vmaxblues Posted December 31, 2017 Share Posted December 31, 2017 So, last night played a gig with my newly acquired Orange rig, comprising of an Orange Terror Bass 500, and two SP212 cabs.... Firstly, it is loud, so I got the volume levels sorted in the mix, but during the first couple of songs I was disemboweling the audience with the bass boom! I kept having to turn down the bass eq on amp and bass until it was under control. Any of you wise bass guru's out there have any sage advice on taming this beast? I have purchased a pair of JJ valves to replace the originals. I love the look and footprint of this rig but just need to find the best settings. Cheers All Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_b Posted December 31, 2017 Share Posted December 31, 2017 Could it be that you were just too loud? I don't know Orange, but the (unscientific) way I get a sound with new gear is to start with the controls at noon and add or subtract a couple of clicks until it works. Controls at noon has to be my starting point and get me close to the sound I want or I wouldn't have bought the gear in the first place. That you're already at the point of changing valves to alter the sound makes me wonder what appealed to you and made you buy this rig in the first place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vmaxblues Posted December 31, 2017 Author Share Posted December 31, 2017 Reason for trying, Warmth of tone, a toe in the water with valvey goodness. My main rig is Markbass and has been for a while and I know it backwards and it always delivers, but it is clinical. It isn't a volume issue because when I have tried it with just one cab quietly at home the bass is massive and vibrates everything in the room, it is a frequency thing, never experienced anything like it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dannybuoy Posted December 31, 2017 Share Posted December 31, 2017 (edited) Flat setting on that amp according to measurement graphs over at BassGearMag is bass and treble all the way off, and mids all the way up. So start there and dial in a little bit of additional bass and treble if required. If you have all knobs at noon, then unlike the Markbass that is actually a very bass heavy setting with a mid scoop! Edited December 31, 2017 by dannybuoy 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lozz196 Posted December 31, 2017 Share Posted December 31, 2017 Yep the OTB is a great amp, but that tone stack/eq is very puzzling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vmaxblues Posted December 31, 2017 Author Share Posted December 31, 2017 dannybuoy that explains a lot! many thanks for that! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dannybuoy Posted December 31, 2017 Share Posted December 31, 2017 My typical settings are bass and treble at 9 o'clock and mids up full. I know intuition prevents most bassists from wanting to turn down the bass control on their bass amp, but it really is the way forward with many passive tone stacks! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pbasspecial Posted January 2, 2018 Share Posted January 2, 2018 I used to have an OTB. Regret selling it. Did you say you have bought some JJs to replace the originals? I thought the originals were JJs but I could be wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr4stringz Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 Yes, absolutely my experience through owning a TB500 is as per dannybuoy’s advice. It’s a cracking rig with the 2x12s but the flat position on the amp makes no sense, which incidentally I find rather wonderful! I’m not one for too much treble in my tone and love a big, beefy bass heavy tone but anything past 9 o’clock on the bass dial on the TB is excessively bassy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jus Lukin Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 (edited) - Edited March 1, 2022 by Jus Lukin 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcnach Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 On 12/31/2017 at 10:02, vmaxblues said: So, last night played a gig with my newly acquired Orange rig, comprising of an Orange Terror Bass 500, and two SP212 cabs.... Firstly, it is loud, so I got the volume levels sorted in the mix, but during the first couple of songs I was disemboweling the audience with the bass boom! I kept having to turn down the bass eq on amp and bass until it was under control. Any of you wise bass guru's out there have any sage advice on taming this beast? I have purchased a pair of JJ valves to replace the originals. I love the look and footprint of this rig but just need to find the best settings. Cheers All I'm not familiar with those cabs, but I often use an Orange Terror Bass 500 at a local music venue, through either their Orange 410 (forget which model) or my own cabs at times. I always end up turning the bass EQ down quite a bit and turning up the mids. With the knobs at 12 o'clock it's too bassy for my liking for sure. Don't be afraid of turning down the bass knob on that amp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcnach Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 On 12/31/2017 at 11:11, dannybuoy said: Flat setting on that amp according to measurement graphs over at BassGearMag is bass and treble all the way off, and mids all the way up. So start there and dial in a little bit of additional bass and treble if required. If you have all knobs at noon, then unlike the Markbass that is actually a very bass heavy setting with a mid scoop! Ha! That makes a lot of sense and fits my experience: I turn down bass a lot and turn up mids... so I'm probably going for a relatively 'flat' setting. When I use my MarkBass LM3 I pretty much leave the controls flat, with minimal adjustments. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dannybuoy Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 What's misleading though is that all 3 EQ knobs on the OTB are labelled Cut and Boost on the left and right sides, with a zero at the 12 o'clock position! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vmaxblues Posted January 3, 2018 Author Share Posted January 3, 2018 Love this forum, great and illuminating responses. just for info, the valves I took out were no name chinese made, the JJ’s I think are better. I have tried at home with all the above settings and all are correct in that flat is 0-10-0, then drop in a little (very little bass and treble). I am wondering whether the addition of a parametric pedal on my biard might be a worthwhile addition? But which one? cheers All Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cat Burrito Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 I used Orange for a couple of years and the classic mod was flipping out the valves to get a later break up. I used my Terror head with just one SP210 head and it sounded great once I replaced the valves. I never had an issue with the volume. