Raslee Posted October 29, 2017 Share Posted October 29, 2017 (edited) It's gonna be a 'how long is a piece of string, and an entirely subjective type enquiry', but essentially I am playing in a new band doing a genre I'm totally unfamiliar with playing -'90's grunge rock' ala Pearl Jam, Nirvana, Stone Temple Pilots, Foo Fighters, Smashing Pumpkins etc. I am used to mainly playing reggae and dirty funk for the last 20yrs or so and have never done the heavy rock thing until joining up with a few mates recently. Now I know researching some of the original players that there are fretless basses, various modulating effects, distorted bass, valve amps, & a lot of plectrums (something I'm not very good at) being used but I'm wondering where to start on a 'generic' pub gig EQ for this music with my gear - as I say I'm used to heavy low-end dub bass so am not accustomed to mids, hi's etc. I've done dirty funk many years ago with a typical smiley face EQ but that's about it - I've never adventured much with EQ. I also play entirely with fingers. At the first two rehearsals, I thought my sound was a little muddy and not really cutting through the guitars, although this may be entirely normal as it was the loudest thing I've heard in close proximity of two guitarists stacks within the last 10 years. So I would be grateful for any idea's, advice, thoughts on approaching this genre and using my gear in my signature below - particularly EQ settings to trial within the next practice. Thank you in advance. ......oh and ear plugs are on order (hope we eventually go acoustic...ahem!). Edited October 29, 2017 by Raslee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuzzie Posted October 29, 2017 Share Posted October 29, 2017 Welcome to the real world!! Firstly, if you like fingers, stay with it, plenty use fingers Robert Trujillo of Metallica for one and he is a beast. Where you have come from is a bass heavy music, so instead of accentuating a big low end, dial it back a bit and give the hi mids a push, but this will depend on where your guitarists are. Have they got massive humbuckers in Les Pauls pushing a big sound? If so there will be a sonic space you can occupy and lock in with the kick drum which will push your bass through. I would steer clear of effects to start, a good clean bass sound will be what you need, especially if your guitars are distorting. If you listen to Pantera for example, that’s fairly heavyweight, but the bass is clean as a whistle. Sure you will enjoy this, it’s a great genre Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lozz196 Posted October 29, 2017 Share Posted October 29, 2017 Well for that music I`d use the power & grunt of the Precision through the OTB500, with the Gain set to about 9 o`clock, and then use the B3 to eq in/out whatever is required. To cut through you need a lot more treble than sounds nice on its own, and more than sounds like it`s cutting through when you`re right next to the amp - try walking 15 feet in front of the amp as a tryout, you`ll find a lot more treble is needed than when you`re right on top of it. On the B3 get your graphic to cut mids around 350 - 400Hz, and boost them at around 2.5 - 3.5kHz, plus add in highs at around 4 - 5kHz. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyquipment Posted October 29, 2017 Share Posted October 29, 2017 Go clean with a little dirt - let the amp do the rest of the distortion or OD. Boost the mids and cut a little bit of low. I’ve been messing with the amp settings and got a reasonable grunge sludge sound out of it but again it’s subjective. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timhiggins Posted October 29, 2017 Share Posted October 29, 2017 (edited) Yes i agree with the above comments , basically do everything opposite to how you would normally achieve a nice sound, or be lost in the mix unless you are working with guitarists who actually listen to the bass in which case they might make some room for you ? can you tell i'm a little tainted by previous experiences ! Edited October 29, 2017 by timhiggins Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuzzie Posted October 29, 2017 Share Posted October 29, 2017 The above is so true, especially a sound where you think its sounds a bit poo and harsh on its own. Lozz loves a P, and i will gentlemanly disagree with him about needing a P. You can get where you need to be with a Jazz and slight favouring of the bridge Pup for the bite, but i depends on what else you have pumping the sound. Personally i have a Hartke VXL into a Cali76G (bit of germanium grit) into a Two Notes LeBass with passive Jazz bass and it does it for me. What is your set up? