Bluewine Posted November 24, 2017 Share Posted November 24, 2017 People think my head is so far up The Beatles arse nobody takes me seriously. As for Ringo, do drums even matter when you have songs that great? Blue 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowdown Posted November 24, 2017 Share Posted November 24, 2017 3 minutes ago, Bluewine said: As for Ringo, do drums even matter when you have songs that great? Blue There you go, Blue. A great point. Many, many Beatles tunes have been covered by plenty of other artists. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wateroftyne Posted November 24, 2017 Share Posted November 24, 2017 Monitors? IEMs? Nah. DOn't need 'em. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
petebassist Posted November 24, 2017 Share Posted November 24, 2017 I found Revolution in the Head a great read, couldn't put it down. Recently been listening to Macca's isolated bass tracks for songs like I Want You and Come Together... Awesome... Amazing band, always will be. So yes enjoying the thread. Thanks. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluewine Posted November 24, 2017 Share Posted November 24, 2017 (edited) 5 hours ago, wateroftyne said: Monitors? IEMs? Nah. DOn't need 'em. Great looking guitar and bass. A lot of binding and classic good looks. I hate to be an old geezer. But man did those guys look great in suits or what? Blue Edited November 25, 2017 by Bluewine 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roceci Posted November 24, 2017 Author Share Posted November 24, 2017 1 hour ago, Bluewine said: People think my head is so far up The Beatles arse nobody takes me seriously. As for Ringo, do drums even matter when you have songs that great? Blue As kinda stated previously Blue, no problem with your love for the Beatles. Great songs win out over *just* great music for me too, but chuck a tight bunch of players in there right across the board as well & that's when you get nirvana for me. Not that Nirvana you understand I genuinely don't understand why Ringo made such odd choices in what he played so often, & that he appeared to forget that he presumably had use of a hi hat, sometimes for whole albums seemingly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluewine Posted November 25, 2017 Share Posted November 25, 2017 3 hours ago, roceci said: As kinda stated previously Blue, no problem with your love for the Beatles. Great songs win out over *just* great music for me too, but chuck a tight bunch of players in there right across the board as well & that's when you get nirvana for me. Not that Nirvana you understand I genuinely don't understand why Ringo made such odd choices in what he played so often, & that he appeared to forget that he presumably had use of a hi hat, sometimes for whole albums seemingly Cool, I can dig it. Thing is anybody can be a drummer, Ringo was a Beatle. And that's hard to pull off. Blue 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpondonBassed Posted November 25, 2017 Share Posted November 25, 2017 (edited) He was also the oldest of the fabs. He'd taken the position of drummer with the Beatles after the band had been going a while. His background in bands previously was Skiffle and Blues. https://www.biography.com/people/ringo-starr-306872#! 'In 1962, he officially joined the Beatles, replacing Pete Best. After their first gig at the Cavern Club in Liverpool, Best's fans were so angry about the switch that they gave Starr a black eye. Eventually, Beatles fans came around, and Starr was accepted, and eventually beloved.' Remember these were the days when skiffle bands used washboards with thimbles, pots and pans as percussive instruments. George Harrison was not a genius*. He was a spiritual man. Ringo was not brought up on click tracks or even drum kits. He took on a role that got him punched by fans who missed Pete Best. Lennon was a youth who had reasons to be bitter about his life. He was a survivor. McCartney came from a family which still did the Cèilidh thing. He was a great mixer. During their last years of live performance they pushed the limits of technology for amplification at large venues and found it lacking. The fans were louder than they were. The studio years are how they managed to continue as a band where pressures beyond anyone's control at the time were killing bands outright. To keep going as they did was an indication of the toughness of their outfit. As Maccer often said; The Beatles was a great little band. Me? I liked them from the very first time I heard them on the jukebox in the London pub where I lived until the age of two. That was between '62 and '65. The bass travelled through the ceiling to where I slept while happy drinkers played their hits time after time. You'd think I'd be fed up hearing them but no. How many bands endure in that way now? Like lots of other things in the 21st century, it seems that bands are built to be disposable. *A previous comment about George not being a genius made me laugh. Why would anyone suggest that he was? Edited November 25, 2017 by SpondonBassed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scalpy Posted November 25, 2017 Share Posted November 25, 2017 Pablo Picasso said it took him a whole lifetime to paint like a child. Your Neil Peart’s of the world would be good for painting the Sistine Chapel, Ringo might drum like a cave painting but to me it says just as much. I’ve not had enough sleep by the way. