Scouting Out A Band

[blue]

An old topic, but always relevant.

I want to gear this thread more towards those who are, or have or will be looking for working band making money. I

Again more for those who treat and approach playing as a business.

First of all their are a lot of variables, location,the market and age to name a few.

Sencond, even taking the above variables into consideration finding and winning an opportunity with a working band that's making money is close to impossible for most of us. Especially for those of us who are not networked.

How about really understanding what your looking for in a band , the people you can work with respect and play with.

Once you've defined your requirements and deal breakers you can start your search.

Are you a good judge of character and can you see red flags. Your going to need to in order to match yourself with the right band.IMO

What kind of things are important to you, again if your looking for money.

Throw a few ideas, thoughts and experiences out there for those might be looking.

Blue

Edited August 27, 2017 by blue

[blue]

I'll start.

It's very difficult.

If my band folded, it would be impossible to find another established band with weekly bookings going out into the better part of 2018.

Blue

Edited August 27, 2017 by blue

[blue]

Red Flag

Just one example, you've checked out their website page and YouTube clips and they don't match the current line up.

Not necessarily a bad thing, but worth asking questions about it

Blue

Edited August 28, 2017 by blue

[bazzbass]

Im assuming that the band is a cover band coz original bands get neither gigs nor money hehe

I know this from 38 years experience, sigh

So, I would check which agency (ies) they're going through and the gig guides to gauge if they are playing good-paying gigs.

I'd ask my network of musos about them, in my city you can't fart without every muso hearing about it

troll through old gig guides if possible to see what gigs they had

most likely they won't have upcoming gigs if they're recruiting, but you never know, if they are go check em out anonymously.

that's all I got for now

[Burns-bass]

People need to create a brand for their band. The best ones are able to do this and become very successful.

The best bands take a professional approach, analysing gigs, successes and failures. Criticism is essential, as it's about refining the product.

And everything should be planned out, rehearsed and refined. Gigs come with the professional approach.

[Happy Jack]

I recently joined a well-established 3-piece covers band who play 60/70 gigs a year for decent money, certainly a money-oriented venture.

After a couple of rehearsals, I found myself chatting with the drummer and asked him how long he'd been playing with the guitarist/singer.

40 years.

I immediately told him that, if I'd known that earlier, I'd never have applied to the band.

My first two gigs with them were on a Friday and Saturday, both old-school social clubs. The two of them were like an old married couple, with everything running at the very bottom of a well worn groove. Nothing at all could be changed, the equipment all had to go exactly as it always was, every note I played had to be exactly as instructed.

They sacked me on the Sunday morning. Bullet dodged.

Scouting out a new band? Start by finding out whether you're going to be the permanent new boy / spare prick at a wedding.

[blue]

[quote name='bazztard' timestamp='1503891277' post='3361340']
Im assuming that the band is a cover band coz original bands get neither gigs nor money hehe

I know this from 38 years experience, sigh

So, I would check which agency (ies) they're going through and the gig guides to gauge if they are playing good-paying gigs.

I'd ask my network of musos about them, in my city you can't fart without every muso hearing about it

troll through old gig guides if possible to see what gigs they had

most likely they won't have upcoming gigs if they're recruiting, but you never know, if they are go check em out anonymously.

that's all I got for now
[/quote]

All good points. However, I would want to see imediate bookings as well as booking extending well into 2018.

Blue

[blue]

[quote name='hiram.k.hackenbacker' timestamp='1503898681' post='3361353']
Well, networking is the key isn't it. The more people and bands you play with, the more opportunities will arise.
[/quote]

Definitely, and the more likely someone will call you instead of the other way around.

Blue

[blue]

[quote name='Happy Jack' timestamp='1503912597' post='3361445']
I recently joined a well-established 3-piece covers band who play 60/70 gigs a year for decent money, certainly a money-oriented venture.

After a couple of rehearsals, I found myself chatting with the drummer and asked him how long he'd been playing with the guitarist/singer.

40 years.

I immediately told him that, if I'd known that earlier, I'd never have applied to the band.

My first two gigs with them were on a Friday and Saturday, both old-school social clubs. The two of them were like an old married couple, with everything running at the very bottom of a well worn groove. Nothing at all could be changed, the equipment all had to go exactly as it always was, every note I played had to be exactly as instructed.

They sacked me on the Sunday morning. Bullet dodged.

Scouting out a new band? Start by finding out whether you're going to be the permanent new boy / spare prick at a wedding.
[/quote]

Doesn't sound like you could have seen this red flag earlier in the process.

Great example of some of the things anyone should be looking for in terms of whether the band is an acceptable match for you.

Me, personally I stay away from bands run by any husband and wife team.

Blue

[blue]

[quote name='Burns-bass' timestamp='1503911924' post='3361440']
People need to create a brand for their band. The best ones are able to do this and become very successful.

The best bands take a professional approach, analysing gigs, successes and failures. Criticism is essential, as it's about refining the product.

And everything should be planned out, rehearsed and refined. Gigs come with the professional approach.
[/quote]

True, however I don't think all members need to be involved in the booking strategy. That should be left to the members that have that expertise or skill set.

Blue

[blue]

What sort of things do you look for in a band, what's important to you, what's your deal breaker?


For me, let's say the band is good all too shelf players but they don't have a "star" , meaning a personable, experienced front person that people instinctively like.

Got to have a Star.

