Muting bass alters intonation

[Bloc Riff Nut]

Whenever I place sponge under my strings, at the bridge, it throws the intonation out. I've tried varying compositions of sponge and it always alters the intonation. I'm placing it under the strings of my classic vibe Precision at the bridge ashtray cover.
When an in tune string is tuned at the 12th fret it will show 1 or 2 red leds on my Korg Pitch Black tuner.

Does anyone else have this issue?

[SpondonBassed]

[quote name='Bloc Riff Nut' timestamp='1504704155' post='3366740']
Whenever I place sponge under my strings, at the bridge, it throws the intonation out. I've tried varying compositions of sponge and it always alters the intonation. I'm placing it under the strings of my classic vibe Precision at the bridge ashtray cover.
When an in tune string is tuned at the 12th fret it will show 1 or 2 red leds on my Korg Pitch Black tuner.

Does anyone else have this issue?
[/quote]

http://basschat.co.uk/topic/311212-the-joy-of-a-bath-sponge/page__view__findpost__p__3366661

The link to Carol Kaye's advice might help you here.

[ambient]

I'm guessing that if the sponge is too rigid then it's maybe having the effect of shifting the bridge forward?

Maybe make sure that whatever you use is just muting the strings.

[chris_b]

Just tune the bass after you've added the foam.

[NJE]

This is the exact reason I sent back the Gruv Gear Fump. It totally messed up my tuning

[ivansc]

The original foam mute was glued to the inside of the rear ashtray so that it sat exactly on top of the bridge. Only needs a very slight overlap to give the classic mute effect.... not much actual pressure on the strings, either.

And FWIW do you know how much or little that two red LEDs on your tuner represents in terms of pitch? Might well be a case of you listening with your eyes and the true effect on tuning (and certainly intonation) is not that relevant.

[ivansc]

[quote name='NJE' timestamp='1504717979' post='3366885']
This is the exact reason I sent back the Gruv Gear Fump. It totally messed up my tuning
[/quote]

Never seen one before but whoever came up with that had no idea how it is supposed to work.

[fftc]

[quote name='ivansc' timestamp='1504719179' post='3366892']
Never seen one before but whoever came up with that had no idea how it is supposed to work.
[/quote]


D'oh!

Edited September 7, 2017 by fftc

[ivansc]

How can something wrapped round the strings at the bridge end stop open strings from sounding but not stop the fretted ones? Madness.

[SpondonBassed]

[quote name='fftc' timestamp='1504768882' post='3367109']
The Frump, as I understand it, is not meant to work the same as an old school Motown style mute. It's for the slappers and tappers and is meant to only mute open strings and not fretted notes.
[/quote]

Is that the one that looks like a eighties' jogger's wrist band applied to the neck over the nut?

I always thought it was a step in the direction of a leg-warmer revival. Be wary. That must be prevented at all costs.

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h1xO7RwTV4k[/media]

Has history taught us [i]nothing[/i]?

Edited September 8, 2017 by SpondonBassed

[fftc]

[quote name='ivansc' timestamp='1504793551' post='3367364']
How can something wrapped round the strings at the bridge end stop open strings from sounding but not stop the fretted ones? Madness.
[/quote]

My apologies. I was confusing the 'Fump' with the 'FretWrap'.

[ivansc]

No apologies needed, provided you are over 60. We can get away with anything.

[SpondonBassed]

[quote name='ivansc' timestamp='1504850987' post='3367716']
No apologies needed, provided you are over 60. We can get away with anything.


[/quote]

With the obvious exception of flatulence. Never trust a fart if you are over fifty, a wise Scot once said.

[lojo]

I used to throw a bit of sponge under my p bass strings for some Motown in the set when I used rounds , it was a fairly solid lump but only about 1/2" wide , took seconds to push it and up against the bridge , didn't have to worry about intonation or re tuning at that width

Edited September 8, 2017 by lojo

[drTStingray]

My basses are more modern than that ash tray laden thing people are referring to - if you can call designed 40 odd years ago more modern - I suppose it represents an improvement on 60 yrs old - say Escort RS1600 compared to Ford Popular.

Anyhoooo - these basses, be they the 1993 fretted or Fretless, 2010, 2014 or 2016 built ones all have a custom designed individual string muting system - which Leo and mates brought over from the 60s Mustang bass - doesn't affect intonation at all from my experience no matter how much you wind them on - being able to do this means you can vary the intensity of muting by individual string or across the whole bass - and neither did stuffing a nice think sponge and scourer pad up by the bridge on a 2007 version of one of these modern basses which similarly had no effect on intonation.

Lots of other famous bassists have been filmed or pictured using a similar system with a chunk of sponge or foam rubber - Bob Babbitt, George Porter Jnr etc etc (they were using Precisions).

What sort of bass and what sort of mute equipment were you guys using to get this intonation problem - seems astonishing to me.

Edited September 8, 2017 by drTStingray

[SpondonBassed]

[quote name='drTStingray' timestamp='1504908368' post='3368308']
...a custom designed individual string muting system - which Leo and mates brought over from the 60s Mustang bass...
[/quote]

I quite like that individual muting system in principle but I sometimes hear people [i]dissing[/i] it. One day I'll get to try it out.

[Coilte]

[quote name='Bloc Riff Nut' timestamp='1504704155' post='3366740']
Whenever I place sponge under my strings, at the bridge, it throws the intonation out. I've tried varying compositions of sponge and it always alters the intonation.
[/quote]

Try cutting a small groove in the sponge for each string. That way, the muting comes from the sponge being [i]around[/i] rather than [i]under[/i] the strings.

[SpondonBassed]

[quote name='Bloc Riff Nut' timestamp='1504704155' post='3366740']
...Does anyone else have this issue?
[/quote]

No sponge here. Or is there?

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KCYTR3wReXc[/media]

Edited September 13, 2017 by SpondonBassed

[chris_b]

This Vulfpeck track sound good (and in tune) to me, so foam is fine.

I believe Motown tracks were recorded with foam and they all sound in tune to me. My experience back then was to always be asked to put foam in. All the tracks were in tune or we wouldn't have been allowed to keep them.

The intonation will be OK, but you have to tune the bass [i]after [/i]you've put the foam in.

[chris_b]

If you still have intonation problems maybe the bass is slightly out and that is accentuated by the foam.

[Twincam]

[quote name='chris_b' timestamp='1504717564' post='3366879']
Just tune the bass after you've added the foam.
[/quote]

This seems a bit too logical for basschat haha.

[blue]

Palm mute.

Blue

[DaveFry]

Try the two-piece method :-

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aWubx8OfcH0[/media]

[ivansc]

[quote name='ivansc' timestamp='1504719140' post='3366891']
The original *FENDER* factory foam mute was glued to the inside of the rear ashtray so that it sat exactly on top of the bridge. Only needs a very slight overlap to give the classic mute effect.... not much actual pressure on the strings, either.
[/quote]

Sorry but just realised I missed out the most significant part - this was "as supplied by the factory" on ALL P basses at the time.

[chris_b]

Mine was in front of the bridge so killed the sound. Everyone I knew removed the foam, even if they didn't take the ash trays off.