Hartke vs Peavey...

[andrewrx7]

Thinking about getting either the Hartke LH500 or Peavey Tour 450.

Been reading the recent thread about the LH 500, and seems to get pretty favourable comments.

What about the Tour 450? Anyone used one?

Basically - [u][b]LH500 or the Tour 450[/b][/u]?


For some reason, I am being drawn to the 450.....

[Stan_da_man]

Hey, I've played both and own the Tour 450. They are both great heads, but if you want a more dirty valve tone, go for the Hartke but if you are looking for a more clean sound go for the Tour. It's hard to describe each head - just go and play 'em!

I've had my Tour 450 since April and it hasn't put a foot wrong - I'm very happy with it.

[Fraktal]

***WARNING: EXPLICIT FLAMING BELOW***

11-12 years ago I bought a hartke HA7000 head and a 410XL cabinet. The HA7000 was at that time the top-of-the-line brand flagship amplifier, 350w+350w with built in crossover, valve preamp, compressor and everything you could need from an amp. I also added a 2x15" celestion sidewinder cabinet and ended up with a rig 6 feet tall that I thought was the truly ultimate rig. Strangely enough, I couldnt get a really good sound out of that monster gig, and also lacked volume and power somewhat, compared to any other similar power amplifier. but I blamed my inexperience as a musician.

All that happened around that age we all suffer when looks matter more than anything else (Uhhh... aluminium cones! Wooo... SHINY!). It soon turned out to be a very expensive mistake. One of the two 350w power stages started failing often, so a sound engineer friend and me decided to open it and check the insides. I wish I had a camera to immortalize his face when he saw the power stages: He couldnt believe such an expensive head was using so cheap components and such a crappy design: Instead of using the good, old, reliable and trusted metal encased bipolar power transistors they used 3-legged epoxy chips. He was the most reputed man in my city when repairing stuff and knew those transistor models pretty well. His diagnostic was immediate: Overheating triggering the protection. He said that was a tipical case with those transistors he had seen hundreds of times before and he even advised me against replacing them, charging me nothing for the diagnostic and losing a fair amount of bucks, since most likely the same problem will happen again shortly after the repair in his experience.

Shortly after one of the 10" aluminium speakers started rattling and the combined efforts of a few people to fix it without replacing were in vain. We found no visible reasons for the problem, the cone looked to be in perfect condition, so we though it might be a problem with the piston and magnet alignment/movement. I'm still wondering how a 10" aluminium speaker, supposedly thought and designed to reproduce the full frequency spectrum of a bass guitar could FAIL while working with a crossover cut @250Hz (high pass), while also handling half the RMS power it was rated for. RIDICULOUS. LAUGHABLE. SHAME. FAIL!!!

That was way too much for me, I was FURIOUS after spending big bucks in the rig of my dreams to find out it was made by Toys'r'us. At that time, the dollar price was very high and I really had to make a very serious economic effort during many months to afford it.

Years later I understood a few basics about professional audio, such as speaker sensitivity, decibels, etc. Then a few things started making sense to me: a 4x10 cabinet with a 98dB sensitivity 1w@1m is, by all means, a clear sign of inefficent speakers. By comparison, a Markbass 4x10 cab is rated at 103dB. You might think 5dB difference is not that much, right? Wrong. To achieve 103dB sensitivity using the hartke 410XL you will need FOUR OF THEM. Thats right, 16 hartke speakers to do the job of 4 markbass (B&C) speakers.

I also learnt that SAMSON bought HARTKE some time before I bought my shiny rig. SAMSON quality control, reliability and sound quality have been rated as low as BEHRINGER and often even lower... Go figure.

Moral of the question? I wont touch sh*t with "hartke" brand written on it with a barge pole. IMO and IME they sell overpriced and overhiped crap with a quality in par with behringer.

There. Now I feel much better! xD

[Jase]

FWIW......If it's simplicity you want with just a very simple bass, mid and treble Eq with a punchy, loud and warm tube/valve tone, give Hartke a blast. Either way they're both good quality at good prices.

