Bass Player Wanted, No gigs

[odysseus]

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1507886445' post='3388519']

That's too bad, as you indicate "around here"[/quote]

Yeah, I live at the ass end of nowhere, where originality is treated with suspicion!

Despite that, it's worth it for the surfing. :-)

[Tonteee]

Whilst initially suspicious of this thread being another moanfest, I've found this discussion quite interesting, plus a reflection of a discussion I was having with my dad - also a gigging guitarist of varying amounts over the years, of the 50's/60's blues/pop persuasion.

He postulated that I don't seem to enjoy playing to people. Or even playing with a group of people, in say a jam context.

I thought this quite odd - I gig quite a lot, I enjoy gigging, I'm usually proud of the quality of music the bands I'm in produce for the audience - the usual mix of pubs, bars, functions, etc. I gig between 1-6 times a month, with 4 different bands playing RnB, soul, old-school funk, pop. Not showing off, just giving context.

Our discussion showed that he felt the difference is that I don't get a kick out of 'entertaining the crowd'. He felt that I did a job and got out. I thought it odd, but on reflection he's probably right. I see a big crowd as a marker of the band's ability to hold attention and entertain, as opposed to a warm feeling of self-fulfillment. Now playing a tricky part correctly in a gig context? Nailing a harmony? Making a brilliant sound? That makes me smile. If others enjoy that too, cool.

I raise all this as I want to support the notion that playing an instrument, forming a group and not gigging with it can be very rewarding. Most of the jazz stuff I've done has rarely gigged, but the experience of having to follow a chart playing unfamiliar structures has been invaluable in my growth as a player. I'm grateful to have had those opportunities. There's been talk of rehearsal without a gig in mind is not rehearsal. The goal is not so defined, surely? Playing a piece well is a goal in itself.

To wrap up this gargantuan message, I wanted to add that I'm not keen on rehearsal in front of an audience. I think any new material needs to have been rehearsed. To not do so is - to me - disrespectful.

Right, as you were, outpouring over. 😀

[blue]

[quote name='Tonteee' timestamp='1507985503' post='3389151']
Whilst initially suspicious of this thread being another moanfest, I've found this discussion quite interesting, plus a reflection of a discussion I was having with my dad - also a gigging guitarist of varying amounts over the years, of the 50's/60's blues/pop persuasion.

He postulated that I don't seem to enjoy playing to people. Or even playing with a group of people, in say a jam context.

I thought this quite odd - I gig quite a lot, I enjoy gigging, I'm usually proud of the quality of music the bands I'm in produce for the audience - the usual mix of pubs, bars, functions, etc. I gig between 1-6 times a month, with 4 different bands playing RnB, soul, old-school funk, pop. Not showing off, just giving context.

Our discussion showed that he felt the difference is that I don't get a kick out of 'entertaining the crowd'. He felt that I did a job and got out. I thought it odd, but on reflection he's probably right. I see a big crowd as a marker of the band's ability to hold attention and entertain, as opposed to a warm feeling of self-fulfillment. Now playing a tricky part correctly in a gig context? Nailing a harmony? Making a brilliant sound? That makes me smile. If others enjoy that too, cool.

I raise all this as I want to support the notion that playing an instrument, forming a group and not gigging with it can be very rewarding. Most of the jazz stuff I've done has rarely gigged, but the experience of having to follow a chart playing unfamiliar structures has been invaluable in my growth as a player. I'm grateful to have had those opportunities. There's been talk of rehearsal without a gig in mind is not rehearsal. The goal is not so defined, surely? Playing a piece well is a goal in itself.

To wrap up this gargantuan message, I wanted to add that I'm not keen on rehearsal in front of an audience. I think any new material needs to have been rehearsed. To not do so is - to me - disrespectful.

Right, as you were, outpouring over. 😀
[/quote]

I think I know where your Dad's coming from.

After 50 years I'm still completely excited about entertaining a crowd. It's a part of my DNA.

There's nothing wrong about where any of us gets the joy or fun as long as your getting it. Sounds like you have plenty of outlets besides gigging to get it.

Blue

[EliasMooseblaster]

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1507749124' post='3387762']
Over time I'm getting the feeling that my local bar scene and cover band culture is different than in the UK.

First of all our patrons are music and people lovers. I never see anything remotely like this "drunken idiots" crowd you speak of.

I'm not sure what it's like in the UK, in the States if you get charged with drunken driving even if it's a first offense your looking at no less than 10K after everything is said and done.
[/quote]

One difference which is worth noting: over here, your "local" pub/bar is often within walking distance, especially if you live in a town/city centre or suburb. No need for a designated driver when you can just roll home after closing time!

