Bean9seventy - the first UK funk / slap bassist?

[lojo]

Disco , funk and the like have been a big passion of mine since I was a teenager in the mid 80s so I can only know the history of the early days in the 70s from reading and documentaries as I was not there .

After watching the clip in the OP I am now not sure what it's really about , most of the stuff he says fits with what I already believe I know , but I am now to believe I should consider this guy part of the history I love so much ?

He also mentioned the reason you don't hear him on Galliano & Incognito recording s is because he turned his back on the music industry , but unless I missed it he did not say why ? 

 

 

[Bean9seventy]

8 hours ago, lojo said:

Disco , funk and the like have been a big passion of mine since I was a teenager in the mid 80s so I can only know the history of the early days in the 70s from reading and documentaries as I was not there .

After watching the clip in the OP I am now not sure what it's really about , most of the stuff he says fits with what I already believe I know , but I am now to believe I should consider this guy part of the history I love so much ?

He also mentioned the reason you don't hear him on Galliano & Incognito recording s is because he turned his back on the music industry , but unless I missed it he did not say why ? 

 

 

i ran away from show biz not long after the world disco champs 78 ,,, & then again  1982 /83 in the music industry ,, why ? a lot of reasons ,, put in simple terms ,,

many people who go into show biz / music ,, really want to do it , i did not like the environment being a free ordinary club dancer , show biz / music is ruthless , it can have a great effect on those it disappoints the most ,, 

to progress in both you learn to tread on other people , i refused to do that , 1981 was a tough year ,,, i decided to get out of the entire rabbit hole ,

i was the complete opposite of a person who wanted to become famous & would do anything to make it happen ,,

means reverted back to a bed room bassist throughout most of the 80s 

thanks

[lojo]

24 minutes ago, Bean9seventy said:

i ran away from show biz not long after the world disco champs 78 ,,, & then again  1982 /83 in the music industry ,, why ? a lot of reasons ,, put in simple terms ,,

many people who go into show biz / music ,, really want to do it , i did not like the environment being a free ordinary club dancer , show biz / music is ruthless , it can have a great effect on those it disappoints the most ,, 

to progress in both you learn to tread on other people , i refused to do that , 1981 was a tough year ,,, i decided to get out of the entire rabbit hole ,

i was the complete opposite of a person who wanted to become famous & would do anything to make it happen ,,

means reverted back to a bed room bassist throughout most of the 80s 

thanks

Fair enough , I hope whatever you ended up doing served you well 

What about just playing in bands for fun , I think the majority of the people on this site are weekend functions players , self funding hobby types , are you involved in that at all ? 

 

[Bean9seventy]

9 hours ago, SpondonBassed said:

I sometimes wonder what would have happened with Disco, Soul and Funk had the 'Disco Sucks' movement not occurred.

I think it had the effect of driving what was emerging from underground into popular culture right back down there again.  Far from killing the genre it made it stronger.  The underground (as perceived by mainstream culture of the time) was where these beats began.  It's where they thrived.  One megalomaniac DJ was never going to make much of a dent in it.

Britfunk might have been on a slightly better footing because our music was being monopolised less by the broadcasters than ever before.  Soul, Rhythm and Blues, Jazz/funk were all getting mainstream exposure and there was a bit of a revival that just carried on.

Being able to record what you wanted to listen to made a huge difference to the youth now that they had the compact cassette.  I see home recording more as a catalyst than a threat to the music industry.

Stuff that is over commercialised always gets diluted 'till it's got that same packaging and bland delivery as everything else.

Brit funk seems unaffected by Steve Dahl's hate campaign but I'd like to hear your take on that.

Not being resident in the UK at the time, I missed out on a lot of the music that was played in the underground clubs.  For instance, Northern Soul.  Only now am I educating myself.

You asked; "how would you know they were thumbing & plucking slapping the bass in 1975  if you had never seen the method done"?

I remember where I first saw how that sound could be made.  You will not like me for saying.  It was when MK did an extended solo on Channel Four's The Tube in the early eighties.  I was not a bass player then, I was a poser who'd been told by musical mates to hold this (a bass), put your left hand there and hold that string down and pluck.  I became the bassist for Holiday Mood.    Only when I saw MK did I think... AHA!

It lasted for about two years then I dropped out to concentrate on my apprenticeship.  I only picked it up again in my fifties.

so true disco sucks ,,,   ? Dasco ? ,, the entire planet had gone disco gaga , even the news was going disco ,, & thus disco ended underground in 1980? ,,

it continued via studio 21 as two step  ,,, & more fusion tracks & slower  jazz funk  in wine bars ,, it was now nightclub music ,, , there was a retro movement as soon as it ended ,,

so yeah ,, most people outside of USA did not notice / visualize  bass players slapping until brit funk ,, & most people including yourself saw MK ,,  in the battle for Brit funk he came out on top ,,,,

& yes  ,,   paul tubsy williams was a co founder of Incognito etc ,,

without disco we would not be here ,, thanks

[Bean9seventy]

3 minutes ago, lojo said:

Fair enough , I hope whatever you ended up doing served you well 

What about just playing in bands for fun , I think the majority of the people on this site are weekend functions players , self funding hobby types , are you involved in that at all ? 