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T-Bay Posted October 29, 2017 Share Posted October 29, 2017 We play quite a few songs in this genre, I have used both my Precision and my Thunderbird, the Thunderbird always gets the compliments and sounds best to my ears. Always with fresh Roto 66s no more than 6 weeks old (I do practice a lot so they have a good few hours on by then). I use a TE combo and cab, EQ set to boost mids (bright strings seem to deliver top end). Mild compression on all the time. I have tried a variety of overdrive and not yet found one I am 100% happy with but have a TC mojomojo on its way which I hope will sort this. I always play finger style and it works for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raslee Posted October 29, 2017 Author Share Posted October 29, 2017 Thanks guys [quote name='Cuzzie' timestamp='1509302743' post='3397918'] -Have they got massive humbuckers in Les Pauls pushing a big sound? -I would steer clear of effects to start, a good clean bass sound will be what you need, especially if your guitars are distorting. -Sure you will enjoy this, it's a great genre [/quote] Yup, Les Paul ahoy! (too loud). Clean bass - perhaps my Markbasss head in that case? Enjoying some of the lines so far, quite liking STP's 'Plush' b-line [quote name='Lozz196' timestamp='1509302939' post='3397919'] Well for that music I`d use the power & grunt of the Precision through the OTB500, with the Gain set to about 9 o`clock, and then use the B3 to eq in/out whatever is required. To cut through you need a lot more treble than sounds nice on its own, and more than sounds like it`s cutting through when you`re right next to the amp - try walking 15 feet in front of the amp as a tryout, you`ll find a lot more treble is needed than when you`re right on top of it. On the B3 get your graphic to cut mids around 350 - 400Hz, and boost them at around 2.5 - 3.5kHz, plus add in highs at around 4 - 5kHz. [/quote] Good tips there mate - I'll dust of the B3 and make a note of those frequencies. [quote name='timhiggins' timestamp='1509304953' post='3397940'] - unless you are working with guitarists who actually listen to the bass in which case they might make some room for you? - can you tell I'm a little tainted by previous experiences! [/quote] Tim, do such guitarists exist ??? Tainted you??? ...your far too nice matey [quote name='Cuzzie' timestamp='1509307064' post='3397974'] What is your set up? [/quote] Probably favouring between switching between my 79 P and/or VanderEnd active Jazz. Will probably stick with the OTB, or maybe the Ashdown Retroglige for the EQ variables into my Markbass 2x10's stacked vertically. Was tempted to try my cheapy HB Fretless on the Pearl Jam numbers. [quote name='T-Bay' timestamp='1509307575' post='3397980'] We play quite a few songs in this genre, I have used both my Precision and my Thunderbird, the Thunderbird always gets the compliments and sounds best to my ears. Always with fresh Roto 66s no more than 6 weeks old (I do practice a lot so they have a good few hours on by then). I use a TE combo and cab, EQ set to boost mids (bright strings seem to deliver top end). Mild compression on all the time. I have tried a variety of overdrive and not yet found one I am 100% happy with but have a TC mojomojo on its way which I hope will sort this. I always play fingerstyle and it works for me. [/quote] Cheers for the tips, new strings a must! Never tried a Thunderbird, always thought they look cool. Will have a dabble with some compression. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingrayPete1977 Posted October 29, 2017 Share Posted October 29, 2017 No harm in cracking out a plectrum just for fun but you dont need one or a P bass to get where you want, Pearl Jam is mainly fretless for a start! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T-Bay Posted October 29, 2017 Share Posted October 29, 2017 [quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1509313454' post='3398051'] No harm in cracking out a plectrum just for fun but you dont need one or a P bass to get where you want, Pearl Jam is mainly fretless for a start! [/quote] One of the reasons a fretless is on my Christmas list! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuzzie Posted October 29, 2017 Share Posted October 29, 2017 From my small knowledge i would def go for the OTB - that will be immense. At the risk of being vilified, MB cabs can be a little wooly or boxy in the mids, so that judicious EQ will be needed. Punch is king here i reckon, but sounds like you are well on the way Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingrayPete1977 Posted October 29, 2017 Share Posted October 29, 2017 From my limited experience the other way around you don't get the room in the grunge genre that you do in reggae to enjoy the dubby goodness, two les pauls will soak up the bottom end so you want to get into the mids more but I'd suggest cutting your lows rather than upping anything first and see how that sounds, good luck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maude Posted October 30, 2017 Share Posted October 30, 2017 [quote name='T-Bay' timestamp='1509313559' post='3398053'] One of the reasons a fretless is on my Christmas list! [/quote] Add a twelve string to that list if you're doing 'Jeremy' as well Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicko Posted October 30, 2017 Share Posted October 30, 2017 I play this genre quite a lot and use a P bass with a floor mounted graphic eq set as a sad face to boost the mids. Sounds fine through the markbass. Occasionally I add some compression. I really couldn't get on using an active bass in this context, but each to his own. