Fender Rumble 60 at a rehearsal studio..... really??

[Left Foot]

I've seen orange goblin's set up for rehearsals... Terror head and 810 orange cab, shouldn't think it were quiet.

[mcnach]

[quote name='The59Sound' timestamp='1497352812' post='3317445']
Do quiet rehearsal bands play quietly at gigs too?

[/quote]

I don't know what others do. I like to let the FOH PA do the heavy lifting and not be excessively loud onstage, because if we are it's hard to hear everybody clearly enough... and it makes it impossible to play 'reactively'.

[Norris]

When we rehearse it is usually at my house, guitarist brings his little practice amp, drummer plays my cheapo electric kit through a bass practice amp, I play through a powered monitor wedge and vocals are unamplified. We get the arrangements, endings and harmonies sorted, then make some noise at the gig. It doesn't have to be loud. In fact sitting listening to each other is the best way to get it tight imho

[The59Sound]

[quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1497367446' post='3317590']


Got any band links, youtube, website etc? [/quote]

I can send you a ticket for free if you would like?

[stingrayPete1977]

[quote name='The59Sound' timestamp='1497383322' post='3317768']


I can send you a ticket for free if you would like?
[/quote]

An approximate location would be good?

[mikel]

[quote name='lowhand_mike' timestamp='1497370472' post='3317630']
we dont rehearse particularly loud but loud enough to be with the drummer, tbh the comments on playing quiter are only valid if your drummer can then play significantly quieter for those passages that require it and ive yet to meet one that can really tone it back and hold the feel.
so yeah we play fairly loud but then also our rehr=earsal room is a large hall so volume is required, when i joined the band they had a 90w combo which was no way near enough, now i have plenty and use a third of it stays nice and clean.
play to what ever volume suits the band theres no right or wrong, if it works it works
[/quote]

I also drum in a funk band and we rehearse at very low volume. I dont find it a problem and it brought on my drumming technique a lot. I dont have any problem grooving at low volume, and at gig volume I can nail the dynamics as I am now used to playing quietly. Its just another skill thats worth having.

[drTStingray]

[quote name='markdavid' timestamp='1497281836' post='3317001']
Hi
Had a rehearsal with a newly joined band at the weekend, the rehearsal studio is one that they use as its very cheap, hadn't been there before and walked in there expecting to plug into maybe a 200w bass amp, or at least 150w........ There was a Fender Rumble 60 there!!!! It actually held up admirably considering the low wattage but I spent a lot of time stood right next to the amp and a fair bit of time fiddling with the eq in an attempt to hear my bass properly, also when I played high up the neck it had some degree of overdrive from being cranked to the max.
The guitar amp was a Marshall 100watt !!!

Anyone had any similar experiences to this?
[/quote]

Yeah - playing in jam sessions run by guitarists where two guitar amps are provided both of which are two to three times the wattage of the bass amp provided (sometimes a 30 watt Warwick combo).

Net result is needing to play on full volume and not to be able to hear yourself, with the bass distorting.

Those particular amps the OP mentions, from my experience, seem to stifle all the top end in a Stingray also.

I recall articles being published which indicated you need exactly the opposite - two or three times the output of the guitar amps. As others have said, it's all about headroom. I seem to recall Alex (Barefaced) writing something about this subject in BGM when he had a monthly slot - or was I dreaming this!!

[markstuk]

[quote name='drTStingray' timestamp='1497398168' post='3317891']
Yeah - playing in jam sessions run by guitarists where two guitar amps are provided both of which are two to three times the wattage of the bass amp provided (sometimes a 30 watt Warwick combo).

Net result is needing to play on full volume and not to be able to hear yourself, with the bass distorting.

Those particular amps the OP mentions, from my experience, seem to stifle all the top end in a Stingray also.

I recall articles being published which indicated you need exactly the opposite - two or three times the output of the guitar amps. As others have said, it's all about headroom. I seem to recall Alex (Barefaced) writing something about this subject in BGM when he had a monthly slot - or was I dreaming this!!
[/quote]

Some reading https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equal-loudness_contour Basically our hearing is less sensitive at low frequencies..

[SpondonBassed]

[quote name='The59Sound' timestamp='1497383322' post='3317768']
I can send you a ticket for free if you would like?
[/quote]

Would you extend that offer to other Basschatters in your locality too? Where are you?

