If you could only choose one dirt pedal?

[totorbass]

23 hours ago, dannybuoy said:

I keep the gain fairly low on the Blower Box too, it sounds shite otherwise!

I like the Vintage, but not as much as the B3K/B7K circuit for my current sound. I'm using a BB1025X with both pickups on, which results in a scooped sound like a Jazz bass. Something about that bass combined with the B3K/B7K makes it slot right into the mix like a glove with barely any EQ adjustments. I find I have to tweak the EQ quite a bit if I flip the amp over to Vintage mode.

Both Darkglass drives though have a similar characteristic where they let the low end through clean and uncompressed, just distorting the mids. Kind of like a solid state clean bass amp mixed in parallel with a distorted guitar amp. This works great for aggressive or dynamic playing styles, but sometimes you want the full range of the signal to be compressed and driven, making a sound like an old cranked amp pushing a speaker to its limits. That's what pedals like the Tonehammer and Bearfoot Blueberry do so well, it works great for more mellow slower numbers. The M900 amp can't really do that tone alone, but you can flip the Microtubes engine off and you have a clean transparent amp that you can then dirty up with one of the aforementioned units.

Also have to give a shout to the Pike Vulcan - it's like a less scooped B3K and brighter more agressive Vintage crammed into a single box, with a blend knob between both sounds. In short it can approximate both the main Darkglass sounds and costs less than either one of them!

I agree, about the Blower Box.

Your description of the Darkglass core sound does make sense. I find the Pike pretty close from what  I hear on YT. (but a vulcan needs very good ears )

Edited November 29, 2017 by totorbass
pic added

[dannybuoy]

@CRV, sounds like what you are describing is the EQ being before the gain / clipping stage. Easy to tell if this is the case by boosting the bass to see if it results in more distortion or not.

I think the DHA has all the EQ post-distortion - which I prefer since you can boost the low end without overly bloating the distortion, and use the treble control to reign in the high frequency content generated by the clipping.

As a different example, the SFT and Earthquaker Monarch have their EQ before the clipping. The Tonehammer as far as I can tell has the mids before clipping, and the bass/treble afterwards (which I think is the best all round approach!).

Edited November 28, 2017 by dannybuoy

[dannybuoy]

Testing out the MP3 upload feature of the new site...

This is a recording I did a while back of the BB1025X into the Cali Compact Bass into the M900 amp on B3K mode, with a bit of Phase 90 then Blower Box added at the end (it's a bit long so just fast forward!). Preamp out from the M900 into the PJB Bighead which I used as a USB recording interface.

Will do a brief clip of how this sounds in a mix, and another of the P-Bass + Tonehammer at some point...

ATM.mp3

Edited November 28, 2017 by dannybuoy

[CRV]

31 minutes ago, dannybuoy said:

@CRV, sounds like what you are describing is the EQ being before the gain / clipping stage. Easy to tell if this is the case by boosting the bass to see if it results in more distortion or not.

I think the DHA has all the EQ post-distortion - which I prefer since you can boost the low end without overly bloating the distortion, and use the treble control to reign in the high frequency content generated by the clipping.

As a different example, the SFT and Earthquaker Monarch have their EQ before the clipping. The Tonehammer as far as I can tell has the mids before clipping, and the bass/treble afterwards (which I think is the best all round approach!).

Hi! I don't know exactly if it is pre-gain or if it is post-gain. But I will check it out. When you say "boosting the bass", you mean boosting the master volume of my combo? Or do you mean boosting the "Bass" knob from the EQ of the pedal?

[totorbass]

1 hour ago, dannybuoy said:

@CRV, sounds like what you are describing is the EQ being before the gain / clipping stage. Easy to tell if this is the case by boosting the bass to see if it results in more distortion or not.

I think the DHA has all the EQ post-distortion - which I prefer since you can boost the low end without overly bloating the distortion, and use the treble control to reign in the high frequency content generated by the clipping.

As a different example, the SFT and Earthquaker Monarch have their EQ before the clipping. The Tonehammer as far as I can tell has the mids before clipping, and the bass/treble afterwards (which I think is the best all round approach!).

I wasn't getting your reply before you edit.

Yes, it is an important factor. For example my Lime, which is a matamp preamp clone, has a variable  hi-pass filter before the gain, so you can push it a lot,  and the EQ controls after, so you can then  get as hefty as you want.

[Al Krow]

HGBM and lows

On 25/11/2017 at 18:14, totorbass said:

Does the one control Hooker eats some bass as I read somewhere?

 

On 26/11/2017 at 00:18, krispn said:

Not in my experience 

 

On 26/11/2017 at 11:36, dannybuoy said:

The HGBM probably doesn’t lose any lows, but it does lack ‘heft’ compared to the Blueberry (which is probably boosting the low end).