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conan Posted October 30, 2017 Share Posted October 30, 2017 [quote name='Raslee' timestamp='1509299398' post='3397889']'90's grunge rock' ala Pearl Jam, Nirvana, Stone Temple Pilots, Foo Fighters, Smashing Pumpkins etc. [/quote] Although the "grunge rock" genre might seem quite homogeneous if you are not used to it, all of those bands have quite different styles (and especially the bass players). I'm not sure there is one "grunge" sound that would work with all of these, but as others have already suggested, plenty of mids in your EQ will definitely help with making the bass heard - too bassy and it will turn to mud. Out of all that lot I would say that some of my favourite bass lines come from the Stone Temple Pilots. No idea what bass he uses though! Plush is an awesome track http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V5UOC0C0x8Q Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timhiggins Posted October 30, 2017 Share Posted October 30, 2017 It looks like he's playing an Epiphone rivoli which has to be the bass most unlikely to cut through a heavy guitar mix ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyquipment Posted October 31, 2017 Share Posted October 31, 2017 I love ravioli. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conan Posted October 31, 2017 Share Posted October 31, 2017 [quote name='tonyquipment' timestamp='1509455804' post='3399033'] I love ravioli. [/quote] http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t-jK37C4CxA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SonnyBassPlayer Posted October 31, 2017 Share Posted October 31, 2017 Reading your signature I would suggest P bass + Orange Terror with a good amount of preamp gain: just start flat EQ and add some grit to it. Not the old school "farty" fat grit but some higher end grit. Just in case, something like a VT-Bass pedal by Tech21 totally nails those sounds IMHO. Those bands are all different but since it's not a tribute but I guess a cover band (since you play more artists) you could keep it fingerstyle with a basic tone for all and eventually buld some spefic sounds for specific songs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raslee Posted October 31, 2017 Author Share Posted October 31, 2017 (edited) Cheers for the continued advice guys, but Ravioli...WTF [quote name='SonnyBassPlayer' timestamp='1509465789' post='3399152'] Reading your signature I would suggest P bass + Orange Terror with a good amount of preamp gain: just start flat EQ and add some grit to it. Not the old school "farty" fat grit but some higher end grit. Just in case, something like a VT-Bass pedal by Tech21 totally nails those sounds IMHO. Those bands are all different but since it's not a tribute but I guess a cover band (since you play more artists) you could keep it fingerstyle with a basic tone for all and eventually buld some spefic sounds for specific songs. [/quote] Yes the Orange does a nice overdriven sound but I'm quite tempted to try my Ashdown Retroglide which has specific EQ sliders which may be good for the EQing Lozz suggested plus i haven't really had chance to give the Ashdown a good outing yet - perhaps add some drive effects too. I do find the EQ on the OTB fairly limited TBH but i love the core tone. I'll probabaly get the Zoom B3 out again for some light effects; I was dabbling with Alice in Chains 'Rooster', last night and could hear a bit of flanger or something...I'm thinking perhaps a muff, flanger and compressor on the B3 for a simple set up. I've got a few weeks before the next rehearsal as it's a very relaxed band and we only get together every 6 weeks or so. We're all half decent ish players so it's hoped we can come together and viola...but that ain't quite happening for moi as i wrestle in search of the new Boosh sound/tone Edited October 31, 2017 by Raslee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conan Posted November 1, 2017 Share Posted November 1, 2017 [quote name='Raslee' timestamp='1509474505' post='3399282']... it's hoped we can come together and viola...[/quote] You have a strings section?!?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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