The New Direction Of Bass & Players

[blue]

Completely different than when I started. You turned on the TV ,you saw tons of bands people playing rock and roll and you wanted to get in on it. You wanted to learn and most important you wanted to gig.


Now you rarely see bands on TV and many millinials are perfectly happy jamming with friends or staying in the bedroom and in some cases for good reason.


In someways I think the new players are smarter and more advanced technically than my generation.

But keep in mind the opportunities for good live gigs have dried up for most.


Used to be, if you wanted, you could gig 7 nights a week. I'm not sure if they're having much fun, but maybe fun has changed too.

And these videos with guys playing the bass like a guitar that's a little different for me as well.

Things have to change I guess.Me I'm staying with the joy of live gigging and the old 4 string world. I only have 10 years before I throw in the towel.

Comments or thoughts on the new direction of bass.

Blue

Edited April 29, 2017 by blue

[CamdenRob]

Times change, things move on... not necessarily for better or for worse just a changing of the times.

The charts are no longer filled with bands featuring bass guitars and a large percentage of young people would rather be playing video games than music.

The video thing is symptomatic of the times... most of us under 40 lead a significant part of our lives online and it's a natural progression to share videos of our playing / comment on others doing the same. I think the tendency to move into guitar territory is simply that low register thumping bass doesn't necessarily make for good solo viewing... Personally I like to see the broad spectrum of what people are doing with a bass these days. The bass guitar is a versatile instrument... why not experiment 😊

Great post by the way... a well worded and balanced way to open a discussion

Edited April 29, 2017 by CamdenRob

[bazzbass]

the whole industry is dying. No live music in pubs. No one buys music these days,cept for dinosaurs like me.Existing artists only make money by touring and charging $200 a seat minimum.

yet simpletons like me think someone somewhere wants to hear his original music lol

At least recording at home is now at studio quality almost, too bad no one will ever hear it

[tonyquipment]

100% agree.

Where has all the bass gone?

Moar bass!

[gjones]

It's true that the bars with sticky carpets and a dodgy band playing in the corner (between the pool table and the toilets), where the landlord or bar manager has no real interest in music, are dying off.

The bars I play are busy and have music 7 days a week. People still want to see live music and venues can make money if they invest in a good PA and make sure they hire good quality bands and sound engineers.

These bars rely on music to exist. If they had no music they would be empty. And they're not full of grey hairs and nae hairs, they're full of young people in their 20s and 30s who really love the fact they can spend their night listening to really great live music, in a venue that has invested in a good PA and excellent bands.

So mediocre bands playing in unwelcoming, mediocre venues, are becoming thin on the ground. All that means is both the venues and bands have to up their game. I'm sure there's an audience out there, who wants to have a great night out, listening to music, if they can be offered a better and more professional experience.


Edit: which, when I think about it.......has nothing to do with the original post But at least I got it off my chest.

Edited April 29, 2017 by gjones

[dmccombe7]

Think one of the big differences in our day Blue is that rock, blues & Prog was the "popular" music in its day and therefore many bars had live bands playing songs that altho popular were still what we regard as the standard pub / bar band music even to this day.
Almost every bar i went to in late 70's had a rock band playing at weekends and in Glasgow you literally could see a live rock band every night of the week.
My local venue had either rock blues or prog bands every night of week and as it moved into 80's that tailed off to just a Thu / Fri / Sat and eventually just a Fri / Sat

Popular music has changed a lot since those days with far more varying styles now available.
Bass technique has progressed to keep up with style of music being played in my opinion.
We now have bands that are made up of virtuoso musicians ie Dream Theater yet most people don't appreciate their actual songs altho they appreciate the musicianship.
Individually they are all excellent players but put them together it doesn't come across well for the general public.
I find that a lot with many modern rock bands.

I would rather hear a good melody in a song played by mediocre musicians than poor song by expert musicians.

Think i'm drifting of thread a bit here.

My point being that modern popular music has so many more styles now than it did in 70's.

