Nick Fyffe and not digging in!

[Delberthot]

I tend to dig in or play lightly depending on what song I am playing. I have always set up my basses so that I only get fret rattle when I dig in.

I've found that if I can't hear myself properly then that's when I really dig in. Got my first blister in years a few weeks ago playing a charity gig as I couldn't have my cab right next to me and turning up louder would've been too loud for everyone else on stage

[Mykesbass]

2 minutes ago, Delberthot said:

I tend to dig in or play lightly depending on what song I am playing. I have always set up my basses so that I only get fret rattle when I dig in.

I've found that if I can't hear myself properly then that's when I really dig in. Got my first blister in years a few weeks ago playing a charity gig as I couldn't have my cab right next to me and turning up louder would've been too loud for everyone else on stage

This is the very reason for my OP. I have been very much the same, including blisters (with flatwounds!), But watching Nick made me realise you could sound right on any song without getting too physical. 

Turning up shouldn't make you louder if you compensate with the amount of energy you use in the right hand.

After last night I would seriously recommend you give it a go.

[bassbiscuits]

On 21 February 2018 at 07:19, OutSpoon said:

I'm definitely in the 'diggin' camp. Grew up listening to Geddy, Flea and Bill Gould...  all my technique came from those guys... 

This^ 

Im a really heavy handed baboon of a player, tho I think/hope as I'm getting older that reliance on just brute force might be giving way to a bit more finesse.

Once I'm on stage and getting into it, digging in feels exactly right quite a lot of the time. 

[Count Bassy]

No of heard (or heard of) Nick Fyfe, but it strikes me that playing lightly and playing heavily produce quite different sounds. Both are equally valid. If this Nick Fyfe can get that range with just plying lightly then good for him.

Out of interest, how do you know how hard he's playing? - it is possibly to play heavily without fingers flailing all over the place.

 

[Mykesbass]

8 hours ago, Count Bassy said:

No of heard (or heard of) Nick Fyfe, but it strikes me that playing lightly and playing heavily produce quite different sounds. Both are equally valid. If this Nick Fyfe can get that range with just plying lightly then good for him.

Out of interest, how do you know how hard he's playing? - it is possibly to play heavily without fingers flailing all over the place.

 

That's exactly what I thought, but watching him has changed my mind. He was getting a powerful, driving sound, and, from having a good view in a relatively small venue (Concord 2, Brighton) am confident he was playing with a light touch - he was just stroking the strings, a bit like the demo videos you see of fusion players with ramps on their basses, which is what I thought this technique was all about.

[EMG456]

This may or may not be stating the obvious but I’ll go ahead anyway.

if you would like to have the sound created by “digging in” but from a lighter touch, you’ll need to set up your bass a bit differently, perhaps with a lower action and also maybe with lighter strings.

Then you can get all the clank and rattle you want with less physical effort but of course if you like to vary your tone by playing lighter sometimes, you’ll need to modulate that down as well.

[Rayman]

I used pound the strings like a ruddy jack hammer, Steve Harris style. I was always a heavy player with heavy strings, and it was a bit of a workout doing gigs, especially being the singer too.

Then I watched Gary Willis play. Effortless technique and beautiful tone. He looked like he might doze off mid song it was that easy.

Now I'm with the Billy Gibbons school of thought. Make it easy for yourself. Lighter strings, lighter touch.... just turn your amp up! 

Edited February 26, 2018 by Rayman

[Mykesbass]

1 hour ago, Rayman said:

I used pound the strings like a ruddy jack hammer, Steve Harris style. I was always a heavy player with heavy strings, and it was a bit of a workout doing gigs, especially being the singer too.

Then I watched Gary Willis play. Effortless technique and beautiful tone. He looked like he might doze off mid song it was that easy.

Now I'm with the Billy Gibbons school of thought. Make it easy for yourself. Lighter strings, lighter touch.... just turn your amp up! 

And have you, or your bandmates noticed any great difference in the sound?

[chris_b]

"Digging in" is fine if that is what you want to do. If it is an ingredient in your style or "expected" in the genre that you play in. But if you're "digging in" because you can't play any other way, you're doing it wrong. I haven't had blisters or callouses since I was 17. Learn to back off your right hand technique and see what an improvement that makes.

[Count Bassy]

Ignoring tone altogether, I love the way Normal Watt-Roy attacks his bass. May not help the sound at all, but looks great.

