Powered small bass speaker to use as a monitor

[Phil Starr]

Hope it works out Al. I've got a couple of the 12" versions, really reliable and sound great. Back to learning 'The Final Countdown'

 

[Jack]

Don't discount the Alto TX range. I have two of the TX10s as stage monitors and they're just fine for bass as long as you have reasonable low-end expectations. 

[MoonBassAlpha]

I played a bit of bass through my Wharfedale Titan 8 when I first got them - not really usable for bass at any volume, I'm afraid. Active ones may be better if they've got fancy dsp going on, but not the passives. Hope that helps.

[Bridgehouse]

Having just got the QSC K10.2, how about the 8" version the K8.2 - it's real compact and has a Bass Amp DSP programme built in..(er, and it's 2000w peak/1200w constant....)

[MOSCOWBASS]

This looks interesting, available powered. 

http://www.masoundworks.com/manage.numo?pid=27&module=shopping_cart&component=catalog&cid=1

[Al Krow]

47 minutes ago, Bridgehouse said:

Having just got the QSC K10.2, how about the 8" version the K8.2 - it's real compact and has a Bass Amp DSP programme built in..(er, and it's 2000w peak/1200w constant....)

Yup I was thinking exactly the same thing having just read your FRFR post! Can you tell me a bit more about the Bass Amp DSP programme - sounds like it should be able to handle bass guitar without the f***ting / generally poor low end responsiveness that some of the more budget monitors suffer a lot from? 

At £660 (I think) the K8.2 isn't cheap but hey sometimes you have to pay extra for quality, right?! It's about 50% smaller than the K10, but still a fair bit bigger than (and more than three times the price of) the Titan recommend by Phil.

Edited November 20, 2017 by Al Krow

[Bridgehouse]

To be honest, I've not experienced any f**ting out - if you go direct in from a passive bass you can set it to instrument level input (as opposed to line) set it to Bass Amp (which is some digital sound processing - i.e. a preshaped curve) and tweak EQ

I've had it at 12 o'clock on the volume setting for that channel and had my preamp at about 75% volume - there was no f**ting out - I had to stop there as the radiator was rattling off its brackets and books were falling off my shelf.. any more and the windows would have been out. No f**ting out at all.

[Al Krow]

QSC  K8

@BridgehouseThat sounds really promising, cheers and I'm glad your windows are still intact. I really like the fact that it has two independent channels each with a separate volume control.  We'll be putting through an aux in from the mixer with vocals and acoustic into the first channel, and a separate line from my amp DI out into second channel.

The K8 (i.e. original) is 'just' 1000W which should be more than plenty for the small monitor use and is < £500, so that may be the more appropriate option for us rather than the K8.2.

Other uses?

It kinda almost feels wrong to be limiting this to monitor only and not part of our actual PA! We're using a pair of RCF 310 Mk II active speakers for our PA, but this seems to be a step up from each of those (and to be fair is quite a bit more expensive). But if it doubles up as:

i) a capable bass practice amp for band rehearsals (and it's got a line out to link it up to studio speakers, if needed, for additional low end), and

ii) a bass only stage monitor for those gigs where everything is going through FOH,

Then it will be earning its keep!

[Phil Starr]

Al the QSC is a whole lot more capable than the Wharfedale. I didn't think we were in that budget region. There's also the RCF to look at if that is your price range. Both fantastic speakers

The Titan 's shortcomings are in the plastic mounded cab which resonates with high bass levels. My estimation is that at less than a metre from the drummer it won't need to be that loud though and it would be an order of magnitude better than the Behringer 205D in this respect. I still think it would do the original job of drummers monitor but you won't be playing bass straight through it.

The advantage of any speaker with DSP is that they won't ever fart out. The limiters in the DSP will stop that happening, the QSC may even have multi channel limiters where the bass is limited separately, you'd have to look that up. If it has two channel mixing on the speaker the drummer could mix in the feed from the PA to their monitor.

Dont believe the 1000W thing though, there isn't an 8" speaker on earth that could handle that. The figure you should be looking at is the output in dB which is way louder than you'd ever need, 

[Al Krow]

Cheers Phil. I do have some flexibility to go above the Titan pricing - I was initially considering a PJB PB100, earlier in the thread, which are around the £400 mark newl. So these additional options are very interesting, and portability still being a key consideration for me (being both one of the oldest members of my two bands,  having some of the heaviest gear to cart around already in the shape of my bass amp, bass and general gubbins AND somehow also being responsible for the PA, oh yes, booking gigs, rehearsals, general admin etc...you know the story! I guess it's called being "the bass player", right? )

So it seems from what you're saying that DSP is key and I'm not sure whether the K8 has DSP or only the K8.2, so that is something for me to check? From what I could tell from the back of the QSC it doesn't appear that there was independent channel limiters other than volume, but hey it will be a very significant improvement over the current set up we're using with the Behringer 205D!  