Dave

[FinnDave]

I'm nearly 60, I am completely out of touch with what teens and 20s are up to, and I don't give a damn. I listen to music I like, not stuff I feel I ought to like so people will like me. As for gigs, well, I have two today, each of them 2 1/2 hours long, both paid, in two different locations, and we'll be playing blues & rock to people who (hopefully) will enjoy it. The second gig should be particularly good fun, on stage at eleven pm at a biker rally...just after the burlesque show! A marquee full of drunk bikers, our sort of audience!

[BrunoBass]

I know at least two incredibly talented musicians (one bass player, one guitarist) who have no desire whatsoever to be in a band. They're happy to just post videos of their playing to YouTube, where 'success' is measured in likes and comments. Changing times I know, and whatever makes you happy etc, but I can't help thinking that playing with other people would help them progress further as musicians.

Barring some highly unlikely cultural shift I think my generation will probably be the last that wants to be in a band.

I think that's a pity, but I'm baseing that on my experiences and opinion of what I think is good. The younger generations will have different priorities and ideas about what they consider worthwhile.

[Yank]

I think there will always be people who want to get up onstage and make music, but now you have more who just want to be a "star", thanks to the proliferation of shows like American Idol.

[blue]

[quote name='gjones' timestamp='1493452303' post='3288375']


The bars I play are busy and have music 7 days a week. People still want to see live music and venues can make money if they invest in a good PA and make sure they hire good quality bands and sound engineers.

These bars rely on music to exist. If they had no music they would be empty. And they're not full of grey hairs and nae hairs, they're full of young people in their 20s and 30s.
[/quote]


Respectfully disagree, in my part of the world those clubs would be the exception if they actually existed but they don't.

In my part of the world when 20 something's walk into a club and discover a band is playing, they walk out no matter how good the band or what genre it is.

And just so my observation is perfectly clear, I mean they walk out immediately and rather fast.

End of story.

Blue

Edited April 29, 2017 by blue

[RhysP]

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1493429738' post='3288296']
I'm not sure if they're having much fun, but maybe fun has changed too.
[/quote]

Fun hasn't changed. Fun was, is & always will be a purely subjective thing.
Just because somebody is doing something you wouldn't enjoy doesn't mean that person isn't having as much fun doing it as you have when you are gigging.

[blue]

[quote name='FinnDave' timestamp='1493453770' post='3288390']
I'm nearly 60, I am completely out of touch with what teens and 20s are up to, and I don't give a damn. I listen to music I like, not stuff I feel I ought to like so people will like me. As for gigs, well, I have two today, each of them 2 1/2 hours long, both paid, in two different locations, and we'll be playing blues & rock to people who (hopefully) will enjoy it. The second gig should be particularly good fun, on stage at eleven pm at a biker rally...just after the burlesque show! A marquee full of drunk bikers, our sort of audience!
[/quote]

64, that's cool.We play a lot of biker bars on a consistent basis. However, here are my observations;

1.There's no young bikers to be seen anywhere

2. Bikers are not the big partiers and drinkers I thought they were.

At least not in my neck of the woods.

Blue

Edited April 29, 2017 by blue

[blue]

[quote name='RhysP' timestamp='1493460428' post='3288469']


Fun hasn't changed. Fun was, is & always will be a purely subjective thing.
Just because somebody is doing something you wouldn't enjoy doesn't mean that person isn't having as much fun doing it as you have when you are gigging.
[/quote]

Agreed,

Playing alone in the bedroom has always been more fun than playing to a live engaged audience.

Blue

[FinnDave]

Blue, I agree that there are fewer and fewer young bikers, the club I was in until recently considered this a major problem, as do other clubs.

Bikers over here are definitely big time party and drinking animals when they are at rallies, as they camp overnight. I have been at rallies both to play and as a participant (not at the same time!) so have seen both sides of this.

Bikers at bars can't drink much, as they have to ride home, and I suspect that the US is as tough as the UK on drinking and driving. Most bikers I know ride loud Harleys, and are a prime target for being stopped, so they take care not to make the cops' jobs too easy for them!