 

[Mykesbass]

9 hours ago, Count Bassy said:

Ignoring tone altogether, I love the way Normal Watt-Roy attacks his bass. May not help the sound at all, but looks great.

 

Can't argue with that! (Well, I'm sure on here someone can but it won't be me  )

[Lozz196]

Well as a result of this thread I`ve decided to have slightly lighter strings, and a lighter pick, and to add in more bass & volume from the amp. Whether or not it will work who knows but it was only when reading this that I realised that often I do tend to set the amp so I have to hit hard to hear myself, and that on gigs where I get a lot of bass through the monitors, I do back off a bit and the performance hasn`t suffered as a result. So I`m gonna give it a go, never too old to learn, and it might just make things easier as I do find at the end of an hour-long set that my pick-hand aches somewhat.

[Mykesbass]

2 hours ago, Lozz196 said:

Well as a result of this thread I`ve decided to have slightly lighter strings, and a lighter pick, and to add in more bass & volume from the amp. Whether or not it will work who knows but it was only when reading this that I realised that often I do tend to set the amp so I have to hit hard to hear myself, and that on gigs where I get a lot of bass through the monitors, I do back off a bit and the performance hasn`t suffered as a result. So I`m gonna give it a go, never too old to learn, and it might just make things easier as I do find at the end of an hour-long set that my pick-hand aches somewhat.

Nice one Lozz. Let me know how it goes. I'm sticking with it, but still got big meaty flats on!

[Delberthot]

I say live and let live - If you're happy with your playing ( I know I am ) clap your hands. If you feel the need to change or a condition forces you to change styles then go for it - it's always good to learn new skills if you feel the need to.

At the end of the day it's a hobby for most of us, not a competition. If I get a blister one gig out of a thousand then it's something at that gig that caused it, not necessarily my playing style.

[Mykesbass]

13 minutes ago, Delberthot said:

I say live and let live - If you're happy with your playing ( I know I am ) clap your hands. If you feel the need to change or a condition forces you to change styles then go for it - it's always good to learn new skills if you feel the need to.

At the end of the day it's a hobby for most of us, not a competition. If I get a blister one gig out of a thousand then it's something at that gig that caused it, not necessarily my playing style.

Blimey @Delberthot, you make it sound that I'm on some jihadist mission to rid the world of bass players that dig in

Point of the OP was that I realised that I could make the sound I want using a technique that, although I knew to be good practice, had previously not felt right.

[Daz39]

I play heavy handed because for most of the times I have a bass in my hands the amp is not on. I have to dig in to hear myself properly, particularly if playing along to music.

[Guest]

Playing with a lighter touch isn’t about whether you dig in or not; it’s about the dynamics available to you. Gary Willis’ instructional VHS is/was on YouTube and he explains it succinctly in about 5 minutes near the beginning. By turning up and playing lighter, you get a more even, fatter tone, and most importantly, you can lift the volume by digging in a touch. If you play hard and dig in, where do you go if the band lifts their dynamics? Of course it’s not for everyone - but if it sounds interesting, it’s worth a try. I surprised myself how much less energy I needed to play a note - which makes me feel more relaxed, in control, smoother and more fluid.

[Mykesbass]

8 hours ago, FDC484950 said:

Playing with a lighter touch isn’t about whether you dig in or not; it’s about the dynamics available to you. Gary Willis’ instructional VHS is/was on YouTube and he explains it succinctly in about 5 minutes near the beginning. By turning up and playing lighter, you get a more even, fatter tone, and most importantly, you can lift the volume by digging in a touch. If you play hard and dig in, where do you go if the band lifts their dynamics? Of course it’s not for everyone - but if it sounds interesting, it’s worth a try. I surprised myself how much less energy I needed to play a note - which makes me feel more relaxed, in control, smoother and more fluid.

Thanks, will see if I can find this.

[Chris2112]

I've long followed Jeff Berlin's advice of turning your volume up, and playing with a light touch. It is absolutely the way I like to play. I suffer less fatigue in my hands, I have more control over dynamic and I my playing is smoother, faster and more consistent. I do sometimes dig in for the odd note or phrase to really add a flourish but my playing was really improved immeasurably by playing lighter.

 

[Passinwind]

On 2/23/2018 at 12:07, arthurhenry said:

Using a ramp, or raised pickup is what enables me to dig in!

Yep, I understand that apparent contradiction.