[stingrayPete1977]

[quote name='SpondonBassed' timestamp='1497459640' post='3318377']


Would you extend that offer to other Basschatters in your locality too? Where are you?
[/quote]

I'll collect you on the way if it's in that direction

[SpondonBassed]

[quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1497528237' post='3318873']
I'll collect you on the way if it's in that direction
[/quote]

Many thanks Pete. As long as there are no sheep clusters forecast for the journey. I'm all punned out from ramming 'em into your post elsewhere.

[The59Sound]

[quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1497386097' post='3317797']


An approximate location would be good?
[/quote]
Where abouts in Ireland are you?

[SpondonBassed]

Aw feck.

[drlargepants]

I had an Ampeg fridge provided at a rehearsal room once, which was rather exciting as you can imagine.

It's a bit random what I get at our place generally but I've never felt the need to bring my own amp, primarily because I can't be arsed loading into the car.

[Monkey Steve]

back to the OP, have you tried playing around with the amp positioning? Including the guitarist, not just you?

From experience, most of the volume problems I've had come from guitarists standing right next to their amps, with the speakers pointing towards their knees, complaining that they can't hear themselves (what with then not having ears in their knees) and that everybody else is too loud, and turning up...cue everybody else doing exactly the same because they can hear the guitar amp blasting out but not themselves because they are standing next to their amp which is pointing at their knees...and an hour of petty squabbles about who's fault it is that it's far too loud. If you have two guitarists then this can go on for weeks...

Personal preference is to set everybody according to the level of the drums, with the speakers/cabs elevated or tilted up so that they are pointed at ears rather than knees, and the musician standing at least six feet away, ideally more. Other instruments should be loud enough to be able to hear themselves above the drums and provide the relevant cues to everybody else but no louder. Singer gets final say on everything because they need to be able to hear themselves properly and if the instruments are drowning out the PA then everybody loses.

Edited June 20, 2017 by Monkey Steve

[mikel]

We tend to set the PA vocal volumes at a very comfortable level and the instruments have to sit under that level so the vocals can be heard easily. If you need volume to sound decent then there are more fundamental things wrong.

[Telebass]

[quote name='PaulGibsonBass' timestamp='1497284457' post='3317031']
Amps? For the use of the bands? Blimey, the studio we use has electric light and a Dimplex heater. And that's it.
[/quote]
This is my fundamental experience of 'rehearsal space'. Occasionally small PA, ie about 100W max. Which is entirely adequate.

[Dad3353]

[quote name='mikel' timestamp='1497949731' post='3321479']
We tend to set the PA vocal volumes at a very comfortable level and the instruments have to sit under that level so the vocals can be heard easily...
[/quote]

This ^^, drums included. You know it makes sense.

[ambient]

[quote name='mrtcat' timestamp='1497336288' post='3317318']
I have walked away from bands that insist on rehearsing at full volume. It's what kids would do.
[/quote]

This!

Lets rehearse at gig volume, I'll be OK, I'm wearing my ear plugs. Kind of defeating the object of rehearsing that loud with the plugs attenuating the sound.

Drummers should be able to play quiet too.

[Monkey Steve]

Personally my last few bands haven't suffered from excess drummer volume in the studio - whether by luck or judgement. maybe it depends on the size of the studio, or whatever other variable, it's not that I've only played with very quiet drummers. Thinking about it, I have typically been using studios that had plenty of space, so perhaps it's more of an issue if you're stuck in a shoe box.

...however, I was thinking about bass drum volume the other day (triggered by the Download thread mentioning bass drums being too loud in the mix) and specifically my experience of drummers who will insist on having their bass drums mic'd up. I wonder if it's the drummers version of the "amp pointing at the knee" thing, that it's the one drum they can't hear because it's not pointing at them so they assume that nobody can hear it. I've never understood why the ones that insist on it do so when everybody else is constantly telling them that everybody in the studio/pub can hear the bass drum just fine...

