Teaching bass

[bassjamm]

Hi guys,

I'm thinking of starting to get into teaching bass a bit more. I've dabbled before but never really seriously so or anything like that. One thing i've always found hard is what to teach a student, and how to get that across.

Do any of you have any advice? I'd be interested to hear how you'd take a complete beginner and the sort of process you'd follow?

I've thought about getting a few books to follow, or some of the grade books but didn't know whether thated work or not?

Anyway, any thoughts or advice would be really great thanks guys.

Jamie

[Bilbo]

Responsibly.

I always tailor each lesson to the specific needs of the individual, using what motivates them to progress and tying it in with the core professional skills and knowledge. If some whats the intro to a Guns & Roses song, I will explain what key it is in and why and teach them what they want to know and why it works.

[bassjamm]

Thanks for your reply...

But what about teaching from the ery start, how do you approach that? The student may want to learn the latest and greatest bass line but they may not yet know how to play even the simpliest thing...how do you help them get the basics down/what order do you teach them the basics etc?

[Bilbo]

Someone that much of a beginner I would encourage to learn how to tune the instrument and then teach them some really basic bass parts to 'get them going'. I would then start to give them some basic information regarding names of strings and scales to give them something to pin them to.

[dudewheresmybass]

i use and have been using the book Bass Guitar by Gregroy and Vinson (IIRC) to teach for the past twelve years.

the way this book is written and set out makes it easy to help someone find their way through the potential maze of techniques and 'great songs'

all of my pupils, past and present have learnt huge things from this book, and it is a great starting point to start peoples creative juices going whilst learning basic techniques.

I'm not suggesting that you go through this (or any other) book verbatim, but it has exercises that progress logically, and will open discussions into further things.

the essential thing is that if you are going to use a book as a springboard, it must suit YOUR teaching style, and the skill of teaching is how you teach you student to apply the lesson / technique / song to their style, and how well it sticks in their playing over time ( subject to practice of course!)

In doing this each lesson becomes relevant to each student, and as you get to know your student better, you will be able to suggest ideas / styles / players that they have never heard of before, which will encourage them on their own musical journey.

[bassjamm]

Thanks for that kind sir!!!

I'll check out the book...i used Dave Overthrow's Bass Methods when learning, i guess i could get involved with them again and see what happened.

I do understand that each lesson has to tailored to the student, that's a given, but i still feel as though i need to have to kind of direction/plan and the guide them to the end result. I find it too easy to get confused and lose track otherwise.

[Tait]

i was quite good at bass when i started lessons, because it taught myself at first. but my guitar teacher has a beginner have his lesson before me and i always sit on the end of the lesson, and he always ends the lesson by asking firstly "name the strings from top to bottom" (so EBGDAE) then to do it the other way around. then he asks sort of fret 3 A string? and just asks a load of frets on different strings. then he asks them to play different notes, he doesnt usually mind what position they play them in as long as its the right note.

i'd begin by teaching them to read tab. teach them about root notes, and how to construct a simple bassline using roots, fifths and octaves. take a guitar to the lesson, then play some chords and get them to write a bassline. ask what music they like, base the music you ask them to write basslines for around that. read up on the bass players of their favourite bands - this will get you far. you'll know the style of basslines you want to teach them to begin with (progress to different styles later, but its more important to be able to play music you like IMO so you can set up a band to get experience and so you enjoy it), and what sort of technique they should be using (pick, fingers, slap etc.) - obvioulsy you should teach them all these techniques eventually, but to begin with teach them what they need to play their favourite style of music. this is all coming from someone who has never taught a bass lesson before, so i wouldnt rely on my reply too much, but this is the kind of stuff i'd plan for a beginner. IMO the most important thing is that both you and the student enjoy it.

one lesson i really enjoyed (although is probably better for a more advanced player) with my old bass teacher was when he took a song i was only vaguely familiar with and not the sort of music i'd normally play (message in the bottle - the police, if anyone cares), and told me to rewrite the bassline. not necessarily make it better, but just rewrite it. he played the song through once, so i could get familiar with the bassline sting put down, but wouldnt let me work out stings bassline because that ruins the fun. he just showed me what the guitar was playing, told me the chords and then played it on guitar. it was a brilliant lesson.