[blue]

[quote name='FinnDave' timestamp='1493460774' post='3288475']
Blue, I agree that there are fewer and fewer young bikers, the club I was in until recently considered this a major problem, as do other clubs.

Bikers over here are definitely big time party and drinking animals when they are at rallies, as they camp overnight. I have been at rallies both to play and as a participant (not at the same time!) so have seen both sides of this.

Bikers at bars can't drink much, as they have to ride home, and I suspect that the US is as tough as the UK on drinking and driving. Most bikers I know ride loud Harleys, and are a prime target for being stopped, so they take care not to make the cops' jobs too easy for them!
[/quote]

Dave,

In the States a DUI could be a 10k proposition after fines and legal fees.

The bikers we play to, well let's just say they're prime partying and heavy drinking days said "bye bye" years ago.

Blue

Edited April 29, 2017 by blue

[project_c]

There are a lot of things to take into consideration:

- hardly anyone under 60 wants to hear classic rock any more. Especially on a night out. Why would they? If you're under 25, that's old people's music. Meanwhile the over 60s are getting to an age where going out to see bands is becoming less of a priority.

- the music industry has killed itself. The big dream of becoming a famous and perhaps well paid musician is dead. There's much less to inspire young people to play in a band or even to pay attention to bands, apart from the sheer love of music. There are hardly any 'heroes' to look up to that play any instrument. People are posting stuff online because that's sometimes the only appreciation they get.

- there are many other forms of entertainment and there are many other (better?) ways to hear music on a night out. Taking some MDMA and listening to perfectly produced electronic music on a state of the art sound system in an air conditioned venue full of fashionable people will understandably appeal to many people a lot more. (I am not condoning drug use, but it's just how it is).

- young people have much less disposable income right now than old people. Getting a few beers and a pizza and hanging out at a friends house playing video games is a lot more affordable than paying to see bands and buying expensive drinks.

[FinnDave]

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1493461441' post='3288485']
Dave,

In the States a DUI could be a 10k proposition after fines and legal fees.

The bikers we play to, well let's just say they're prime partying and heavy drinking days said "bye bye" years ago.

Blue
[/quote]

Well, I hope tonight's crowd aren't in the mood for an early night, we're scheduled to play from eleven nil half one, and expect to play on well after that!

[blue]

[quote name='project_c' timestamp='1493461484' post='3288487']
There are a lot of things to take into consideration:

- hardly anyone under 60 wants to hear classic rock any more. Especially on a night out. Why would they? If you're under 25, that's old people's music. Meanwhile the over 60s are getting to an age where going out to see bands is becoming less of a priority.

- the music industry has killed itself. The big dream of becoming a famous and perhaps well paid musician is dead. There's much less to inspire young people to play in a band or even to pay attention to bands, apart from the sheer love of music. There are hardly any 'heroes' to look up to that play any instrument. People are posting stuff online because that's sometimes the only appreciation they get.

- there are many other forms of entertainment and there are many other (better?) ways to hear music on a night out. Taking some MDMA and listening to perfectly produced electronic music on a state of the art sound system in an air conditioned venue full of fashionable people will understandably appeal to many people a lot more. (I am not condoning drug use, but it's just how it is).

- young people have much less disposable income right now than old people. Getting a few beers and a pizza and hanging out at a friends house playing video games is a lot more affordable than paying to see bands and buying expensive drinks.
[/quote]

We'll put Project C.

Blue

[gjones]

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1493460003' post='3288465']
Respectfully disagree, in my part of the world those clubs would be the exception if they actually existed but they don't.

In my part of the world when 20 something's walk into a club with live music, they walk out no matter how good the band is.

And just so my observation is perfectly clear, I mean they walk out immediately.

End of story.

Blue
[/quote]


Well in my town there is only five venues that provide that level of frontline PA and quality bands. But two of them are owned by the same company (a couple of years ago they opened the second one). I assume they feel there is money to be made, in a sector which is under exploited.

