wateroftyne Posted October 12, 2017 Posted October 12, 2017 Listen to this from about 1m10s. When it shifts into the middle eight, it goes minor, but Duck cracks on with the usual line. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pGbj4u-6c0A Whaddya fink? Of course it's Duck, so I'm happy to accept that he's right, and everyone else is wrong :-) Quote
Dad3353 Posted October 12, 2017 Posted October 12, 2017 [quote name='wateroftyne' timestamp='1507808797' post='3388081']...Duck cracks on with the usual line.... [/quote] I don't agree; I hear the bass line change to follow the chords. Nowt out of kilter there, I say. Quote
wateroftyne Posted October 12, 2017 Author Posted October 12, 2017 Ahh.. it's jarring to me. I've just checked and he does it on the original, too. It must just be me.. Quote
Beedster Posted October 12, 2017 Posted October 12, 2017 [quote name='wateroftyne' timestamp='1507809851' post='3388094'] Ahh.. it's jarring to me. I've just checked and he does it on the original, too. It must just be me.. [/quote] Ha ha, there's a track on Street Legal by Dylan where the bass player plays a howler, it drives me crazy, but no-one else can hear it. Which of course means everyone else is just not as discerning as us Quote
Jus Lukin Posted October 12, 2017 Posted October 12, 2017 (edited) - Edited February 25, 2022 by Jus Lukin Quote
wateroftyne Posted October 12, 2017 Author Posted October 12, 2017 [quote name='Jus Lukin' timestamp='1507810454' post='3388101'] I hear it- the 'sixth' step of the first chord of the mid 8 is played major, but 'ought' to be minor, right? Or to put it more simply, the highest note of the phrase on that chord should be a semi-tone lower. I'm saying this without a bass in my hands to check, but that's how it sounds to me. [/quote] ^^^ exactly! Quote
wateroftyne Posted October 12, 2017 Author Posted October 12, 2017 [quote name='hiram.k.hackenbacker' timestamp='1507810874' post='3388107'] Is this at exactly 1m10s? [/quote] No - 1m22s. I suggested listening from a bit earlier to get some context. Quote
Dood Posted October 12, 2017 Posted October 12, 2017 [quote name='hiram.k.hackenbacker' timestamp='1507810874' post='3388107'] Is this at exactly 1m10s? [/quote] No, everything is fine at 1.10 - Listen to the note at 1.22 Quote
SubsonicSimpleton Posted October 12, 2017 Posted October 12, 2017 [quote name='wateroftyne' timestamp='1507808797' post='3388081'] Of course it's Duck, so I'm happy to accept that he's right, and everyone else is wrong :-) [/quote] Carole Kaye told me she deliberately played the major 6th over the minor chord to create tension when she recorded this. Quote
Dood Posted October 12, 2017 Posted October 12, 2017 Maybe Duck fancied a bit of a melodic minor line in there! Quote
Happy Jack Posted October 12, 2017 Posted October 12, 2017 [quote name='SubsonicSimpleton' timestamp='1507811580' post='3388118'] Carole Kaye told me she deliberately played the major 6th over the minor chord to create tension when she recorded this. [/quote] Was the matter ever resolved? Quote
chris_b Posted October 12, 2017 Posted October 12, 2017 Duck Dunn just about rescues crashing into the first chorus on Sam and Dave's Soul Man. If the groove was good then the mistakes stayed. Time and tape was expensive back then and most bass lines "disappeared" when you played the record on your Dansette or listened to it on the car radio. Quote
wateroftyne Posted October 12, 2017 Author Posted October 12, 2017 [quote name='hiram.k.hackenbacker' timestamp='1507812525' post='3388134'] If it's the note I think it is, doesn't he repeat it again afterwards? Still sounds fine to me though. [/quote] He does - it sounds wrong both times to me. ha ha. Quote
wateroftyne Posted October 12, 2017 Author Posted October 12, 2017 [quote name='chris_b' timestamp='1507813599' post='3388141'] Duck Dunn just about rescues crashing into the first chorus on Sam and Dave's Soul Man. If the groove was good then the mistakes stayed. Time and tape was expensive back then and most bass lines "disappeared" when you played the record on your Dansette or listened to it on the car radio. [/quote] Absolutely.. it's intriguing he kept it for the BB2000 recording, though. He must have been pretty convinced by it. Quote
chris_b Posted October 12, 2017 Posted October 12, 2017 6345789. . . . It's the same line as on the original. They tried to keep the same bass pattern running through the Middle 8 chord sequence. While it sounds OK to me, a different line could have sounded more "natural". Quote
Jus Lukin Posted October 12, 2017 Posted October 12, 2017 (edited) - Edited March 1, 2022 by Jus Lukin Quote
chris_b Posted October 12, 2017 Posted October 12, 2017 No, that was Martin Blunt. Pay attention. Quote
Buzzy Posted October 12, 2017 Posted October 12, 2017 It's wrong but it's also right (if that makes sense), anyway, who are we to question the mighty Duck. Quote
The Jaywalker Posted October 12, 2017 Posted October 12, 2017 (edited) . Edited November 28, 2017 by The Jaywalker Quote
Conan Posted October 12, 2017 Posted October 12, 2017 [quote name='The Jaywalker' timestamp='1507818961' post='3388194'] There's zero issue with playing a major 6th over a minor chord. It's absolutely normal. Lots more minor scales out there than Natural Minor/Aeolian ;-) [/quote] Quite. Quote
wateroftyne Posted October 12, 2017 Author Posted October 12, 2017 [quote name='The Jaywalker' timestamp='1507818961' post='3388194'] There's zero issue with playing a major 6th over a minor chord. It's absolutely normal. Lots more minor scales out there than Natural Minor/Aeolian ;-) [/quote] Gah.. it sounds so wishy-washy to my ears. I actually think he should have pedaled the root on the middle eight. It would have sounded so much better, and maybe the song might have been more of a commercial success. Quote
Dood Posted October 12, 2017 Posted October 12, 2017 [quote name='The Jaywalker' timestamp='1507818961' post='3388194'] There's zero issue with playing a major 6th over a minor chord. It's absolutely normal. Lots more minor scales out there than Natural Minor/Aeolian ;-) [/quote] Indeed! As I mentioned earlier. Thing is though, I think in this song it's a case of expectancy. The whole song is in D Major (D, G A etc) and the ear expects the Bm move to be Aeolian. So when the Major 6th comes in only in the bass, it's a note "in between the ones" that have been well trodden in the song. It sounds a little odd. No problem with that as an intention but it does sound out of place when we are SO used to the formulaic bile that can fill the popular music charts Quote
JapanAxe Posted October 12, 2017 Posted October 12, 2017 [quote name='wateroftyne' timestamp='1507809851' post='3388094'] Ahh.. it's jarring to me. I've just checked and he does it on the original, too. It must just be me.. [/quote] No. As you say, that's on the original, I transcribed it about 10 years ago and it still sounds out of place. If I were in the position of coming up with the line, I would most likely play an A note to suggest Bm7 - G natural would sound even odder against a Bm chord! Quote
ZilchWoolham Posted October 12, 2017 Posted October 12, 2017 That is actually very noticeable. It's low enough in the mix to not be all too jarring, though. Funny thing, psychoacoustics. Quote
musicbassman Posted October 12, 2017 Posted October 12, 2017 Yup, it sounds 'wrong' to me also - but hey - is this really important? The overall laid back feel to the line is the important thing! Quote
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