In terms of the RCF - were you thinking of the TT08-A model? If so, these seem to be retailing at c. £1,200 which is definitely beyond our desired budget!

[Ghost_Bass]

Why a monitor? if it's just the bass that's needed for the drummer you could get a cheap used bass combo (behringer ultrabass with the kick-back recess for example) for not a lot of money and get the send of your main rig in to the return of the combo.

[Al Krow]

9 minutes ago, Ghost_Bass said:

Why a monitor? if it's just the bass that's needed for the drummer you could get a cheap used bass combo (behringer ultrabass with the kick-back recess for example) for not a lot of money and get the send of your main rig in to the return of the combo.

In a word portability. As is hopefully clear from the OP (?) I really don't want to have to cart yet one more heavy thing to gigs - I've got enough for my old frame to be dealing with already! So unfortunately I think your suggestion of a Behringer UB Combo is actually the complete opposite of what I'm looking for here!  (But as ever I appreciate you taking the time to make a suggestion).

So If I can replace our existing very lightweight B205D monitor with something better, but still lightweight, that's ideal. (If I can't we'll simply have to stick to what we have and make do). If the replacement monitor can then double up as a lightweight amp for rehearsals then even better. The QSC K8 which @Bridgehouse suggested seems to be ticking a lot of boxes for me...

[Bridgehouse]

1 minute ago, Al Krow said:

In a word portability. As is hopefully clear from the OP (?) I really don't want to have to cart yet one more heavy thing to gigs - I've got enough for my old frame to be dealing with already! So unfortunately I think your suggestion of a Behringer UB Combo is actually the complete opposite of what I'm looking for here!  (But as ever I appreciate you taking the time to make a suggestion).

So If I can replace our existing very lightweight B205D monitor with something better, but still lightweight, that's ideal. (If I can't we'll simply have to stick to what we have and make do). If the replacement monitor can then double up as a lightweight amp for rehearsals then even better. The QSC K8 which @Bridgehouse suggested seems to be ticking a lot of boxes for me...

The k10.2 is 14kg. So the K8.2 will be a lot less than that. 

Another of my band mates (keyboards) uses a k10 gen 1 and the differences are quite large. The digital display on the back of the 10.2 is great - you can see exactly what's going on - no silly switches to look at in the dark before a gig

It's actually very easy to carry about - the 8 will be even more so. It also just felt a bit better made than the DXR10.

There is an irritating blue led light on the front - but guess what? You can turn it off in the settings! 

As with anything tho - it's worth going into a shop and hearing one...

[fretmeister]

Yamaha DXR series.

[Al Krow]

12 minutes ago, fretmeister said:

Yamaha DXR series.

Check this out as to why QSC Ks seem to be a better option vs the Yamaha DXR series!

25 minutes ago, Bridgehouse said:

The k10.2 is 14kg. So the K8.2 will be a lot less than that. 

Another of my band mates (keyboards) uses a k10 gen 1 and the differences are quite large. The digital display on the back of the 10.2 is great - you can see exactly what's going on - no silly switches to look at in the dark before a gig

It's actually very easy to carry about - the 8 will be even more so. It also just felt a bit better made than the DXR10.

There is an irritating blue led light on the front - but guess what? You can turn it off in the settings! 

As with anything tho - it's worth going into a shop and hearing one...

The blue led light will be good way to annoy the drummer (it's for her benefit that I'm going to all this trouble!). Anyway of making it more garish via the settings? 

Totally agree it would be good to hear one 'in the flesh' before committing - whereabouts are you based and which shop did you get to try yours at?

[Bridgehouse]

1 minute ago, Al Krow said:

Check this out as to why QSC Ks seem to be a better option vs the Yamaha DXR series!

The blue led light will be good way to annoy the drummer (it's for her benefit that I'm going to all this trouble!). Anyway of making it more garish via the settings? 

Totally agree it would be good to hear one 'in the flesh' before committing - whereabouts are you based and which shop did you get to try yours at?

PMT in Nottingham. PMT stock both Yamaha and QSC. They also have basses handy to plug in

[Al Krow]

Cheers B! There are a couple of PMT stores within reasonable distance from me (Romford and Shoreditch) and I actually got my Yammy BB425 from them at a good 'end of line' price and have been very happy with the purchase...

[Bridgehouse]

9 minutes ago, Al Krow said:

Cheers B! There are a couple of PMT stores within reasonable distance from me (Romford and Shoreditch) and I actually got my Yammy BB425 from them at a good 'end of line' price and have been very happy with the purchase...

Romford will have them I bet..

[fretmeister]

26 minutes ago, Al Krow said:

Check this out as to why QSC Ks seem to be a better option vs the Yamaha DXR series!