another thing im doing in lessons now is recording an entirely bass song (except a MIDI drum track). my bass teacher has written down a chord progression that doesn't follow a specific key, just random, fairly complex chords. then he's written random timings next to each chord. i've already recorded the chords (which i had to work out) on bass. now im working on what is IMO the hardest part, the actual bassline. this is difficult because of the different timings and chords that don't work together, yet it has to be a smooth bassline that all fits together well, and follow a similar groove, even though each bar has a different timing. finally im going to record a melody played up high over it. its good fun, but one of the most difficult things ive ever done on bass. i'll have to put up my finished recording when its done. obviously, this isnt suitable for beginners, but its great for a more advanced player who is willing to put a lot of time and effort into their lessons.

as i've said, this is coming from a guy who has never taught bass! the only experience i've had is having had 4 bass teachers and 5 guitar teachers in my 4 years playing bass and 7 playing guitar. i get through em fast, don't i?

Edited November 10, 2008 by LWTAIT

[bassjamm]

That's great stuff thanks man...it all helps!!!

I'm getting an idea now, but any other input would be greatfully recieved!

Thanks
Jamie

[Bass-ic]

Hi Jamie.
loads of good advice already here. However, from a beginners point of veiw i thought i would add my pennys' worth.
I have been teaching myself for about a year now. I am lucky because i can read music, although i am able to read treble clef. I am very slow reading bass clef. I would like to learn to read it better. I have taught myself about 30 or so songs ranging from dire straights to muse to coldplay etc. Mostly stuff that i like and own on CD etc, and i have singled oout the ones that i feel have the easier bass lines. I have tried to teach myself 'its my life' by talk talk but just cannot get the 2nd bit where it starts to leap about a bit, even if i slow my tascam right down.

Id like my technique to be a bit better, and i worry that my left hand is learning too many bad habits.
I warm up with a few finger lessons taht i got off the internet from Dave Marks. I am also working my way through the Guy Pratt bass tutor on line, plus i have bass guitar for dummies etc.

So this is a picture of someone with a very small amount of knowledge. I am also looking for a tutor right now. I dont know enough about the tutors in my area, andam on a recce as we speak.

I hope it hleps from looking at the other end of the scale, I am sure I am not the only one like this that you may come across.

Musically, i am open to idea of what i want to be able to play. I certainly am not going to be another jaco, but i wouldn't mind learning some 'classic' bass lines and how to make some up, ie patterns and the like..( i think thats what i mean)

I hope that helps.
Good luck

Matt

[bassjamm]

Matt - that's pricesless thanks mate!!! Seriously great info and insight though my friend!!!

I'll take on board what you've said for sure and see if i can incorporate it into what i'll be teaching!

Thanks
Jamie

[Jebo1]

Teaching is a big responsibility, and I think if you take that attitude, you'll be ok. £25 an hour is a lot of money, so I always used to try and put £25 worth of effort in :-)

After a while you acquire a set of materials you can use, and get to know how to approach lessons.

I used to teach 1-1 and a GNVQ course in bass guitar, and to be honest, I don't think I am the right person to be teaching, it's an aptitude you either have or don't. You'll figure it out after a while.

The idea of a course book s a good one, lessons should challenge, and a bass teacher should know better than most, so mix it up! Funk, rock, jazz, reggae. People need to constantly be challenged.

A laptop is an amazing resource too, no need to drag around loads of CDs, you can write your own music in Sibelius, you can trawl for resources and you can ask questions to us on Basschat!

Good luck

[jakenewmanbass]

Hi Jamie,
I have taught at all levels from beginner through to degree courses and everything inbetween. (and I teach a few basschatters) there is a huge amount needed to be really comprehensive as a teacher so without going on for too long I'll try and explain what I consider to be a few central tenets of teaching and the demands they place upon the teacher.

First and most importantly never be afraid to admit to a student that you don't know something, it's far better to examine something new along with a student, as, being better than them (I would hope) you will have quicker insight, and more exhaustive analysis available to you, this will make the process of learning honest and interesting for both teacher and student.

