JohnDaBass Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 Hi All, Saw on Facebook this morning something about Gibson USA in financial trouble. Has anybody got any REAL information? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spongebob Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 They're a no-show for NAMM this year. Memphis plant is closing...not good! I've got a bass on order - 6 weeks waiting time (originally), we're over that an still no news. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnDaBass Posted January 5, 2018 Author Share Posted January 5, 2018 Wow, that sounds bad. Business must be tough if they are closing manufacturing plants. Perhaps they see the future as simply 'branding' products shipped from lower cost manufacturing centres. Really sad if we lose the Gibson brand and heritage :-( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoneFurrow Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 Gibson will have a big stand at CES in Las Vegas next week, so perhaps their focus is on developing some of their pro-audio brands such as Cakewalk, KRK, Neat, and Onkyo. I didn't even know Onkyo was part of the group! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnakeEyes Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 Maybe they will move more plants to Asia, as many did before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FinnDave Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 Oh good, perhaps my 2017 EB4 will suddenly become a collector's piece, 'last of the real American Gibsons'. I was thinking of selling it, but maybe I should hang on for a while! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnakeEyes Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 Just now, FinnDave said: Oh good, perhaps my 2017 EB4 will suddenly become a collector's piece, 'last of the real American Gibsons'. I was thinking of selling it, but maybe I should hang on for a while! That's a damn good idea. I would buy all remaining pieces from the regional franchise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wateroftyne Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 42 minutes ago, LoneFurrow said: Gibson will have a big stand at CES in Las Vegas next week, so perhaps their focus is on developing some of their pro-audio brands such as Cakewalk.. *snip* ...haven't they just shot Cakewalk in the head? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skybone Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 Haven't they been toeing the line for some years now, especially after some of their wood stocks were seized by the Authorities. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZilchWoolham Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 20 minutes ago, SnakeEyes said: Maybe they will move more plants to Asia, as many did before. That would be a shame. One thing I actually respect Gibson for is their refusal to stamp their non-US guitars with the (lone) Gibson brand. Makes things less confusing. If you're buying a Gibson, you're getting a US made guitar. You might not be getting a good guitar, mind, but it will be made in the states. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnakeEyes Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 2 minutes ago, ZilchWoolham said: That would be a shame. One thing I actually respect Gibson for is their refusal to stamp their non-US guitars with the (lone) Gibson brand. Makes things less confusing. If you're buying a Gibson, you're getting a US made guitar. You might not be getting a good guitar, mind, but it will be made in the states. I understand how you feel, however when money (and, more importantly, the lack of it) is the main factor, all other motives unfortunately go down the drain, and it's natural. Times are hard, on a global level. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lee-Man Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 They are in horrific debt. $520 million to be precise. $145 million is secured and due in July 2018 and the remainder is a credit note that comes to maturity in August. They've sold 3 good properties in the last month or so, but these won't be finalised in time. Moody's have lowered their credit rating. It's hugely unlikely they will secure the funding they desperately need. There's multiple reasons for this situation. Using credit to expand in to tech companies and poor, short sighted senior management seems to have caused most of them. Plenty of commentary in the MI & financial blogs/press: http://bobbyowsinskiblog.com/2017/08/31/gibson-shakeup/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cato Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 Even if the worst comes to the worst, the Gibson brand will survive, although it may take a while to unravel it from it's various subsidiaries and partners. Under US bankruptcy laws I'm fairly sure that once bankruptcy is declared it's possible to sell on the brand without the new owners taking on any of the associated debt. How much of Gibson's manufacturing heritage would survive such a move is a different matter entirely, although personally I find it difficult to imagine that the new management wouldn't want to keep at least some manufacturing in the US and preferably at one of traditional sites. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctor J Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 This came out a while ago http://bravewords.com/news/gibson-to-sell-memphis-guitar-factory Juszkiewicz seems to be utterly inept and behind some truly baffling decisions, such as enforcing the robo-tuning crap on many models, and is trying to put a "we meant to do this" spin as the cold sea creeps over the bow. How he has remained CEO for so long will probably only be explained in a long documentary in a decade's time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gottastopbuyinggear Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 5 hours ago, ZilchWoolham said: That would be a shame. One thing I actually respect Gibson for is their refusal to stamp their non-US guitars with the (lone) Gibson brand. Makes things less confusing. If you're buying a Gibson, you're getting a US made guitar. You might not be getting a good guitar, mind, but it will be made in the states. I really can’t imagine the brand ceasing to exist, but on the other hand you never know, so I’m glad I bought my Les Paul when I did. It's an iconic instrument - plays and sounds fantastic, though the