[Dad3353]

[quote name='Monkey Steve' timestamp='1497953878' post='3321527']......however, I was thinking about bass drum volume the other day (triggered by the Download thread mentioning bass drums being too loud in the mix) and specifically my experience of drummers who will insist on having their bass drums mic'd up. I wonder if it's the drummers version of the "amp pointing at the knee" thing, that it's the one drum they can't hear because it's not pointing at them so they assume that nobody can hear it. I've never understood why the ones that insist on it do so when everybody else is constantly telling them that everybody in the studio/pub can hear the bass drum just fine...
[/quote]

This ^^ makes no sense to me. assuming you're meaning 'at live gigs', and not rehearsal (there's really no need to mic up a kit for rehearsals..!), then surely it's a call for the sound engi to make as to whether to have the drums miced, and how, and maybe (just maybe..?) feed some back to the drummer's foldback if he/she needs it..? I can't imagine how or why a drummer would want to dictate what the FOH gets; even less the monitors for the others..! Maybe I'm unusual, but when I've been playing my drums, in any formation over a long career, it's never once occurred to me to amplify what I can already hear very well indeed (and I'm now rather deaf, due to ageing..!). Very rarely, usually on open-air 'festival' type stages, I've wanted a touch of BD in my foldback, but even then only a tad. Is this common amongst drummers, then..? What have I been missing all these decades..?

[markdavid]

[quote name='Monkey Steve' timestamp='1497949105' post='3321474']
back to the OP, have you tried playing around with the amp positioning? Including the guitarist, not just you?

From experience, most of the volume problems I've had come from guitarists standing right next to their amps, with the speakers pointing towards their knees, complaining that they can't hear themselves (what with then not having ears in their knees) and that everybody else is too loud, and turning up...cue everybody else doing exactly the same because they can hear the guitar amp blasting out but not themselves because they are standing next to their amp which is pointing at their knees...and an hour of petty squabbles about who's fault it is that it's far too loud. If you have two guitarists then this can go on for weeks...

Personal preference is to set everybody according to the level of the drums, with the speakers/cabs elevated or tilted up so that they are pointed at ears rather than knees, and the musician standing at least six feet away, ideally more. Other instruments should be loud enough to be able to hear themselves above the drums and provide the relevant cues to everybody else but no louder. Singer gets final say on everything because they need to be able to hear themselves properly and if the instruments are drowning out the PA then everybody loses.
[/quote]
Hi
I did try this but the amp was just not loud enough to compete with the drums and guitar, the 2nd rehearsal went much much better though as I brought my DI box and just went through the DI straight into the PA system, I even had volume to spare

[Monkey Steve]

[quote name='Dad3353' timestamp='1497955169' post='3321541']
This ^^ makes no sense to me. assuming you're meaning 'at live gigs', and not rehearsal (there's really no need to mic up a kit for rehearsals..!), then surely it's a call for the sound engi to make as to whether to have the drums miced, and how, and maybe (just maybe..?) feed some back to the drummer's foldback if he/she needs it..? I can't imagine how or why a drummer would want to dictate what the FOH gets; even less the monitors for the others..! Maybe I'm unusual, but when I've been playing my drums, in any formation over a long career, it's never once occurred to me to amplify what I can already hear very well indeed (and I'm now rather deaf, due to ageing..!). Very rarely, usually on open-air 'festival' type stages, I've wanted a touch of BD in my foldback, but even then only a tad. Is this common amongst drummers, then..? What have I been missing all these decades..?
[/quote]

Exactly, it makes no sense to me either, but I've been in two different bands with drummers who insist that the bass drum needs to be mic'd at all times (and to be clear, it's been in the studio and at pub gigs where we'd do our own sound, situations where he could have a say, not where an engineer is sorting it out). Not all drummers, but it was definitely a "thing" with the pair of them. And like you, I can't understand it...just thought I'd ask

[PaulWarning]

[quote name='Monkey Steve' timestamp='1497956909' post='3321573']
Exactly, it makes no sense to me either, but I've been in two different bands with drummers who insist that the bass drum needs to be mic'd at all times (and to be clear, it's been in the studio and at pub gigs where we'd do our own sound, situations where he could have a say, not where an engineer is sorting it out). Not all drummers, but it was definitely a "thing" with the pair of them. And like you, I can't understand it...just thought I'd ask
[/quote]it's probably something to do with present fashion of having the bass drum very prominent in the mix, drives me daft, it used to be the snare drum at one time, a good drum kit is an acoustic instrument designed so all the bits are at the right volume, it's a bit like us bass players insisting that one of our strings should be louder than the other three

[cheddatom]

hmmm, I'm a drummer and I used to like to mic up the kick drum. I found that when playing rock music, I'd get carried away twatting the snare and cymbals extremely hard, and couldn't get the kick drum to match. Obviously that's crap technique but it never occurred to me to change it until I started playing folk in tiny pubs with no drum mics - you have to do your own mix then! So now I match the level of the kick drum to the others (well, slightly louder actually) so it doesn't matter if I'm mic'd up