So I managed to put the HGBM through its paces at the full 18V tonight. I agree with krispn and DB that there doesn't seem to be any significant loss of low end - it's definitely an improvement over the TwoNotes in that regard. I do have the 'low control' deliberately set on max. I'm not sure what DB precisely means by 'heft' here, certainly through my Mesa M6 + VK cab it had 'punch'. As a drive pedal it is undoubtedly 'clean' / 'polite', perhaps a little too much for me? But then I'm aware I've moved further along the 'dirt spectrum' from warm valve to developing a taste for punchy overdrive (particularly in combination with a sub octave) over the past year. As a result I've got the HGBM dialled up to 8/10 on the drive knob. However, with its petite footprint I think it's definitely found a 'safe' spot on my gigging mini board and is likely to be around for a little while...

[dannybuoy]

Surprised you’re getting low end loss with the Two Notes, but then again I only ever ran mine in Cold Fusion mode, where blending in a bit of Channel A can give you all the low end you’ll ever need and then some!

[Cuzzie]

@Al Krow doesn’t like the A channel because there are only 4 knobs he thinks it’s not worth his time as there are more knobs on the other side....

[Al Krow]

1 hour ago, dannybuoy said:

Surprised you’re getting low end loss with the Two Notes, but then again I only ever ran mine in Cold Fusion mode, where blending in a bit of Channel A can give you all the low end you’ll ever need and then some!

Danny agreed. But I find cold fusion leaves me well er...a little cold. It seems to completely neuter the Channel B drive! If I am looking for TwoNotes dirt I will use either Channel B as stand alone or possible in Hot Fusion, but frankly 'in the mix' the difference isn't massive between these two and Hot Fusion involves a little more foot dancing!

[DiMarco]

I am waiting for the release of this multiband overdrive from Tech 21. Always admired Dough Pinnick's tone. Clean lows, distorded mids/high mids. Sounds like a plan.

 

[Bigwan]

Just now, DiMarco said:

I am waiting for the release of this multiband overdrive from Tech 21. Always admired Dough Pinnick's tone. Clean lows, distorded mids/high mids. Sounds like a plan.

 

Think the price would scare me off. Big $ being talked about...

[Al Krow]

1 hour ago, Bigwan said:

Think the price would scare me off. Big $ being talked about...

The 'best pedal in the f****** world'. 'You ain't gonna find a better pedal than that?'  Really?!!! 

'Unbelievable'. One statement he makes that do I agree with! The biggest piece of over-hype since well er...don't get me started.

At the suggested price, I think I would choose just about every other dirt pedal on the planet ahead of this...YMMV etc.

OK I should maybe come off the fence on this one and say what I really think? 

Edited November 29, 2017 by Al Krow

[radiophonic]

'best pedal in the f****** world that sounds the way I want and I don't have to pay for' more like.  It sounded very compressed to me and the distorted top would get completely lost in the music I play. There's not much point deciding on a distortion without the rest of the band playing IMO. 

[Cuzzie]

dUg pedal will definitely be south of £500 and may be closer to £350. This is direct word from Tech21.

the pedal will have fixed crossover points for the distortion sound which will give you dUg’s sound and a little flexibility in the dials and what you can do. You will not get the full dUg amp drive section flexibility, but it has a tuner and a compressor as well as the circuit. If you like dUgs tone you’ll get it with spades.

Its coming out at NAMM this Jan and then later in 2018, no actual date given.

[Cuzzie]

@radiophonic yes it is compressed, but so is dUg’s sound.

have you heard Kings X live?

its a monster tone but you are completely right, the way he blends with Ty Tabor is the key to it, but it’s absolutely lovely it really is

[radiophonic]

I'm not a fan. I get what you mean though, I remember hearing the first track from the Out of The Silent Planet LP and I do recall it sounding like the guitar and bass were totally meshed together, almost like a single instrument.

[Al Krow]

23 minutes ago, Cuzzie said:

dUg pedal will definitely be south of £500 and may be closer to £350. This is direct word from Tech21.

Well if there is more reaction like what we've just seen above (and btw I'm in total agreement with @radiophonic on this one! Sorry Cuzzie) then, I suspect it will be retailing well south of lower end of the price range you've just quoted, very shortly.

I'd give it six months and you'll be able to pick up one for next to nothing on fleabay. Lol!

PS @Cuzzie you should have kept your DG M900 and not joined the recent glut of offloaders - I do genuinely think the microtubes does a better job in every department than this new pedal. And that, for me, is saying something right?

Edited November 29, 2017 by Al Krow

[Cuzzie]

@radiophonic yep, it’s not everyone’s cup of tea.

if you have time have a quick flick through their catalogue to see an evolution of sound, so even from Faith hope and love, to out of the silent planet, Gretchen goes to Nebraska, and Ear Candy whilst retaining a distorted tone there is a progression as he moved from Bi Amping through to the dUg amp.

The big change was when they regularly started to downtune and end even lower check out the Dogman album. That is for me a dream tone, it’s immense, but listening to the guitar Ty is playing a Stratocaster and sprinkling fairy dust over the top.

[Cuzzie]

@Al Krow nope I am happy with my Form Factor Bi1000, you can’t comment until you’ve tried the DG!

you have to remember this pedal is a fixed crossover and will give you a specific tone, which may well be marmite. I seem to remember you slating the ‘baked in’ Darkglass tone previously.........

i don’t hate the DG distortion, but to my ears it sounds a little separated from the clean tone, that is just me, not a hater.