[GremlinAndy]

On returning to bass after a 10 year break I decided to buy a Hartke HA7000. No matter what I did I couldn't get a good sound from it. (Through a Son Of Bertha and a Goliath Jr cabs) It always sounded very unpleasant to my ears...
I'm sure some people don't mind the sound they get, but I HATED it, like no other amp I ever owned. I can't comment on the reliability, as I didn't keep it long enough, but I would NEVER buy Hartke again based on my experiences.

[silverfoxnik]

I haven't tried the new Hartke range, which seems to be getting rave reviews, but I did have a Hartke HA3500 2 years ago and I just couldn't get a sound out of it that I liked; it was too sterile sounding even when using the valve preamp to try to dirty it up.

But I've had 3 Peavey amps over the years - a Session Bass, the T-Max and one of the old 1980's Mark IV head with 2 channels which I still own - and I much prefer them tonally to the HA3500.

It's all about personal taste though, so the only way to know for sure would be to try both amps out if you can.

[johnnylager]

[quote name='silverfoxnik' post='331898' date='Nov 18 2008, 10:20 PM']...one of the old 1980's Mark IV head with 2 channels which I still own[/quote]
:wub:

[silverfoxnik]

[quote name='johnnylager' post='331904' date='Nov 18 2008, 10:25 PM']:wub:[/quote]
..Great amps John - did you used to own one too?

[phatbass787]

Have you checked out the Ashdown MAG 600? Great head for the money imo, as people have said gotta be worth trying 2 or 3 different heads with different cabs and go with what you like the sound of

The MAG info is here;

[url="http://www.ashdownmusic.com/bass/detail.asp?ID=207"]http://www.ashdownmusic.com/bass/detail.asp?ID=207[/url]

[GremlinAndy]

I've just been catching up on the new Hartke reviews. I like the theory they seem to be using with the new amp. Get a great sound from a simple amp, give it plenty of watts and bobs your uncle. I mean I HATE Hartke stuff from my experiences of owning it. But if just half of what is being said about this is true then they have a winner. I won't buy it myself, because I just don't trust the stuff, and there are plenty of alternatives out there. But good luck to em.

Andy

[Jase]

I used to own a 1978 Peavey Centurion head. I haven't tried the Peavey Tour 450.....I think there is a review of the tour series here:[url="http://www.bassplayer.tv/"]bass player tv[/url]

Edited November 19, 2008 by Jase

[waynepunkdude]

I should have never sold my Peavey MK 3

[peted]

I've been using my Hartke 3500 head for quite a few years now. I've replaced the Sovtek valve with a Groove Tubes Mullard and put an Aphex Bass Xciter in front of it and that seems to have beefed up the otherwise very thin sound I got from it.

The amp doesn't sound inspiring when played on its own, but in a band setting it really cuts through and sounds great in the mix. It gives me miles of headroom even from it's 350 Watt spec. The only gripes I've got with it are that it hums quite loudly when it's on, so it's not all that great in the studio, the onboard compressor just sucks all the tone out of your playing and is best left off, and it's quite heavy compared to all these tiny digital amps which are popular at the moment.

[johnnylager]

[quote name='silverfoxnik' post='331929' date='Nov 18 2008, 10:46 PM']..Great amps John - did you used to own one too?[/quote]
I've done some very, very silly things in my life, such as buying an Alfasud and binning Della who's dad owned the Curlew in Leigh Park, but flogging me Mk IV and the Sunn 2x15 it sat on [in the early 90's I guess], quite possibly outranks them all. I would buy them back tomorrow. Twice. Best rig I've ever used in anger.

EDIT: Still saving for an LH1000 & one of Claber's Big Ones though. I hope it comes close to that Mk IV / Sunn rig.

Edited November 19, 2008 by johnnylager

[silverfoxnik]

[quote name='johnnylager' post='332161' date='Nov 19 2008, 11:07 AM']I've done some very, very silly things in my life, such as buying an Alfasud and binning Della who's dad owned the Curlew in Leigh Park, but flogging me Mk IV and the Sunn 2x15 it sat on [in the early 90's I guess], quite possibly outranks them all. I would buy them back tomorrow. Twice. Best rig I've ever used in anger.