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulWarning Posted November 25, 2017 Share Posted November 25, 2017 as has been alluded too in another thread 'what makes a good drummer' it's not just how you play but if you get on with your band mates, I think Ringo was the only Beatle not to fall out with anybody, he was the only one they all worked with after the split 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpondonBassed Posted November 25, 2017 Share Posted November 25, 2017 16 minutes ago, scalpy said: Pablo Picasso said it took him a whole lifetime to paint like a child. Your Neil Peart’s of the world would be good for painting the Sistine Chapel, Ringo might drum like a cave painting but to me it says just as much. I’ve not had enough sleep by the way. Watch this then. Good post, you've earned your kip. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Austin7 Posted November 25, 2017 Share Posted November 25, 2017 21 hours ago, wateroftyne said: I disagree with most of what you say, but will concede that George was a.. lazy guitarist. The rooftop concert. The 'All You Need Is Love' solo. Even McCartney and Lennon eclipse him at the end of the Abbey Road medley. But he was a bit off-the-wall, influenced the direction of the band and wrote handful of classics. I strongly disagree re: Ringo. Even Bernard Purdie rates him enough to try to steal his credit. McCartney's 'twee' stuff often has a bit of a sinister undercurrent which appeals to me, and I have no problems with Lennon's voice. I have to disagree that George was eclipsed on guitar on the Abbey Road medley. His part has always been my favorite. As for Lennon's voice, to me it was always at the heart of the Beatles' overall sound. I've noticed, however, that his voice seems to be criticized by critics who really dislike the Beatles. A younger relative of mine would be a good example I've personally encountered whose dislike of Lennon's singing has been relentless through the years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockfordStone Posted November 25, 2017 Share Posted November 25, 2017 14 hours ago, Bluewine said: People think my head is so far up The Beatles arse nobody takes me seriously. As for Ringo, do drums even matter when you have songs that great? Blue i agree with this, drums should form the basis of a good song not be the song. ringo for his faults provided the base for the others to do their thing, and it worked. nothing wrong with that at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roceci Posted November 25, 2017 Author Share Posted November 25, 2017 Tight doesn't automatically equate with technical, so Neil Peart et al as Beatles drummer is absurd to me too. I do hear an absence of groove from Ringo tho, & I do like a bit of groove. The skiffle thing is helpful to explain this mind. I'd also posit that Ringo is an essential Beatle because he was in the Beatles. It could have been anyone else, he seems the most expendable out of the four. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulWarning Posted November 25, 2017 Share Posted November 25, 2017 just had to google Neil Peart to find out who he is lol, I'm not really into prog rock and hate drum solo's, I think Ringo did one once Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ead Posted November 25, 2017 Share Posted November 25, 2017 I think the Ringo thing has reached unprecedentled levels of urban myth. Entirely fit for purpose for the Beatles; might have struggled in Rush though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpondonBassed Posted November 25, 2017 Share Posted November 25, 2017 1 hour ago, roceci said: Tight doesn't automatically equate with technical, so Neil Peart et al as Beatles drummer is absurd to me too. I do hear an absence of groove from Ringo tho, & I do like a bit of groove. The skiffle thing is helpful to explain this mind. I'd also posit that Ringo is an essential Beatle because he was in the Beatles. It could have been anyone else, he seems the most expendable out of the four. I think he might have thought that himself from reading the article I linked out to above. It stated that he was the first to quit but that he was welcomed back after the others realised they'd under-rated his worth to the band. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_b Posted November 25, 2017 Share Posted November 25, 2017 I was a Stones fan but still had all the Beatles albums, singles and EP's. As a musician you had to, they were the source of most new ideas at the time. The Beatles started as a live Rock and Roll act, went through being a backing band and came out the other end as the biggest original band in the world. No one's ever likely to like all their output (even they didn't), as it stretches from I Saw Her Standing There to I Am The Walrus, through Yellow Submarine (!), but they constantly changed what was possible with every new song and record they put out. Lennon and McCartney were musical giants. Very few bands have survived to the first album with two such original talents on board. They had to fight each other for their space in the band and certainly weren't interested in giving George Harrison a fair crack. He got his token song on each album and as he said he was writing songs but not