To comment on the dUg pedal you have to Understand the dUg Ultrabass 1000 amp which is a while other animal, and has a great clean tone as well.

Bas you cannot move me on this one, dUg the bassist is king!

i am sure his pedal will be really good

[Osiris]

@Cuzzie you know as well as everyone else on Basschat that now @Al Krow has publicly slated the Tech 21 dUg pedal that it is only a matter of time before he buys one and starts singing its praises. You've only got to look at his recent monumental U turn on all things DarkGlass  

[Cuzzie]

@Al Krow is your typical Wild West cowboy, shoot first and ask questions later.

Bazza the kid!

[Al Krow]

47 minutes ago, Osiris said:

@Cuzzie you know as well as everyone else on Basschat that now @Al Krow has publicly slated the Tech 21 dUg pedal that it is only a matter of time before he buys one and starts singing its praises. You've only got to look at his recent monumental U turn on all things DarkGlass  

Haha.

What U-turn on DG? I'm no fan of the fizzy microtubes sound, never have been, never will be.

I'll be buying a GM 800 long before I get that dUg pedal. In fact I'm more likely to get an 8x10 peavey cab and a 1980 Marshall JMP Super Bass MK.2 50w Valve Amplifier than that dUg pedal. 

More than happy to wager a double or quits on the BBB on that, but I suspect there will be no takers...

44 minutes ago, Cuzzie said:

@Al Krow is your typical Wild West cowboy, shoot first and ask questions later.

Bazza the kid!

Out of interest please remind me who won - the Cowboys or the Indians? 

Edited November 29, 2017 by Al Krow

[DiMarco]

LOL!

Guys each pedal will have its application, dUg tone can not be created using a VMT or B7K but the Alpha-Omega can come close.

I own an M900 amp and never use it because the Alpha-Omega is more flexible and sounds bigger through my Trace Elliot Hexa Valve amp then the M900 ever will. I really believe a dirt pedal on its own is only half of the ingredients in a great overdriven bass tone. Sold my B7K because it sounded fizzy and weak, still have a VMT pedal but the VMT (and also the B3K) in the M900 to me sound a lot better then the pedal versions.

I have tried many many more overdrive pedals on bass in the last few years but most will drown out in the mix, making the bass sound weak. The absolute best tone I got so far was taking the bi-amping route playing through both a Mesa Prodigy through the Barefaced 2x12 plus an Engl Raider 100 combo + extra 112 cab but dragging two stacks along is really too much. Also great sounding was throwing a Tech 21 flyrig 5 in the fxloop of my Mosquito Blender to mimic bi-amping. Add an octave up to the mix and you can do that Royal Blood thing as well.

Plenty of options for sounding awesome, all depending on your taste and needs.

Still, if I could choose only one I'd stick with the Alpha-Omega.

Edited November 29, 2017 by DiMarco

[Cuzzie]

@Al Krow can’t believe you are backing cowboys, no matter who won, Indians were way cooler, you should know that!

So I am going to call you out on your sweeping statement going back a few posts and ask some questions.

Why do you genuinely think the DG microtubes does a better job compared to the dUg pedal?

When you say microtubes do you mean their microtubes pedals (of which there are a few), which pedals do you prefer to the dUg and why.

Do you mean the microtubes section on the amp compared to the pedal? Is there a difference sonically on the microtubes section on the amp compared to the individual pedals it is replicating?

If you say it’s the amp, then that’s an unfair comparison as the pedal has a fixed crossover and no EQ, so in that case can you compare please the DG M900 vs the dUg Ultrabass 1000 both on clean and dirt capabilities?

Just to complete the set can you shed some light on the Tech21 amps VT1000 vs 1969 vs Landmark 300 vs dUg Ultrabass as they all seem very similar on paper and looking aside from the paint job.

While we are here give us an opinion on David Norschow Amplification and it’s new amp. It looks like it may be another Genzler Magellan 800 with a crap drive you’ll never use in isolation.

I would love to see you with that rig you mentioned Bas, it’s bigger than you!

i’ll await Answers patiently....

 

 

[Al Krow]

Answers on a postcard as follows:

The Native North American Indians would have been cool if they had bothered to develop writing or invented the wheel or their medicine men actually knew what a bacterium was. Sadly they didn't and although they learned fast, 6,000 years outside of humanity's development hub was too much of a gap against your genocidal slave trading forbears.

You misunderstand my statement of 'I think microtubes does a better job than the new overpriced dUg pedal' as praise for microtubes. Believe me it's not! Let me put it more simply: if offered both for free I would prefer, by a country mile (which I presume is longer than an average city mile?) a deep warm £47 TC Mojomojo on my board than a £350 over compressed hissy sound emanating from the rear of that dUg. Each to their own buddy.

But for dUg to describe this is as the 'best pedal in the f****** world'. 'You ain't gonna find a better pedal than that?' is the most arrogant overblown piece of pedal hype I've come across and deserves calling out before folk blithely get onto another empty wagon and find themselves offloading kit, down the line, in droves. IMHO YMMV etc.