What make is this?

[SH73]

My father in law got this Fender jazz bass copy from the loft. The back plate says Made in Japan.

It is solid and heavy about 40 years old. The neck is wide but not chunky.It has old flat wounds on and sounds dead. I've played it through a cheap guitar amp so far. The knobs don't work properly.

No idea what make it is but sprucing it up with electronics it would make a nice bass.

Anyone has any suggestions what it may be

Edited December 26, 2017 by MB1
Added photos

[Frank Blank]

Got any pics?

[SH73]

Just added 

[Frank Blank]

3 minutes ago, SH73 said:

Just added 

Sorry, you were probably just doing that as I asked...

[HazBeen]

If I had to bet, I would say it is a late ‘70s FujiGen made bass, as they used the “made in japan” neckplate during this period. If it is indeed late 70’s the make is probably a Custom (sub brand of Ibanez). I have seen quite a few unbranded instruments from FujiGen so to me the neck is probaly original.

Worth? 4-500 quid.... but I am no expert.

Edited December 26, 2017 by HazBeen

[stingrayPete1977]

16 minutes ago, HazBeen said:

If I had to bet, I would say it is a late ‘70s FujiGen made bass, as they used the “made in japan” neckplate during this period. If it is indeed late 70’s the make is probably a Custom (sub brand of Ibanez). I have seen quite a few unbranded instruments from FujiGen so to me the neck is probaly original.

Worth? 4-500 quid.... but I am no expert.

4 quid sounds about fair, lol 

[HazBeen]

Smart @ss

[MB1]

MB1.

Then again it could be a Kay Satelite Maya or Woolies Special?

that head stocks seen some sandpaper?

check the neck pocket and under the Scratchplate for clues? You may get lucky?

 

 

[SH73]

Cheers lads. Will have to check under sp and neck pocket.

[HazBeen]

To me the neckplate is a smoking gun, 99% sure it is a FujiGen made bass.

[fleabag]

The rounded end jazz pups seem very familiar

[BassAgent]

I think it is not a FujiGen but a Matsumoku bass. Could be released as Custom, Vorg, Pearl, Bird, Maya, Elk, Aria etcetera.

[timhiggins]

The pickgaurd looks like my old colombus one .. different knobs though

[Bassassin]

It's very close to this Cimar:

Obvious difference is the trussrod adjuster position but details like that had a tendency to change over production history. Looks like this has been sold unbranded, as very many instruments from this era were - where a logo has been removed there's inevitably some marking or ghosting on the headstock, often leaving an identifiable silhouette. The headstock finish looks original.

Could be a Fujigen but I don't think so. The lower-half stamped neckplate is not an identifying factor - Fgn used them but so did Moridaira and Kasuga, and doubtless others did too, it's a generic part. I'm also pretty sure that copy-era Cimars (if this is/was one!) weren't Fujigens, despite the brand being owned by Hoshino Gakki. I've never seen a confirmed Fgn with those round-end J pups.

It's absolutely *not* a Matsumoku - all copy-era Mat Fender clones either have the "Steel Adjustable Neck" - stamped plate, which was exclusively used by Mat - or a Matsumoku-branded plate. I'm also pretty confident that Mat didn't use these pickups.

I've seen and owned a positively unhealthy number of 70s MIJ copies and the reality is that an awful lot of them are unidentifiable and will remain so. This isn't helped by the fact that they do sort of have a tendency to look quite similar!

There's interesting evidence appearing about how a lot of these things were put together too - it's often unrealistic to assume one factory made a complete instrument, a lot of mix & match assembly went on with necks, bodies, hardware & electronics all being sourced from different workshops. There's even a school of thought (which is interesting but I'm a bit skeptical about) that some of these "salvage" instruments were built in Korea from various exported Japanese parts, because domestic Japanese regulations & taxation actually made that more affordable.

 

[HazBeen]

28 minutes ago, Bassassin said:

It's very close to this Cimar:

Obvious difference is the trussrod adjuster position but details like that had a tendency to change over production history. Looks like this has been sold unbranded, as very many instruments from this era were - where a logo has been removed there's inevitably some marking or ghosting on the headstock, often leaving an identifiable silhouette. The headstock finish looks original.

Could be a Fujigen but I don't think so. The lower-half stamped neckplate is not an identifying factor - Fgn used them but so did Moridaira and Kasuga, and doubtless others did too, it's a generic part. I'm also pretty sure that copy-era Cimars (if this is/was one!) weren't Fujigens, despite the brand being owned by Hoshino Gakki. I've never seen a confirmed Fgn with those round-end J pups.

