I have a student who is rhythm deaf. Help me

[ambient]

I explained it to one person I teach my having him walk and run across the room.

[leftybassman392]

[quote name='bubinga5' timestamp='1507587983' post='3386651']
When do you say. Your not musical, sorry I can't teach you. ?. That must be so difficult as a teacher.
[/quote]

Well first of all you don't say it like that. I saw it as at least as much a failure for me as it was for the student.

[The Jaywalker]

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Edited November 28, 2017 by The Jaywalker

[bubinga5]

[quote name='leftybassman392' timestamp='1507589269' post='3386670']
Well first of all you don't say it like that. I saw it as at least as much a failure for me as it was for the student.
[/quote]Really?, there was me thinking, I would want to actually talk to a child like that. I was leaving it up to Owen's interpretation.

Edited October 10, 2017 by bubinga5

[bubinga5]

[quote name='Cato' timestamp='1507565784' post='3386381']
Electro shock therapy.

Every time he loses his rhythm hit him with the cattle prod.

He'll soon learn.
[/quote] Sorry that was hilarious

[bazzbass]

[quote name='wateroftyne' timestamp='1507565927' post='3386383']
Is there a possibility that he's just not cut out for this music lark?
[/quote]

THIS x1000

not everybody can be a musician

if it ain't in you it ain't in you

there is no rule that says just because you bought a bass, amp and lessons that you can be a bassist

[leftybassman392]

[quote name='The Jaywalker' timestamp='1507588971' post='3386666']
More or less everyone has near perfect time built into their physiology: none of us have to think about walking down the street at a steady pace.
[/quote]

I take your point (and as always have the utmost respect for your opinions on matters musical), but unless I've missed something in the OP - and if I have then @Owen will I'm sure correct me - then this is one of those rare cases of an apparently complete disconnect between the innate and the conscious. Before I was a tutor I was a schoolteacher for the previous 15 years or so: a part of any decent teacher's skillset is the ability to develop strategies for helping struggling students. I have met and worked with plenty of students possessed of poor rhythmic capabilities. In the case I set out earlier the situation was - or at least appeared to be - different in kind. He was the only student I ever met who was discernably no better after 6 or 7 weeks of work than he was at the outset despite my - and his - best efforts.

[The Jaywalker]

.

Edited November 28, 2017 by The Jaywalker

[Hellzero]

Owen, there is another option simply called intelligence.

Can your student play complex rhythm patterns with an astonishing ease ?

If that's the case, he is one of those high potential human beings.

He won't be able to clap on each beat of a 4/4 because it's simply annoying and absolutely unrewarding to him...

So you'll have to explain him why this ability to clap on the beat is absolutely mandatory, simply because he needs to know why in a scientific way.

Then mix what would be complex to anyone with simple 4/4 in your (faster) teaching and he'll get it.

Indian music theory will help a lot for these students.

Easier to say than to do, I know.

Hoping he is one of these high potential human beings, otherwise only patience and slow teaching will help.

Edited October 10, 2017 by Hellzero

[mikel]

Not everyone can do everything. Some people simply don't have a sense of rhythm. I have a good friend who simply can not dance, he can not hear or feel a beat. Its just the way it is. He can move about to music but its nowhere near the rhythm of any song he may be moving to, he looks like he is dancing to headphones while the rest of the floor is dancing to the music in the room..

[charic]

How about something like this?

https://www.soundbrenner.com/

[charic]

On a side note, I can't dance or tap more forefoot to a beat, instead I find that my heel naturally moves to the beat

[Blink]

Can he sing in time to a favourite song? if yes use singing as the basis for learning bass lines.

[lojo]

I'm not able to teach as I have no musical academical knowledge , but this is a topic that has interested me as I've played with people who know everything about music but have no real ability and the other way around. Can this be taught ? I don't mean improved , but is it something you either have or don't have ?

[Guest Jecklin]

[quote name='Burns-bass' timestamp='1507581105' post='3386571']
I always used to use the Josquin de Pres sight reading for bass book.


[/quote]

On a tangent I need to up my sight reading and hadn't heard of this book.
Thank you for the heads up

[TPJ]

Have you asked your student what their goals are muiscally? I ask because I believe music is for everyone. Whether or not they play to a standard that might be deemed "acceptable" is irrelevant if the act of playing brings joy and satisfaction to the player.

