Open strings: Yay or nay, with reasons.

[chris_b]

My preference is to use fretted notes where I can.

If I can't then I'll use open strings.

[bazzbass]

play em or not, why would you think I care what you do?

[musicbassman]

OK, so I'm just working through The Whispers  'And the Beat Goes On'.

There's quite a few interpretations/demonstrations of the bass line on YouTube, and most players play the main riff using an open D, like Huw Foster does here. I personally find it more difficult to get accurate damping with the open D, so I'd choose to play this starting on the B on the E string, so it's all fretted.

Have a listen, and maybe try this. How would you choose to play this ?

 

[PaulWarning]

I was chatting to a guitarist whose just taken up bass the other day, he said "never realised how much easier it was if you use open strings where you can"

[FinnDave]

I very rarely use open strings except the E, as there is no fretted alternative to it (I play 4 strings exclusively). I hadn't heard of Phil Lesh's opinion of open strings before, but if he says they are an abomination, I wouldn't argue! I avoid the other open strings as I feel that I less control over tone and duration with them when compared to a fretted note.

[burno70]

It depends on the riff but I do like using open strings to bounce off. They're particularly useful if you have to change fretting hand position. I don't understand why you would avoid using them?

[PaulWarning]

they're not always appropriate, if you need to choke off the note for instance or two open strings together but where they are they are a Godsend, there are songs I couldn't play nearly as well without using them

[BigRedX]

For pretty much everyone, most of the time, the use or not of open strings will always be a trade off between how you want the notes to sound and your technical ability.

Of course there are times when in order to get the right sound and feel, open strings will always be the right choice.

[SH73]

I don't really understand why it matters how it must be played. I've  learnt in past year that bass sound changes in the mix......

[FinnDave]

11 minutes ago, SH73 said:

I don't really understand why it matters how it must be played. I've  learnt in past year that bass sound changes in the mix......

I don't think anyone (except Phil Lesh, and I don't think he's a member of this forum!) is saying how it should be done, only how they prefer to do it.

Edited December 22, 2017 by FinnDave

[SteveK]

3 hours ago, musicbassman said:

Have a listen, and maybe try this. How would you choose to play this ?

Used to like this line when it first came out, and briefly incorporated it  into my practice regime. I always assumed that an open D was used (must have seen it on TOTP). However, I made it my duty to learn it with a fretted D (A string), enabling me to play that riff, and any similar riffs in any key.

[SH73]

There are bassists who don't ready or write notes. They don't preach on you tube about technicality and yet they  managed to become more famous than the ones they do.

[mikel]

Of course I use them, its part of the instrument. If you need it then use it, the bass police never attend my gigs. 

[fretmeister]

Ease of playing is all. I don't care beyond that.

 

Also my favourite bass (for today anyway) has a zero fret so there's no tonal difference.

[chris_b]

4 hours ago, musicbassman said:

Have a listen, and maybe try this. How would you choose to play this.

I'd play it exactly the same way. IMO this guy has a good technique and isn't stretching for anything. The index and pinky are easily doing all the work across a 2 fret range and he's moving his hand to get his fingers to the notes that are further away. A big stretch for a passing note will be uncomfortable and will disrupt the flow and groove of the line. So open D every time.

As for damping, watch his left hand. He's damping all the strings with his left hand as he goes. He's got "foam" under the strings anyway but along with his placement of his right thumb he's got it all covered. This is good damping technique.

This is where being helpful, flexible and changing the keys to cover up the inflexibility of the singer causes me "issues". Taking the key of a song up a tone or down a tone can alter the feel of the line and open passing notes, which make the original "swing", have to be fretted and don't work so well. Some lines don't flow in another key. That's why if we're changing the key I'll be flexible on the bass lines. Although this causes me less trouble on my 5er than when I played a 4 there are still songs where the bass line just works better in the original key.

I know a guitarist who insists on playing Superstition in G. What can be wrong with that? It's mostly a one note line but that bass note just sounds so much better in the original Eb. So far I haven't found a guitarist who'll play it in the original key. Not holding my breath.

[EliasMooseblaster]

1 minute ago, chris_b said:

I know a guitarist who insists on playing Superstition in G. What can be wrong with that? It's mostly a one note line but that bass note just sounds so much better in the original Eb. So far I haven't found a guitarist who'll play it in the original key. Not holding my breath.

That would require you to find a guitarist who'll voluntarily play in Eb - a very rare breed, in my experience!

[M@23]

1 hour ago, chris_b said:

 

I know a guitarist who insists on playing Superstition in G. What can be wrong with that? It's mostly a one note line but that bass note just sounds so much better in the original Eb. So far I haven't found a guitarist who'll play it in the original key. Not holding my breath.

In E minor? 

I left a band because the guitarist insisted on doing as much as possible in G/Em. It wasn't even what worked for the singer, it's because he was lazy. 

[mcnach]

On 11/21/2017 at 07:55, Telebass said:

Noticed on another thread that someone didn't use open strings, for him because if damping issues. 

I'm a user of open strings. I see no reason why not, although apparently Phil Lesh always thought it an abomination - never really understood why. I certainly do NOT agree with the "nut and frets sound different " argument. In a band context it would be all but impossible to ever tell, and difficult anyway. 

Let's hear it...

 

I don't see a reason to use or avoid that works for everybody.

I generally avoid, because I prefer the sound of their fretted equivalent, especially the higher in pitch you go, as the fretted counterpart sounds fatter. I also prefer the feel of fretted notes... However, sometimes open strings are just either very convenient or they sound just right. In other words: whatever works best in each situation.

[fretmeister]

Wasn't it the original bassist in Saxon who said open notes were vital to rock music...

 

If there were no open notes he couldn't point while he was playing!!

 

[Tokalo]

One of the best feelings I know is hitting an open E for the final chord of a song. No need to dampen. The whole room shakes, and I win that particular chord in my battle with keyboard, guitar and even drums.

[SH73]

2 hours ago, fretmeister said:

Wasn't it the original bassist in Saxon who said open notes were vital to rock music...

 

If there were no open notes he couldn't point while he was playing!!

 

 

[mikel]

5 hours ago, EliasMooseblaster said:

That would require you to find a guitarist who'll voluntarily play in Eb - a very rare breed, in my experience!

I can sympathise. I used to play guitar and Eb is a very difficult key to play in. I know every musician should know everything about every aspect of their instrument, but most of us are semi pro or fun players so give people a break.

[chris_b]

12 minutes ago, mikel said:

I can sympathise. I used to play guitar and Eb is a very difficult key to play in. I know every musician should know everything about every aspect of their instrument, but most of us are semi pro or fun players so give people a break.

Or they can just tune down half a step. Which is what Hendrix, Stevie Ray Vaughan and a few others did.

[mikel]

53 minutes ago, chris_b said:

Or they can just tune down half a step. Which is what Hendrix, Stevie Ray Vaughan and a few others did.

Nah, that's just cheating.

[Frank Blank]

I use open strings a lot. It has become part of my... (trying to think of a descriptor here that doesn't make me sound like an ar$3) playing style*. I particularly like to hit an open string that clashes with one of the next note/s I land on, I like the dissonance of notes that clash but dissonance is something I like in music generally so I try to incorporate it in my playing a lot.

*I failed in the 'Not sounding like an ar$3’ thing, there, clearly.

Edited December 23, 2017 by Frank Blank
Punctuation correction