EDIT: Still saving for an LH1000 & one of Claber's Big Ones though. I hope it comes close to that Mk IV / Sunn rig.[/quote]


I'm sure it will and it'll be lighter to carry around! Quite how Della would take to coming in 2nd to a Peavey Mark IV, god only knows....

[Merton]

[quote name='johnnylager' post='332161' date='Nov 19 2008, 11:07 AM']EDIT: Still saving for an LH1000 & one of Claber's Big Ones though. I hope it comes close to that Mk IV / Sunn rig.[/quote]
I'm wanting the LH1000 with two of Alex's Compact cabs. That would be monstrous

[johnnylager]

[quote name='Merton' post='332878' date='Nov 20 2008, 09:02 AM']I'm wanting the LH1000 with two of Alex's Compact cabs. That would be monstrous [/quote]
Ooh, stop it!

[BassJase]

I quite like Hartke bass amps, but never enough to really buy one. I was initially interested in the new LH500 but it does 500w at 4ohms, and i'm a 2ohm guy.
My first rig (bloody hell, 15 years ago!!) was a Peavey Mk VI with a massive 1810 cab, and it was the absolute monkeys chuff. I now own a Peavey T-Maxx and love it to bits, probably the most versatile sounding amp i've ever tried. Shame it weighs as much as a bloody estate car though.....!

But yeah, I say Peavey every time. They last forever, sound great for the price, and you can pick up a Tour 450, a Firebass or Session bass head for about £250 these days, absolute bargains.

[silverfoxnik]

[quote name='johnnylager' post='332883' date='Nov 20 2008, 09:12 AM']Ooh, stop it![/quote]


That's so Frankie Howerd!

[JakeBrownBass]

used a Hartke HA3500 for countless gigs with matching vx cabs.
This amp was great and only got rid to upgrade!

-Jake

[clash33]

I use the LH500 with a Marshall 410 which is rated at 4 Ohms. I now wish to ask a stupid question, the head has two 4 Ohms speaker outputs, does this mean I can add a further Speaker (say a Marshall 15) rated ay 4 Ohms directly into the head without any problems. As it stands my rig is LOUD anyway, but I would just like to know.

By the way love the LH500 head - simple

[Merton]

No. The LH500 is rated for a minimum impedance of 4 ohms. You're using that already - if you add another cab you risked blowing the power stage...

[clash33]

[quote name='Merton' post='333678' date='Nov 21 2008, 10:28 AM']No. The LH500 is rated for a minimum impedance of 4 ohms. You're using that already - if you add another cab you risked blowing the power stage...[/quote]
I stand corrected the 2 speaker outputs are marked at 8 Ohms each - my eyes need testing

Edited November 21, 2008 by clash33

[Merton]

[quote name='clash33' post='333679' date='Nov 21 2008, 10:31 AM']That's what I thought, strange that it has 2 outputs marked as 4 Ohm[/quote]
Not really. It's 4 ohm min - you can run an 8 ohm speaker from each output. It's standard practice to mark the minimum impedance of the amp so you don't go below that.

[alexclaber]

[quote name='clash33' post='333669' date='Nov 21 2008, 10:18 AM']I use the LH500 with a Marshall 410 which is rated at 4 Ohms. I now wish to ask a stupid question, the head has two 4 Ohms speaker outputs, does this mean I can add a further Speaker (say a Marshall 15) rated ay 4 Ohms directly into the head without any problems.[/quote]

You can use one 4 ohm cab or two 8 ohm cabs. According to their manual it should say 8 ohms next to each output but I wouldn't be surprised if they've printed the wrong thing on the amp!

I was surprised at the amount of circuitry in the LH500 internals pic but I'd forgetten about the DI and the FX loop:



Top-right is the power amp. Middle is the toroidal mains transformer, and power supply section (big caps etc.) Bottom left looks like it'll be the DI and FX loop circuitry. So all the preamp consists of is the lone valve and the few surrounding components. Very neat!

Peavey are hugely reliable and their tone is always solid. This new Hartke is gloriously simple which increase the probability of high reliability and as long as your cab doesn't have weak mids then the Fender/Alembic topology circuitry is very toneful indeed!

Alex