There is an accordian player that frequents some open mic nights in the area. He has facility and can play the thing but to all that listen, he has very little sense of time, rhythm or melody. He plays to backing tracks and it sounds as if he's playing one song or two on the accordian while the backing track is something else. People laugh but I just sit through it and let him play as he loves it. He gets out of the house and get's to play his instrument and it means something to him.

So if the student just wants to play, help them gain some facilty to play whatever. If they have goals beyond their means, maybe help to get them as close as they can?

[stingrayPete1977]

[quote name='bazztard' timestamp='1507603410' post='3386702']


THIS x1000

not everybody can be a musician

if it ain't in you it ain't in you

there is no rule that says just because you bought a bass, amp and lessons that you can be a bassist
[/quote]

Damn someone has already used up today's Adam Clayton joke quota!

[Dad3353]

[quote name='TPJ' timestamp='1507651023' post='3386998']
Have you asked your student what their goals are muiscally? I ask because I believe music is for everyone. Whether or not they play to a standard that might be deemed "acceptable" is irrelevant if the act of playing brings joy and satisfaction to the player.

There is an accordian player that frequents some open mic nights in the area. He has facility and can play the thing but to all that listen, he has very little sense of time, rhythm or melody. He plays to backing tracks and it sounds as if he's playing one song or two on the accordian while the backing track is something else. People laugh but I just sit through it and let him play as he loves it. He gets out of the house and get's to play his instrument and it means something to him.

So if the student just wants to play, help them gain some facilty to play whatever. If they have goals beyond their means, maybe help to get them as close as they can?
[/quote]

I agree here. I sometimes get called by an very old bloke who's been playing accordion and organ since before the war, and animates local old folks clubs in the region. His playing is technically atrocious; the melody is barely discernable, and there is little respect for the phrasing and timing. Nevertheless, he's called back time and time again, and, despite the faltering rhythm, the dance floor is always packed. He lives for his music, and is blissfully unaware of the (relatively abysmal...) standard of his playing. More power to his elbow, I say, and long may he go on enjoying his gigs and giving pleasure to many. He's given up his band, being now too old for loading up his Boxer van with the full PA, drums etc, and goes out solo, with Midi for backing. I get called when he accidentally erases his settings, and I have to load 'em in from his backup disks. Less often now than in the past, and probably not for much longer, as he's well into his eighties now. We all find our satisfaction in different ways.

[Nicko]

[quote name='Grangur' timestamp='1507560039' post='3386344']
If he doesn't want to play in a band, then maybe playing melodic pieces will fill his desires? That's what I play. I'm happy.
[/quote]

Or he could play a role that doesn't require precise timing such as lead guitar. IMHO a sense of rhythm is pre-requisite for bass playing, kind of like having two hands, but its not really the case for all nstruments to the same extent. I'm not sure someone with so much development needed will get to where they need to for bass.

[The Jaywalker]

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Edited November 28, 2017 by The Jaywalker

[stingrayPete1977]

Maybe he's a jazz virtuoso?

[The Jaywalker]

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Edited November 28, 2017 by The Jaywalker

[Hobbayne]

Reminds me of this post I once read about some lad repeatedly failing his driving test. Some belters in there!
[url="https://www.thestudentroom.co.uk/showthread.php?t=1428829"]https://www.thestude...d.php?t=1428829[/url]

Edited October 10, 2017 by Hobbayne

[Nicko]

[quote name='The Jaywalker' timestamp='1507662145' post='3387109']
EVERY instrument needs to be played with good time, whether their perceived role is time/rhythm related or not. Nothing sounds worse than a lead guitarist with poor time. It's one of the things that separates the great players from the rest.
[/quote]

I don't disagree entirely. I think what I meant is timing needs to be excellent for bass, but good will do for other instruments.

[converse320]

All the time he is enjoying trying and wants to continue, I'd say carry on teaching him. I spend weeks apparently getting worse, then suddenly find I can do things. Most importantly I don't really care that I'm crap because I enjoy practising. Calms me down a bit.