bringing them to the band. He did manage to write one of their most famous songs. As Frank Sinatra said, "Something is the best song Lennon and McCartney ever wrote!" Forget the inaccuracy, that's some complement. While Lennon and McCartney were busy re writing the rule book for popular music Ringo was redefining what was possible for a drummer to play. Earl Palmer changed the drum world in 1949 by starting the 2 and 4 snare drum pattern. Now you can't imagine music without that simple beat, but 2 and 4 didn't cut it in so many of the Beatles songs that Ringo had to come up with something that did and in so doing opened the door to creative drum patterns that have spread into every drummers repertoire. Neal Peart, Buddy Rich and Jon Bonham are all great drummers, they brought something to the table but they didn't change the world of drumming. Ringo did and for that he needs recognition. There might be "better" drummers but Earl Palmer and Ringo Starr are the two most influential drummers in the last 70 years. 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivansc Posted November 25, 2017 Share Posted November 25, 2017 (edited) 15 hours ago, roceci said: I genuinely don't understand why Ringo made such odd choices in what he played so often, & that he appeared to forget that he presumably had use of a hi hat, sometimes for whole albums seemingly Hi Hat riding is genuinely a relatively new sport. Back in the day most drummers used the ride far more, like Ringo. Dave Clarke was one of the earliest *poop drummers I saw thrashing a hihat and he hardly counts as a proper drummer, does he? Pretty boy, though.... EDITED to accentuate the inadvertent humour of my typo at * which of course should have read POP. Edited November 25, 2017 by ivansc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Len_derby Posted November 25, 2017 Share Posted November 25, 2017 20 minutes ago, ivansc said: Hi Hat riding is genuinely a relatively new sport. Back in the day most drummers used the ride far more, like Ringo. Dave Clarke was one of the earliest *poop drummers I saw thrashing a hihat and he hardly counts as a proper drummer, does he? Pretty boy, though.... EDITED to accentuate the inadvertent humour of my typo at * which of course should have read POP. Interesting. Tony Williams is mostly playing the hi-hat on In a Silent Way, how do you think that fits into the history? Anyway, to stop hijacking the thread, I've always liked Ringo's drumming. It's just so,well, totally Beatle-ish. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivansc Posted November 25, 2017 Share Posted November 25, 2017 (edited) 40 minutes ago, Len_derby said: Interesting. Tony Williams is mostly playing the hi-hat on In a Silent Way, how do you think that fits into the history? Er - he wasn`t actually around much in the sixties as far as I can tell, plus he is a jazzer not a pop drummer? I really was talking about JUST the drummers that were around during the majority of the Beatles era. Things did change as we went into the seventies but not much before that as I remember it.. Damn I am going to have to go youtube surf a bunch of old crap now!! That was easy - The Kinks drummer playing orthodox grip mostly on ride but using his foot on the hihat. Next... Charlie Watts was indeed playing a lot of hihat on Stones songs even back in 1964... Both Brian Bennett and Tony Meehan on the ride with the Shadows...Same with Brian Poole and the Tremeloes.... OK it looks like the turning point was around 1964 or 5. Interesting. Edited November 25, 2017 by ivansc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikel Posted November 25, 2017 Share Posted November 25, 2017 No, I refuse to bite, there have been too many Beatles trolling threads lately. If you don't like something, don't listen to it. Job done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skankdelvar Posted November 25, 2017 Share Posted November 25, 2017 Interesting piece here which supports the view that Ringo was a talented and innovative drummer who played for the song. As evidence it analyses his parts on Ticket to Ride and In My Life. IMO, Ringo was by no means the Beatles' weakest link; Lennon was a very basic rhythm guitarist and - it has been suggested - frequently prone to error. Great frontman, though. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluewine Posted November 25, 2017 Share Posted November 25, 2017 5 hours ago, Austin7 said: A younger relative of mine would be a good example I've personally encountered whose dislike of Lennon's singing has been relentless through the years. I never gave any thought to John's singing. I was listening to "The Beatles" It was all Fab. Blue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluewine Posted November 25, 2017 Share Posted November 25, 2017 42 minutes ago, skankdelvar said: Interesting piece here which supports the view that Ringo was a talented and innovative drummer who played for the song. As evidence it analyses his parts on Ticket to Ride and In My Life. IMO, Ringo was by no means the Beatles' weakest link; Lennon was a very basic rhythm guitarist and - it has been suggested - frequently prone to error. Great frontman, though. Agreed, Did I forget to mention they also looked great in suits? Blue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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