[Nicko]

I enjoy practicing, or at least getting together with the band and making music. We're a covers band and as long as we have new material on the go its generally good fun.

I like gigging too. Playing to an enthusiatic crowd is a great buzz. Whether the arse ache of actually getting the gigs, setting up, stripping down and everything that goes with it is worthwhile ........

The money is irrelevant and barely covers costs.

Everyone in the band agrees we do not want to be gigging every week. Our ideal schedule would be 10-12 gigs a year.

If I was doing originals I'd probably gig even less.

[ricksterphil]

[quote name='Nicko' timestamp='1508166067' post='3390186']
I enjoy practicing, or at least getting together with the band and making music. We're a covers band and as long as we have new material on the go its generally good fun.

I like gigging too. Playing to an enthusiatic crowd is a great buzz. Whether the arse ache of actually getting the gigs, setting up, stripping down and everything that goes with it is worthwhile ........

The money is irrelevant and barely covers costs.

Everyone in the band agrees we do not want to be gigging every week. Our ideal schedule would be 10-12 gigs a year.

If I was doing originals I'd probably gig even less.
[/quote]

I like practicing, but find it more fun when I'm working towards something for a gig. Gigging is great - don't much like the strip down afterwards but it's better than sitting at home watching dross on the telly

Edited October 16, 2017 by ricksterphil

[blue]

[quote name='EliasMooseblaster' timestamp='1508159656' post='3390125']


One difference which is worth noting: over here, your "local" pub/bar is often within walking distance, especially if you live in a town/city centre or suburb. No need for a designated driver when you can just roll home after closing time!
[/quote]

If the pubs are in residentially zoned areas, is that why you don't have 4 hour gigs?

Blue

[blue]

[quote name='Nicko' timestamp='1508166067' post='3390186']

Everyone in the band agrees we do not want to be gigging every week. Our ideal schedule would be 10-12 gigs a year[/quote]

75-80 is where I'd like to be.

Blue

[FinnDave]

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1508185518' post='3390397']
If the pubs are in residentially zoned areas, is that why you don't have 4 hour gigs?

Blue
[/quote]

Probably is in many cases, most of the pub gigs I play have strict curfew times, often half eleven or midnight - pub gigs after midnight are very rare in my experience. A lot of places don't want us to start until nine as people eat in pubs and want to enjoy their meals in peace.

[peteb]

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1508185518' post='3390397']
If the pubs are in residentially zoned areas, is that why you don't have 4 hour gigs?

Blue
[/quote]
Yes, but this is because of a number of reasons: partly because of a curfew when the live music has to finish (usually at midnight round here); also because most people do not tend to go out until 9 o'clock or later to these type of 'music pub' venues; and once they get there the audience tends to stay and watch the entire performance rather than the band just being part of a night's entertainment when they are on a crawl round a number of bars, which people are more likely to do on a night out in a town centre.

Edited October 16, 2017 by peteb

[blue]

[quote name='FinnDave' timestamp='1508185777' post='3390403']


Probably is in many cases, most of the pub gigs I play have strict curfew times, often half eleven or midnight - pub gigs after midnight are very rare in my experience. A lot of places don't want us to start until nine as people eat in pubs and want to enjoy their meals in peace.
[/quote]

Interesting our bars and clubs are located in busines & commercial zoned areas and can be open until 2:30am.

We actually play a few 9:30- 1:30 gigs.

Blue

Edited October 17, 2017 by blue

[Nicko]

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1508185695' post='3390401']
75-80 is where I'd like to be.

Blue
[/quote]

If I wanted to scratch a living at being in a band I guess I'd be looking for 1 function and at least a couple of pub gigs a week. 80 pub gigs in the UK would not be anywhere near enough to support myself.

[EliasMooseblaster]

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1508185518' post='3390397']
If the pubs are in residentially zoned areas, is that why you don't have 4 hour gigs?

Blue
[/quote]
[quote name='FinnDave' timestamp='1508185777' post='3390403']
Probably is in many cases, most of the pub gigs I play have strict curfew times, often half eleven or midnight - pub gigs after midnight are very rare in my experience. A lot of places don't want us to start until nine as people eat in pubs and want to enjoy their meals in peace.
[/quote]

There's actually a historical reason for calling last orders at 11: I believe limited licensing hours were brought into force during one of the two world wars. I think it was the second, as the government realised it was advantageous not to have workers drinking until the small hours in the middle of the week, and also to get everyone into their homes with the blackout curtains up before the night-time bombing raids began.

It was always assumed that the law would be repealed after the war ended. But, just like the hugely elevated tax we pay on alcohol in this country for similar reasons, the powers that be "conveniently forgot."