The blue led light will be good way to annoy the drummer (it's for her benefit that I'm going to all this trouble!). Anyway of making it more garish via the settings? 

Totally agree it would be good to hear one 'in the flesh' before committing - whereabouts are you based and which shop did you get to try yours at?

Interesting.

I've got the DXR10 and I'm really happy with it.

 

As it happens though I think  (about 90% decided) that I'm going to stick with my Barefaced cabs for bass use and power them with my tiny Tecamp Puma 300. Total weight is lower as the Puma is only 2.2 lb.

 

I don't play out anywhere on guitar so I'll get some good desktop monitors instead.

[Bridgehouse]

Just now, fretmeister said:

Interesting.

I've got the DXR10 and I'm really happy with it.

 

As it happens though I think  (about 90% decided) that I'm going to stick with my Barefaced cabs for bass use and power them with my tiny Tecamp Puma 300. Total weight is lower as the Puma is only 2.2 lb.

 

I don't play out anywhere on guitar so I'll get some good desktop monitors instead.

I tried the DXR10 first and it sounded great. I was ready to get my money out.

Then the guy said "Try the k10.2"

Grrrr

[fretmeister]

Yeah - the price difference is quite noticeable!

 

If I was only playing guitar then I'd probably get the Red Sound RS LG12 Active. It's a great unit, but not made for bass use. Best guitar one I've heard though.

[Phil Starr]

5 hours ago, Al Krow said:

Cheers Phil. I do have some flexibility to go above the Titan pricing - I was initially considering a PJB PB100, earlier in the thread, which are around the £400 mark newl. So these additional options are very interesting, and portability still being a key consideration for me (being both one of the oldest members of my two bands,  having some of the heaviest gear to cart around already in the shape of my bass amp, bass and general gubbins AND somehow also being responsible for the PA, oh yes, booking gigs, rehearsals, general admin etc...you know the story! I guess it's called being "the bass player", right? )

So it seems from what you're saying that DSP is key and I'm not sure whether the K8 has DSP or only the K8.2, so that is something for me to check? From what I could tell from the back of the QSC it doesn't appear that there was independent channel limiters other than volume, but hey it will be a very significant improvement over the current set up we're using with the Behringer 205D!  

In terms of the RCF - were you thinking of the TT08-A model? If so, these seem to be retailing at c. £1,200 which is definitely beyond our desired budget!

There's this http://www.rcf.it/en_US/products/pro-speaker-systems/art-7-series/art-708-a-mk4 They used to do one in the 3 series too but that seems to have gone. I was going to suggest PMT too. One of the few places you get to try out PA gear with a reasonable range of stock.

[Al Krow]

58 minutes ago, Phil Starr said:

There's this http://www.rcf.it/en_US/products/pro-speaker-systems/art-7-series/art-708-a-mk4 They used to do one in the 3 series too but that seems to have gone. I was going to suggest PMT too. One of the few places you get to try out PA gear with a reasonable range of stock.

Ok now you're talking! Bax is doing the RCF 708A Mk4 for £319 which is less than half the price of the QSC K8.2 and only 15% bigger in terms of volume, but actually 13% lighter!

That should definitely makes the RCF a contender, but I think it is really a one input monitor. So I think the QSC K8.2 wins on power, quality(?) and flexible inputs with independent volume controls. And although it's subjective the, QSC just looks better in terms of design and finish (to me anyway!). I'm actually now thinking that it could have triple use:

a) rehearsal combo;

b) monitor for gigs;

c) back up (insurance) amp in case my main gigging amp fails part way through a gig.

If it does have all three uses, instead of just helping keeping me and my drummer 'tight', then forking out nearly £660 for an upgrade to a £145 Behringer 205D + £13.50 stand (which are likely to appear in the FS in due course!) starts to make a lot more sense, and will be a complete step up in terms of power and use from the PJB PB-100 I started out thinking might be the best option at  the start of this thread! 

Looks like BC has done its time fabled trick of providing some great 'group wisdom' whilst assisting in emptying my pockets of all change...

Looking forward to a trip to PMT in the very near future!

Edited November 20, 2017 by Al Krow

[Cuzzie]

Bas I have a PJB bass cub which is small, light, comes with a should carry bag and has 2 inputs which will do your bass and vocals (it has an XLR mic input) or something else into it.

how about a PJB ear box?

http://www.pjbworld.com/product_earbox.html

[Al Krow]

That's a nice thought Mr Cuzzie, but the consensus on this thread seems to be that a PJB at 100W is not going to 'cut it' as an onstage monitor (and is in fact less powered than my existing 150W B205D - although the PJB will be in a different league in terms of quality and bass handling, I agree).

The QSC K8.2, in comparison, is likely to be the difference between:

And  this...