It's absolutely *not* a Matsumoku - all copy-era Mat Fender clones either have the "Steel Adjustable Neck" - stamped plate, which was exclusively used by Mat - or a Matsumoku-branded plate. I'm also pretty confident that Mat didn't use these pickups.

I've seen and owned a positively unhealthy number of 70s MIJ copies and the reality is that an awful lot of them are unidentifiable and will remain so. This isn't helped by the fact that they do sort of have a tendency to look quite similar!

There's interesting evidence appearing about how a lot of these things were put together too - it's often unrealistic to assume one factory made a complete instrument, a lot of mix & match assembly went on with necks, bodies, hardware & electronics all being sourced from different workshops. There's even a school of thought (which is interesting but I'm a bit skeptical about) that some of these "salvage" instruments were built in Korea from various exported Japanese parts, because domestic Japanese regulations & taxation actually made that more affordable.

 

You might be right, indeed not a Matsu as they had the specific plate. Thought it was FGN exclusively who used the made in Japan, good to know it is not.... live and learn.

But as you say, so many variations and mixing going on...... wonder if the pickups are Fender replacements....

Wasn’t Cimar Hoshino Gakki?

Edited December 27, 2017 by HazBeen

[Chienmortbb]

I imported a Fender Japan Aerodyne Jazz from Ishibashi in 2003. Superb service. Cost me about £500 all in bit a few months later I saw it in a music shop for £995. 

I knew Ishibashi as I visited their Osaka branch a few times. I worked for Panasonic and the HQ is in  Osaka. They never had the Black Aerodyne in stock when I was there. Japanese colleagues could not match the cost of shipping and  insurance that Ishibashi offered.

I still have the bass and it is the one bass I would never get rid of. It is shown below with my Samick Greg Bennett bass. 

Apologies for the duplicated photos but fir some reason I cannot delete either.

 

 

 

 

Edited December 27, 2017 by Chienmortbb
Duplicate picture

[SH73]

Cheers lads. Lots of knowledge  here.  The bottom line is I'm likely to keep it but replace the electronics BUT keep the pups to see what they sound like. Another alternative is to convert it into a PJ  bass with spb1 and Seymour Duncan bridge pup.. Meantine, anyone is welcome  to chip in with their  opinion on what this bass actually is.

[Bassassin]

2 hours ago, HazBeen said:

You might be right, indeed not a Matsu as they had the specific plate. Thought it was FGN exclusively who used the made in Japan, good to know it is not.... live and learn.

But as you say, so many variations and mixing going on...... wonder if the pickups are Fender replacements....

Wasn’t Cimar Hoshino Gakki?

Fujigen used the lower-half stamped plate (the same as on this bass) up until late 1975 when they introduced the use of serial numbers. The (more common) upper-half stamped plates were never used by Fgn and don't seem to be used by one specific factory. Like many MIJ details it's often easier to define who didn't do something rather than who did - so we know Fujigen, Matsu, Kasuga, Moridaira, etc didn't use them. We also know Chushin Gakki definitely did, but so did a lot of others. There's very litle that's exclusive to any one manufacturer though, certainly during the 70s copy era.

I mentioned that Cimar was owned by Hoshino, but Hoshino's not a manufacturer but a trading company - they contracted Fujigen to build Ibanez and some post-copy era Cimars but I don't think they made the copy stuff - they're all indentifiably different to Ibanez copies - which were all generic Fujigens anyway, and were available with different brands from other importer/exporters.

Pickups on the bass here appear to be originals, these round-end types appear in a lot of MIJ copies.

[HazBeen]

I love this place

[SH73]

Removed the neck and nothing exciting. Nothing exciting at back of electronics or pick ups. 

[SH73]

@HazBeen @MB1 @Bassassin

Any other suggestions? I've attached pics of neck pocket and potentiometers. The wires are very thin.

[prowla]

My first thought was Grant, but I have no hard details.

The bridge cover looks like it's a replacement, as those 70s ones came with the full-size cover and you can see the screw holes.

I had a Columbus back in the day and this one doesn't seem familiar.

[SH73]

Yeah looks like it had a full size cover. It was bought 30 years ago so the wood is nicely dried out.

[White Cloud]

I'm interested to know how it plays?

[SH73]

29 minutes ago, White Cloud said:

I'm interested to know how it plays?

It's  a tough one. Only the front  pups  volume button works when it pleases. The other two don't but I reckon with new electronics and either Seymour Duncan  or aquilar pick ups with a high mass Fender bridge it will be a bad as.s bass