I have to say that Edinburgh, where I live, gets a lot of tourists visiting and has a lot of students studying here. That may be the reason why live music is so popular. In that regard Edinburgh is not a typical UK city. I suppose I could say the same about Nashville, New Orleans or Austin, in the States but they are not typical American cities either.

Edited April 29, 2017 by gjones

[blue]

I'm not looking for a flipant response. On the subject on the direction of the players.

Is going to be all guys playing 6 and 7 string bass guitars as if they were guitarists and shredding at lighting speed?

Blue

Edited April 29, 2017 by blue

[project_c]

Not to mention the most important factor- the internet has put an end to many things. Even in the 90s you could still have a band, a record label, run a record shop, publish a zine - and make enough money to pay your mortgage. That's all gone, and it's been replaced by collecting likes in the hope that you'll make some pocket money from advertising, by posting click bait. The internet is responsible for killing a lot of culture and livelihoods.

[blue]

[quote name='FinnDave' timestamp='1493461578' post='3288491']


Well, I hope tonight's crowd aren't in the mood for an early night, we're scheduled to play from eleven nil half one, and expect to play on well after that!
[/quote]

I'll keep my fingers crossed that you guys have an exceptional evening Dave.

We have an 8:00-12:00 tonight. I'm going with a positive attitude and will play my best.

Blue

Edited April 29, 2017 by blue

[RhysP]

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1493460724' post='3288473']
Agreed,

Playing alone in the bedroom has always been more fun than playing to a live engaged audience.

Blue
[/quote]

Do you have some kind of cognitive impairment that doesn't allow you to understand that not everybody plays for the same reasons as you or are you just a mean spirited troll?

I know musicians who would stop playing if they couldn't gig, the entertainment part of it is the most important thing. I also know plenty of musicians who have no interest in playing live & spend their time working on recording & writing projects, film scores etc. Both types of people love & enjoy what they do passionately.

Edited April 29, 2017 by RhysP

[Kirky]

Reading this I feel very lucky to be in (near) Leeds which has a wealth of venues with live music available every night of the week. For originals we have the Brudenell Social Club, a fantastic venue with 2 rooms and frequently gigs on in both rooms. Smaller original venues like Wharf Chambers, Headrow House, Hyde Park Book Club are always putting something on. For covers in Leeds there's the Duck and Drake, the Grove, and wider afield there's hundreds of pubs that have bands at weekends. And I haven't even mentioned the larger venues (O2, Arena). Here's a [url="https://www.facebook.com/dianesgiglist/posts/1343793445697552"]weekly Facebook post[/url] that someone puts together locally showing gigs on this weekend in the Yorkshire area - a really lively scene.

Blue, I'd suggest finding out about the local originals scene (there must be one, no matter how small). Go along and check out what's happening - it might not be the sort of music you usually listen to, but I bet there's something you'll enjoy, and you'll get out and about and meet some musicians who perhaps have a different viewpoint to you, but will enjoy playing to you and meeting you. I'm not suggesting that its somewhere you'll pick up gigs, but as a musician you might really enjoy the often very original and vibrant (and sometimes challenging) work.

Edited April 29, 2017 by Kirky

[blue]

[quote name='RhysP' timestamp='1493462536' post='3288511']


Do you have some kind of cognitive impairment that doesn't allow you to understand that not everybody plays for the same reasons as you or are you just a mean spirited troll?

I know musicians who would stop playing if they couldn't gig, the entertainment part of it is the most important thing. I also know plenty of musicians who have no interest in playing live & spend their time working on recording & writing projects, film scores etc. Both types of people love & enjoy what they do passionately.
[/quote]

I would hope I'm not mean spirited. At times I'll post something orovacative but not mean.

Of course people play for different reasons. However, you won't convince me that playing alone in the bedroom is more fun than playing with other musicians to a live engaged audience.

Recording and writing film scores is completely different. You won't get an argument out of me there.

Blue

Edited April 29, 2017 by blue