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dannybuoy Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 I like messing around with different preamp pedals, so I can effectively use the Orange at its flat setting as a cheap but very loud and very nice sounding power amp! About the common valve swap for lower gain tubes - does it end up sounding basically the same but for example gain at 9 o'clock on a 12AX7 equivalent to 1 o'clock on a 12AU7? Or is there an audible change in tone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy H. Posted January 4, 2018 Share Posted January 4, 2018 All above tone stack comments are true and will help. Just one other trivial thought for you though - cab positioning! Moving your cab around in relation to ‘room boundaries’ affects the sound - a lot! Most noticably the low end. Unless you are flying your rig near the roof the important room boundaries here are floor, back and side walls, and especially corners where they are combined. Often a few inches can make a surprising difference. The easiest way to show that is just to raise the cab off the floor by different amounts. Bunging it on a beer crate or stool can help cure boom. (Maybe with a thin layer of foam - or my secret weapon an ‘astroturf’ doormat - under the cab to keep things secure and prevent rattles). As can simply moving it away from nearby walls / corners. The great thing about doing this is that you can really fine tune the lows, at least as effectively as with the amp EQ because different gaps from room boundaries will affect a different range of frequencies. Also really effective are things like ‘Gramma Pads’, especially on creaky wooden stages. I often do small gigs / jams with a Micromark combo (1x6” or 1x8”, I have both) with just a single (VPF = mids scoop) tone control. Still have good control of the bass and treble ranges too though - the tone control on my bass for treble, and room positioning for the bass!!! I always try to put my cabs where they SOUND best, not just where they LOOK best! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vmaxblues Posted January 4, 2018 Author Share Posted January 4, 2018 Andy, Very interesting thought, and one that has never really occurred to me! Will give that some thought. Cheers Stuart Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bassmachine2112 Posted January 6, 2018 Share Posted January 6, 2018 Hiho,I have used an OTB500 for 5 years now with a SP212 and anOBC115.As youve found out your never short of volume. Here is almost flat setting which works Treble-12 o'clock.Middle'12oclock.Bass-9 o'clock. Another little tip is to put a BDI21 in front of amp.I got mine S/H a decade ago,still works perfect. Even after 5 years I still get excited playing through this. To recap get your head round the EQ and your there. My one has JJ Ecc83s valves as standard and DI works perfect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lozz196 Posted January 6, 2018 Share Posted January 6, 2018 I used one as a privided rig a couple of months ago. I thought it was great, though had the same issues, a lot of low-end. Then I remembered these kind-of topics, that the flat setting is bass backed off so went with that and hey presto. And every band who used the rig sounded great, an array of Precisions, Jazzes and Ricks, all sounded amazing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Jack Posted January 6, 2018 Share Posted January 6, 2018 On 03/01/2018 at 12:07, dannybuoy said: I like messing around with different preamp pedals, so I can effectively use the Orange at its flat setting as a cheap but very loud and very nice sounding power amp! About the common valve swap for lower gain tubes - does it end up sounding basically the same but for example gain at 9 o'clock on a 12AX7 equivalent to 1 o'clock on a 12AU7? Or is there an audible change in tone Pretty much. There may be a very slight change in tone, but essentially what you get is greater control. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
la bam Posted January 6, 2018 Share Posted January 6, 2018 If an amps flat setting is: Bass - 0/off Mids - 12 oclock High - 0/off How do you dial out/cut the lows and highs? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dannybuoy Posted January 6, 2018 Share Posted January 6, 2018 (edited) ^ Flat setting is mids maxed rather than 12 o'clock btw. Tone control on your bass for the treble, cab positioning for low end response (i.e. get it up off the floor or further from the wall)! Or all from your bass if you have an active pre! But I've never found the OTB's 'flat' setting overly bright or bassy. There are simulations online of passive tone stacks of you want to see what's possible. One oddity for example is that with all EQ knobs off, no sound passes through at all. Edited January 6, 2018 by dannybuoy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gjones Posted January 6, 2018 Share Posted January 6, 2018 (edited) On 1/3/2018 at 04:14, mcnach said: I'm not familiar with those cabs, but I often use an Orange Terror Bass 500 at a local music venue, through either their Orange 410 (forget which model) or my own cabs at times. I always end up turning the bass EQ down quite a bit and turning up the mids. With the knobs at 12 o'clock it's too bassy for my liking for sure. Don't be afraid of turning down the bass knob on that amp. Yes I know what you mean about the sound at Stramash. The first thing I do is turn the bass on the Orange Terror all the way down. I don't know if it's an issue with the amp, or just the general boominess of the room, that's the problem? I suspect it's due to the coupling effect with the stage. They need to find some beer crates to put that 4x10 on. Edited January 6, 2018 by gjones Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcnach Posted January 6, 2018 Share Posted January 6, 2018 4 hours ago, gjones said: Yes I know what you mean about the sound at Stramash. The first thing I do is turn the bass on the Orange Terror all the way down. I don't know if it's an issue with the amp, or just the general boominess of the room, that's the problem? I suspect it's due to the coupling effect with the stage. They need to find some beer crates to put that 4x10 on. I think is a combination of that amp (if flat bass EQ is all the way anticlockwise!) and the big box that is that stage. I started using my BF Two10 largely because when you place it over the 410, it sounds great. These days I never seem to be able to park around the corner as I used to, so I don't bother... but yes, amp's bass EQ all the way down for sure, and turn up the mids. I am surprised they haven't yet put a crate under the amp... but if everybody does like we do, talk about it and not tell them, then it might never happen I like Stramash, but you do need it packed for anything to sound half decent in that room. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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