V? Were there any other pedals on your shortlist - if so which ones did you A/B?

I'm kinda surprised that your Markbass is "warm" - what settings do you normally have it on? I'd describe mine as pretty "transparent" although dialling up the VPF helps "warm" it up a bit.

[Dood]

I'm going to go out on a limb and be controversial. If I am recording or playing and want to create a warm valve sound, yes I might use a bit of drive to give it bite, but generally it's not the amp I go searching for. It's always a really good cabinet simulation that I can tweak. For example, in a signal chain, sometimes there isn't even an 'amp' in it. It's really amazing what you can do running a pair of cabinet IRs in parallel with each other with some DI mixed in. Ok, so that can be outside the limitations of some pedals, but it does work. A REALLY cheap solution I use sometimes is a DI pedal with a built in 'cab sim' on it. Nothing fancy, it's just a peaky EQ circuit, but it works so well with drive pedals.

Hopefully this will help, but I appreciate it's not a solution for everyone.

[Al Krow]

Hey Dood that sounds kinda interesting. And churlish to ignore someone who has managed 8,338,607 posts Any chance of you uploading the output from your suggestion with a clean comparison? That would be marvellous.

[Al Krow]

Hah - I guess it might be helpful if I tried to articulate what "that warm valve sound is". Well it's heard loud and clear in Krist Novoselic's playing on "Smells Like Teen Spirit" about 17 seconds into the track! Completely gorgeous, right?!

[Al Krow]

Ok, I think I'm there! Also had some very helpful input on another thread http://basschat.co.uk/topic/305458-tech-21-vt-bass-di-sansamp-bddi-pddi-and-ampeg-scr-di-your-views-please/ In particular, this one from Lozz:

[quote name='Lozz196' timestamp='1494536050' post='3296879']
...Re the Para Driver, I have both v1 & v2 and if the Rumble and Air Filters are left alone the two are almost identical (the mids go higher on v1, but only to the same freq as the treble). What sold me on it was this youtube clip, at 1:58 where the SVT style setting is demoed.

[url="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WByH0uiVnI4"]https://www.youtube....h?v=WByH0uiVnI4[/url]
[/quote]

Conclusion: that's exactly the "warm valve amp" sound I was looking for! Lozz likes these pedals so much he has TWO and won't part with his spare (I've asked him!) so I've taken the plunge and put a deposit down with GuitarGuitar for one of these pedals as soon as they come back into stock. I'm now looking forward to fooling my Markbass AC combo into thinking it's an Ampeg SVT paired with a 8 x 10 cab from time to time...

[Ruck]

I just took a chance on the VT Bass Deluxe. At first I utterly hated it. But after a whole day of dialling it in and altering my signal chain to optimise the pedal's input signal and output, I cant quite believe how close the effect comes to sounding like my SVT II Pro. (Im running the VT Bass direct into a poweramp). Now I have clean Ampeg valve tone with tonnes of headroom, which was my aim. Astonished customer here! Cheers Tech 21! As previously mentioned on this thread, the speaker sim plays a giant part in getting that sound.

[Al Krow]

[quote name='Ruck' timestamp='1497208073' post='3316570']
I just took a chance on the VT Bass Deluxe. At first I utterly hated it. But after a whole day of dialling it in and altering my signal chain to optimise the pedal's input signal and output, I cant quite believe how close the effect comes to sounding like my SVT II Pro. (Im running the VT Bass direct into a poweramp). Now I have clean Ampeg valve tone with tonnes of headroom, which was my aim. Astonished customer here! Cheers Tech 21! As previously mentioned on this thread, the speaker sim plays a giant part in getting that sound.
[/quote]

You're a more patient man than me and seem to have been rewarded for your efforts, which is great! And I'm very impressed you stuck with it despite utterly hating it at first.

I finally received my "Para Driver DI v2" well that's what it said on the tin (literally) But someone had swapped a Bass Driver DI in its place. I did give it a relatively quick go (not a whole day as you did) and thought this really wasn't adding much at all to my amp's EQ and the single overdrive was, if anything, [i]less [/i]to my liking than some of the (multiple) overdrive options on my B3n. Given that it was already not the pedal I had ordered it went back in the box for return...not sure that I will be ordering the Para Driver in its place as I suspect the two pedals aren't a million miles apart.

I am rapidly coming to the conclusion that subtle tonal variations are great for solo use, but will be completely lost in any live mix as far as band-mates and audiences are concerned.

[The59Sound]

When playing live I just turn up the drive setting a little more and that normally helps quite a bit. I play a Jazz with flats but love those warm old school 60s valve tones and it is possible with the Sansamp DIs - much cheaper than a B15!

[la bam]

I've been doing a fair bit of work similar to this.

I've found having the input high (measurable on my ashdown vu meter), then (the important bit) have I put the high mids up (which is never thought of doing). Then I dial in my valve drive until it starts to take effect.

The high mids give it a lovely grind valve sound, which may help from a starting point of view.

[Al Krow]

[quote name='la bam' timestamp='1497370060' post='3317627']
I've been doing a fair bit of work similar to this.

I've found having the input high (measurable on my ashdown vu meter), then (the important bit) have I put the high mids up (which is never thought of doing). Then I dial in my valve drive until it starts to take effect.

The high mids give it a lovely grind valve sound, which may help from a starting point of view.
[/quote]

Thanks for sharing that tip. I agree that mids are far too often under-valued in terms of the role they play in any live mix!

[Lozz196]

[quote name='Al Krow' timestamp='1497262570' post='3316825']
You're a more patient man than me and seem to have been rewarded for your efforts, which is great! And I'm very impressed you stuck with it despite utterly hating it at first.

I finally received my "Para Driver DI v2" well that's what it said on the tin (literally) But someone had swapped a Bass Driver DI in its place. I did give it a relatively quick go (not a whole day as you did) and thought this really wasn't adding much at all to my amp's EQ and the single overdrive was, if anything, [i]less [/i]to my liking than some of the (multiple) overdrive options on my B3n. Given that it was already not the pedal I had ordered it went back in the box for return...not sure that I will be ordering the Para Driver in its place as I suspect the two pedals aren't a million miles apart.

I am rapidly coming to the conclusion that subtle tonal variations are great for solo use, but will be completely lost in any live mix as far as band-mates and audiences are concerned.
[/quote]

That`s a shame Bas, must have been really irritating to finally get the right box but wrong pedal. The BDDI is a good enough pedal, but as la bam has said, adding to upper mids helps on the grit/drive and the BDDI doesn`t have that. Can understand where you`re coming from as it does its thing particularly well, but mids isn`t its thing.