Blue

[blue]

Be able to admit when a band may be out of your league, beyond your abilities. Meaning " No way can I play this stuff"


Blue

[bazzbass]

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1503947446' post='3361786']
All good points. However, I would want to see imediate bookings as well as booking extending well into 2018.

Blue
[/quote]

I am unfamiliar with both those terms

I am just starting playing out after a 22 year break.

I am literally starting from scratch coz none of my contacts from 1995 are still involved hehe.

Gone are the glory days of having a few frothies with the bar manager while booking one of my bands, now it's all via email, sigh.

[blue]

Here's another potential "red flag". They offer you the job right after your audition.

Blue

[blue]

[quote name='bazztard' timestamp='1503984587' post='3361898']

Gone are the glory days of having a few frothies with the bar manager while booking one of my bands, now it's all via email, sigh.
[/quote]

In the US, if your a bar band and your waiting for a bar owner to respond to an email, you'll be waiting for quite a long time. Bar business is still done by phone and face to face over here.

Blue

[blue]

If a band made me an offer I'd want to know about the alcohol/ drinking culture of the band.

I approach being in a band as a business and have a hard time with bands that bring heavy drinking into the picture. I'd actually like a "no drinking on the job" policy.

But, if the money is good, I guess there's not much I can say.

Blue

[Monkey Steve]

I was actually talking about this with a mate at the weekend. We were in an originals band a couple of years ago that got nowhere despite being (though I say it myself) really good musicians, great songs, and with some very experienced players. Since then he's gone back to an old band that has reformed ans has just released an album, done a couple of tours, played a load of festivals and are selling lots of merch.

We concluded that you need two key things:

1. A good product;
2. A band leader who has the right contacts and knows exactly how to sell it.

back to Blue - you comment that you don't have the network to be able to pick it up again if your current band fell apart, but is this not something you can learn? Shadow the band leader, build up your own book of contacts at the bars you're playing, get together with other bands you bump into, etc

[blue]

[quote name='Monkey Steve' timestamp='1504099682' post='3362677']
I was actually talking about this with a mate at the weekend. We were in an originals band a couple of years ago that got nowhere despite being (though I say it myself) really good musicians, great songs, and with some very experienced players. Since then he's gone back to an old band that has reformed ans has just released an album, done a couple of tours, played a load of festivals and are selling lots of merch.

We concluded that you need two key things:

1. A good product;
2. A band leader who has the right contacts and knows exactly how to sell it.

back to Blue - you comment that you don't have the network to be able to pick it up again if your current band fell apart, but is this not something you can learn? Shadow the band leader, build up your own book of contacts at the bars you're playing, get together with other bands you bump into, etc
[/quote]

I could and would if it ever comes to that.

The problem is finding bands that like to work as much as possible. Most bands I know of have a lot of restrictions they put on gigging. They don't have the spirit drive or desire to gig a lot like me.

Blue

[Monkey Steve]

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1504104502' post='3362714']
I could and would if it ever comes to that.

The problem is finding bands that like to work as much as possible. Most bands I know of have a lot of restrictions they put on gigging. They don't have the spirit drive or desire to gig a lot like me.

Blue
[/quote]

But that's the bit of networking you're missing - the "band" may not want to work as much as you, but the lead guitarist might, and the drummer from another band might want to do more, etc. Have a chat and ask the players you like some leading questions about whether they see it as a Friday night hobby or whether they'd prefer to be earning money most nights of the week. then when you need to start a band to play every night, you know exactly who to ask.

And if you can't find them, it may simply be a readjustment so rather than looking for the one replacement band, perhaps you can find two or three bands that would keep you ticking over.

[blue]

[quote name='Monkey Steve' timestamp='1504105460' post='3362724']


But that's the bit of networking you're missing - the "band" may not want to work as much as you, but the lead guitarist might, and the drummer from another band might want to do more, etc. Have a chat and ask the players you like some leading questions about whether they see it as a Friday night hobby or whether they'd prefer to be earning money most nights of the week. then when you need to start a band to play every night, you know exactly who to ask.

And if you can't find them, it may simply be a readjustment so rather than looking for the one replacement band, perhaps you can find two or three bands that would keep you ticking over.
[/quote]

All good points.

However, starting a band is nothing I would or could take on. Not to say it's not a good idea for some.

At the bar band level, a new band trying to compete and break into the limited market in my area would be a huge challenge.

And staying a float working with several bands, I'm not networked for that and not really a viable option in my area.

Blue

Edited August 30, 2017 by blue

[blue]

A huge part of scouting out a new band is having a good understanding of your local market.

Some folks live in areas where opportunities for working bands are practically non-existent.

Blue

[Dad3353]

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1504118174' post='3362840']
A huge part of scouting out a new band is having a good understanding of your local market.

Some folks live in areas where opportunities for working bands are practically non-existent....
[/quote]

Indeed; not much work for the farriers in Central Manchester. Either go where the opportunities exist, or change horses, maybe..? No point flogging a dead horse.

[blue]

[quote name='Dad3353' timestamp='1504119303' post='3362851']


Indeed; not much work for the farriers in Central Manchester. Either go where the opportunities exist, or change horses, maybe..? No point flogging a dead horse.
[/quote]

Yes, a sad reality some have to face.

Blue

[blue]

The ability to quickly access people and personalities is crucial.

Nobody wants to be in a band where your working with creepy, dishonest people. It's happened to me and I'm pretty sure I'm not the only guy to experience this.

Blue

[blue]

How much are you willing to travel. There are bands around here that will drive 2 hours one way for a $100.00 a man gig. Hardly worth it for most of us.

Blue