(Of course, twenty years after that, with the explosion of amplified music in pubs, you had to start considering the neighbours as well, so perhaps ironically there was a good reason to keep an 11pm curfew in place!)

[Nicko]

[quote name='EliasMooseblaster' timestamp='1508232271' post='3390628']
There's actually a historical reason for calling last orders at 11: I believe limited licensing hours were brought into force during one of the two world wars. I think it was the second, as the government realised it was advantageous not to have workers drinking until the small hours in the middle of the week, and also to get everyone into their homes with the blackout curtains up before the night-time bombing raids began.

It was always assumed that the law would be repealed after the war ended. But, just like the hugely elevated tax we pay on alcohol in this country for similar reasons, the powers that be "conveniently forgot."

(Of course, twenty years after that, with the explosion of amplified music in pubs, you had to start considering the neighbours as well, so perhaps ironically there was a good reason to keep an 11pm curfew in place!)
[/quote]

As far as I'm aware there is no requirement for last orders at 11 o'clock any more (all that changed with all day opening). My Local is licenced to serve drinks until midnight mon-thu, and til 1am fri-sat. They are only licenced for live music up to 11 IIRC. However, they choose to call time at 11.

[EliasMooseblaster]

[quote name='Nicko' timestamp='1508238857' post='3390697']
As far as I'm aware there is no requirement for last orders at 11 o'clock any more (all that changed with all day opening). My Local is licenced to serve drinks until midnight mon-thu, and til 1am fri-sat. They are only licenced for live music up to 11 IIRC. However, they choose to call time at 11.
[/quote]

There are certainly more places with later licences now - I know when they first bought in the legislation for late licensing, a standard licence meant you could sell from 11-11 each day, but you had to apply for extended hours. I don't know how many hoops the landlords/ladies had to jump through to be approved, but some clearly decided it wasn't worth the hassle. On the other hand, most of the Wetherspoons in my neck of the woods serve until midnight, and probably the most successful music pub in the area is much like your local - midnight in the week, 1am Fri and Sat.

[uk_lefty]

[quote name='radiophonic' timestamp='1507618247' post='3386732']
I can definitely see the attraction in the 'practice' being the main event. You get together and you play. That's the event. I enjoy playing gigs but there's plenty about [i]gigging [/i]that's a total PITA. It's nothing to do with hard work, it's about tedium, getting messed around and dealing with idiots. Hours of hanging around for one. City parking restrictions near venues. Arrangements bearing no relation to what you agreed. Sitting around in bars not being able to drink because of the playing and the driving. Sound guys not following the rider even though they've had it for three months (no monitors??). I spent an hour of Sunday evening just sitting on my rig out in the street because the promoter had given us the wrong load-in time. Then he let the band before us significantly over-run and let them stand around chatting on the stage afterwards, preventing us setting up, so our set-time (in the printed and electronic listings - it was a festival) was completely wrong and very late. As the icing on the cake, just as we were due to kick off, he announced that some urban artists (his mates, I assume) would be doing a two song showcase before we played. This basically killed the audience who were there for a world-music type programme. Just playing and recording definitely feels attractive a lot of the time.
[/quote]

Yep! I'm at a point now where I'm getting the impression my band wants to grow faster than I want. Gigs further away for more money. I don't think we are as good as the ambition yet and I don't have the time to put in to getting there. Sometimes I think going to a studio and helping someone bring their musical vision to a recording would be far less stress.
It's just my point in life, got a baby to support and a wife that I don't want to leave doing all the work while I go off doing band things. I drove over 2hrs for the last gig which I won't get paid for. It's created leads for other gigs but in even more remote places. I love the band, but need the balance in my life more.

[Left Foot]

Maybe they were trying to put you off blu, seeing as how that's so unpalatable.

[blue]

[quote name='uk_lefty' timestamp='1508262328' post='3390981']


Yep! I'm at a point now where I'm getting the impression my band wants to grow faster than I want. Gigs further away for more money. I don't think we are as good as the ambition yet and I don't have the time to put in to getting there. Sometimes I think going to a studio and helping someone bring their musical vision to a recording would be far less stress.
It's just my point in life, got a baby to support and a wife that I don't want to leave doing all the work while I go off doing band things. I drove over 2hrs for the last gig which I won't get paid for. It's created leads for other gigs but in even more remote places. I love the band, but need the balance in my life more.
[/quote]

I've debated this point on BC many times.

Guys with traditional jobs and young families are going to have a tough time with busy gigging bands.

We only have one venue that's a 2 hour drive. It's a 2k gig, I'm still not sure it's worth it.

Blue

Edited October 17, 2017 by blue

[FinnDave]

I drive an hour and a half each way for 50 or 60 British Pounds!