binding is an absolute dogs dinner in places, and I’d be shocked to see something like that come from any of the other big names. I wonder how much of their trouble is caused by questionable business strategy and how much by good old fashioned lack of attention to quality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingrayPete1977 Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 They've never made a bass I've enjoyed playing, their current build quality is rubbish and Tokai have been building better versions of their flagship Les Pauls at all price points for years. Probably best to just sell T Shirts from now on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cato Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 8 minutes ago, stingrayPete1977 said: Tokai have been building better versions of their flagship Les Pauls at all price points for years. I used to read Guitarist magazine in the early 90s. One month they interviewed Carter the Unstoppable Sex Machine, one of whom caused a riot in the next months letters page by saying he vastly preferred his Tokai Les Paul to the genuine Gibsons he'd tried. We're talking full on flaming torches and farm implements. I've found it interesting in recent years that opinion seems to have swung round to agree with him that early 90s Japanese Tokais were indeed better instruments than US Gibsons of the same era. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gottastopbuyinggear Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 16 minutes ago, stingrayPete1977 said: They've never made a bass I've enjoyed playing, their current build quality is rubbish and Tokai have been building better versions of their flagship Les Pauls at all price points for years. Probably best to just sell T Shirts from now on. I have a middle of the range Tokai 335 copy. Guitarist in my band has a Gibson 335. I daren't let him try my Tokai as I think it’ll just depress him. 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jezzaboy Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 59 minutes ago, Cato said: We're talking full on flaming torches and farm implements. Some of our US brothers take the very severe hump if you slag off US made products. Maybe that`s a good thing, to be proud of products made in your own country but the quality of some Gibson`s, Fenders and Ric`s does leave a lot to be desired. But that could be said of most mass produced manufacturers. Give me a Tokia over a Gibson any day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoneFurrow Posted January 6, 2018 Share Posted January 6, 2018 8 hours ago, wateroftyne said: ...haven't they just shot Cakewalk in the head? Fair point about Cakewalk; slipped my mind. Their brand strategy seems rather confused at the moment, or maybe it's just me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hellzero Posted January 6, 2018 Share Posted January 6, 2018 Ask any Gibson dealer about their mandatory buying policy and you'll have a great part of the answer to this highly predictable potential bankruptcy... Add to that the fact that their R&D department and marketing are lead by real American idiots believing that their almighty power over the guitar world is definitely acquired because of their brand name and you'll understand that the rest will be history. Sad but true. But don't worry, Fender will follow the same stupid path as people managing the brand don't know a thing about musicians real todays needs. The more I think about it, the more I see the old punks slogan : No future ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thegummy Posted January 6, 2018 Share Posted January 6, 2018 I searched Google news to see if there were any stories about Gibson being in trouble and found a story that they're suing Funko (collectible figures) because a the Slash and James Hetfield models are holding Gibson guitars! I really hate that, almost makes me consider my upcoming purchase of a Gibson. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kodiakblair Posted January 6, 2018 Share Posted January 6, 2018 @thegummy Why ? Slash's LP a ghost build ? I know they have or had a Slash model but his own wasn't a Gibson. Take your pick from any of these for the story. https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=Slash+ghost+built+guitar&rlz=1C1CHBF_enGB751GB752&oq=Slash+ghost+built+guitar&aqs=chrome..69i57.11286j0j4&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grahambythesea Posted January 6, 2018 Share Posted January 6, 2018 8 hours ago, stingrayPete1977 said: They've never made a bass I've enjoyed playing, their current build quality is rubbish and Tokai have been building better versions of their flagship Les Pauls at all price points for years. Probably best to just sell T Shirts from now on. With respect to the quality, I think you’re wrong. My recent EB5 purchase is a cracker, I can find nothing to fault it on in terms of quality and all recent reviews of the2013 & 2017 EBs are of the same opinion. The body designs may not be to everyone’s taste, that is after all entirely subjective but when it comes to finish and fittings they are very good. However their lack of consistency in producing a line is questionable. It must cost a fair bit to set up production of a guitar and then only to give it a 2 year run doesn’t make economic sense. The recent introduction of multitudinous colours of SGs also seems a bit pointless. If you buy an SG you probably want a cherry one or a walnut one. The root of the problem seems to be their bonkers acquisition strategies. They buy up a brand and fail to keep producing that which the brand is good at i.e.Tobias, they let Michael go and the brand all but disappears. I believe they did the same with Trace Elliot & Cakewalk to name a couple more. Add to this the unnecessary additives such as auto tuners which have to be a complete waste of time, who wants them, guitarists can usually tune a guitar, it’s fundamental! A change of ownership may be the making of them, if this can be achieved by the present company going under.! Hopefully a guitarist/ luthier could run the company and concentrate on what they are good at. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingrayPete1977 Posted January 6, 2018 Share Posted January 6, 2018 I've seen a few up close and they were all great, mind you the last one I tried cost a grand more than a Gibson! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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