Musicianship...

[yorks5stringer]

Been looking for a new keyboard player for our Soul Band and someone our Sax player knows with a big band was approached. Here is the response:

"She is a professional piano player who works [u]entirely[/u] from dots and hasn’t got into to working things out by ear it seems – so every song would have to be transcribed onto manuscript paper."

Anyone ever come across this before?

[bassjim]

Not exactly but points of view are; Pessimistically:

As a perm member joining a band .. If you want to improvise in any way beyond that chart or if a player/singer makes a mistake and say, you stay on the verse part for a few more bars = car crash? You could end up constantly explaining whats going on and whats required at given points all the time.

Optimistically:

Having said that....

To be fair, I dont know anything about this person. She could be well experienced. If you try her out you may find it all a lot easier than previously thought and she may have good ears and a sense of the bleedin obvious. IE: Singer comes in late so don't simply plough on regardless. We are still in the middle 8 as the git is still soloing,again, so hang on and repeat this bit till the vibe/cosmos/ the force/ band leader tells you its back to the chorus.
And you may find it keeps every one more focused in the band. You may even learn something useful from her. Sometimes the second guessing of a chord/ arrangement can be solved instantly because its there written out in front of her.

I've done gigs where a brass section has turned up, with charts on an ipad each and its all gone fine. But these were experienced players that were also "musically aware".

Suck it and see i think. Worth a punt on a rehearsal just to see how it goes.

[Staggering on]

I wonder if she can work from chord charts.Our classically trained keyboard player does that very well since she has a thorough knowledge of theory and has learned to "go with the flow" when things go a little sideways in a song.The hard part is getting her to relax and listen to the music instead of only reading it but she is a huge asset to the band.I'd definitely give it a try, nothing to lose.

[chris_b]

So no solo's then!

There's being a great musician and there's being right for the gig. Not the same thing.

While she doesn't sound right for the gig she's worth an audition. Then decide.

[Bilbo]

I suspect she is not going to be suitable. If she is that advanced a reader, she is probably steeped in the classical tradition. Maybe she could handle a show but playing alongside less formal players, I would expect her to sound clunky and idiomatically suspicious.

[acidbass]

[color=black]Depends on the band and the MD. She will play everything note perfect from start to finish, arrangements nailed, you could even write solos for her. To some this would be a God send![/color]

[blue]

Does she have genre experience? If not, you might run into problems.

I play rock & blues, pretty easy stuff. Anytime someone shows up and works from charts it catches me off guard. You'll see this from guys with a lot of formal training.

I grew up with the genre back in the 60s.listening to Muddy Waters, Albert & BB King,Hendrix, Clapton, Fleetwood Mac, Winters and many others.Jamming and improvising with others for hours on end.

For the most part all the riffs, and arrangements cone to me naturally and fairly easy.If you didn't grow up with it and Don have a lot of experience with the genre I guess I understand the use of charts.

IMO for rock and blues, if your experienced and no the genre, why would you need charts?

Right?

Blue

Edited July 28, 2017 by blue

[Grangur]

How much does she love the genre you play?
How much does she really want to do it?

If she wants it, she'll be able to break free from the dots.

[dmccombe7]

Think everyone deserves to have an audition to see if they fit or not. You might be surprised how quickly she can blend in. Maybe workng with non-formal players might give her a chance to play by ear and she might take to it ok
On the other hand it might not work.

Let her know that if she passes the audition it would need to be a trial period to see how it worked out. Surely first few rehearsals would pick up on that.

Dave

[Trueno]

I think these issues are relatively unimportant, depending upon the audition. I used to be in a band with a keyboard player like that... and he was a complete ****head, regardless of the dot-reading. If you all get on well and the audition shows some potential... great... but you'll never know until you try.

[mikel]

[quote name='Grangur' timestamp='1501209465' post='3343343']
How much does she love the genre you play?
How much does she really want to do it?

If she wants it, she'll be able to break free from the dots.
[/quote]

/\ This. Surely someone that well trained could "Learn" the song, from the music. Then play without it. I find it odd that someone with that much musical training cant learn a few songs by rote. With that much experience they should not need to look at the keyboard so will be free to look at the leader for cues etc.

[chris_b]

Playing with dots is a skill and playing without dots is also a skill. The good players will be able to do both but it's not a given that if you can do one well and you can do the other.

I've played with military trained musicians, especially drummers, and they can read fly sh*t but playing "once more with feeling" is totally beyond some of them.

Still, my vote is to send her a couple of numbers to "learn" and run the audition.

[TimR]

Who is going to transcribe all the music for her?

[yorks5stringer]

[quote name='TimR' timestamp='1501258802' post='3343692']
Who is going to transcribe all the music for her?
[/quote]

Not me!

I think she has already ruled herself out as with a sax player we tend to go into jam/improv territory.

[TimR]

I think the writing is on the wall when someone says "I only play from sheet", sh could have said "I normally play from sheet but I'll have a go."

Shows a bit of interest and leads on, an open answer rather than a closed one.

[Nicko]

I find it inconcievable that a professional keys player who has the ability to sight read would lack the necessary theory knowledge that would enable them to both identify intervals and hence go "off dots", or improvise a line when given a chord progression. When I did my formal music traning this was an integral part of the course.