Remember that you are also learning all the time so show humility and willingness to absorb insights and abilities that the student may have, again this will encourage honesty and trust, a crucial part of the student teacher relationship.

Moving into the domain of material, you MUST know your stuff, and you should have a huge range of material at which you are expert. If there is an area you don't cover make that clear before taking the student on. Teaching should ensure that you have many different ways of approaching a subject, which should enable you to tailor the approach of delivery to the student in a way that is appropriate to their methods of understanding and ability to absorb, as their teacher, analysis and understanding of this process is your responsibility, If they aren't getting it, it is most likely your fault, you should be able to motivate and excite the laziest people on earth with your enthusiasm for and knowledge of your subject.

Be clear in your explanations and stop to ask if you are being understood, remember that it's really easy to over-face people who may have difficulty with what you find easy because you have been doing it for years.

Education requires repetition, ask if it's understood... do it again... ask if it's understood...

Be encouraging and complimentary, tell people what you think they can achieve, be realistic so they do and work out what it would take to keep pushing beyond their most recent boundaries.. build, build, build.

Show the student the areas of your playing at which you still work, let them know that it's an ongoing process so they can understand and have empathy, this will embolden their whole outlook. In this country we are reluctant to admit to not knowing for fear of ridicule, showing a student that you are still learning will help with their self esteem. Having a student open to you will speed the process enormously. Your primary skill requirements are gaining trust and understanding of exactly how a student will improve quickest.

Lastly examine your own playing... BE HONEST... about your strong points, and your weak points. realise from that honesty what you have to offer. It might be a good feel, great time, strong reading abilities, anything you do well... don't underestimate what use the simple things you take for granted are for a student.

Let them see your love of music. It's infectious I promise.

Hope thats useful. feel free to PM me with specific questions.

Jake

PS remember that becoming a teacher does not mean it's time for you to stop having lessons.

Edited November 10, 2008 by jakesbass

[7string]

Agreed, there's loads of good info here.

With a complete beginner, after some preliminary note names and so on, I try to get them playing along with a song that they like even if it's just the tonic of the song's key. That get them used to playing and gives confidence that the lessons will get them to be the player they want to be.

I've found that starting in the key of C and explaining major scales and then diatonic chords has been a good road to go down. To help with that, I've recorded some simple chord progressions that a student can loop and experiment playing over. I think that giving the opportunity to experiment with sound and note choice helps students to be unafraid of making mistakes. Sometimes, if a player hits a wrong note they would stop, start at the beginning, make the same error, stop, go back to the beginning and so on. This loop leads to nothing but frustration which results in less playing, less practice and a lack of progress. Everyone, without exception, makes some mistakes when they play so saying that mistakes are normal and to carry on regardless gives a freedom to playing the bass. I'm not saying that mistakes are a good thing, but if a player recognises the mistake but carries on until the end of the song this will be of benefit in band situations. The rest of the band may be playing well and so stopping a song in mid-stream because of one small mistake (which they may even not have noticed) can waste rehearsal time and get on poeple's nerves.

I always ask that if the student has a song that they really want to play to e-mail it to me before their lesson. That gives me the time to learn it myself and to work out a simplified line that they can play. Giving a student something that they want to play and enjoy playing makes them want to play, which means they practice more and so they get better quicker.

I always try to remember that both giving lessons and receiving the information should always be fun and that people receive information in different ways. I have a student who remembers that a music teacher at school could only explain major scales in one way and that if a pupil didn't understand it then they were simply stupid. As a teacher, I have to be prepared to explain the same things in different ways and that's part of the fun of teaching

[bassjamm]

Again...huge thanks guys.

Some really awesome info coming out here and it's trully helping.

I think my problem is simply a lack of experience. I taught when i was younger but didn't continue with it. I'd consider myself competant enough to teach the bass, but lack of experience is certainly an un-nerving hurdle which will only be overcome by gaining experience i guess.

I suppose i could liken it to gigging...at one time i had no experience and found it daunting, now i have oooooooddles of experience from acoustic sessions to full on massive stage 1000's of people kind of experience. But it took the first gig which led to the next etc.

Thanks again everyone!!!