 

yeah i used to do that in the 1990s ,,

The London Bass Guitar show s a decent event ,, & you tube is a great outlet thanks

 

[lojo]

It's an interesting question , I've no idea who was the first live or recorded UK funk player . I've got the latest Album by the revived "Atmosfear" and they started recording in the late 70s didn't they ?

[Bean9seventy]

1 hour ago, lojo said:

It's an interesting question , I've no idea who was the first live or recorded UK funk player . I've got the latest Album by the revived "Atmosfear" and they started recording in the late 70s didn't they ?

Hi Tension was the 1st brit funk gig ,,, Dancing ,, dancing in outer space by atmosphere became a DJ classic 1st pressings of atmosphere i think were on white label ?  ,

thus brit funk only had a handful of bands (about 4 bands ? ) with associated musicians within their circles ,, before the disco sucks demonstration march , circa 1980 ,, thanks ,

 

[lojo]

Are we looking for the first disco player or first player to slap ? 

Love the high tension video 

[SpondonBassed]

1 hour ago, lojo said:

Are we looking for the first disco player or first player to slap ? 

Love the high tension video 

I like the quote from this:

"Disco music is funk with a bow tie. —Fred Wesley, James Brown’s trombonist."

In this article, it is said that disco started as early as the sixties in sophisticated dance clubs in Paris and New York.  It became more widely known in the seventies because of its popularity in the gay underground dance clubs in New York and those sophisticated Parisian clubs.

@Bean9seventy; Thanks for the Arlene Phillips' Hot Gossip clip.  If my memory serves, I saw that for the first time on one of Kenny Everret's television shows.

[lowdown]

Although not labelled as ‘Brit Funk’, ‘Olympic Runners’ & ‘ Gonzalez’ were two British Funk/Disco bands that were very active from about 1974 onwards. Bassist DeLisle Harper and Drummer Glen LeFleur were in both bands. A couple of funky players who played on quite a few sessions in the 70’s.

1976

 

 

1976

 

 

[lojo]

Nice 

The Average White Band where formed in 74 I believe , maybe they popped the first UK bass note ?

 

[lowdown]

8 minutes ago, lojo said:

Nice 

The Average White Band where formed in 74 I believe , maybe they popped the first UK bass note ?

 

Maybe before that. I actually saw them on one of their first gigs. That was at the ‘The Black Prince’ in Old Bexley in 1973. Not long after that they popped off to the States.

[pete.young]

42 minutes ago, lowdown said:

Maybe before that. I actually saw them on one of their first gigs. That was at the ‘The Black Prince’ in Old Bexley in 1973. Not long after that they popped off to the States.

Wikipedia says 1972, with their first album coming out in 1973.

Fascinating history coming out of this thread, I'm really enjoying it.

[lowdown]

20 minutes ago, pete.young said:

Wikipedia says 1972, with their first album coming out in 1973.

Fascinating history coming out of this thread, I'm really enjoying it.

Thinking back, it must have been 1972, because it was a Birthday night out with my friends. My fifteenth, and my first alcoholic drink...

Thanks to the OP,  this thread has certainly had me going back over the 1970’s.

 

[Bilbo]

I always thought that it was Colin Hodgkinson from Back Door.

[Bean9seventy]

4 hours ago, SpondonBassed said:

I like the quote from this:

"Disco music is funk with a bow tie. —Fred Wesley, James Brown’s trombonist."

In this article, it is said that disco started as early as the sixties in sophisticated dance clubs in Paris and New York.  It became more widely known in the seventies because of its popularity in the gay underground dance clubs in New York and those sophisticated Parisian clubs.

@Bean9seventy; Thanks for the Arlene Phillips' Hot Gossip clip.  If my memory serves, I saw that for the first time on one of Kenny Everret's television shows.

yes disco is a french word , its been around a long time , the same as music venues have been around a long time ,, but we all know eg punk rock was different , thus from 1977 - 80 disco had a defined elite sub culture ,

since the late 90s people either side step or air brush the issue away ,, its like they refuse to accept Brit funk was born & who the Real parent were ,, instead they cherry pick who they want their parents to be ,,

Arlene Philips is great , she raised a lot of money for Grenfell last year ,,

maybe because people knew the effect the 1st one had ,,

there were many reasons why i quit the entertainment game ,&  never danced again , thanks ,

[Bean9seventy]

2 hours ago, lowdown said:

Maybe before that. I actually saw them on one of their first gigs. That was at the ‘The Black Prince’ in Old Bexley in 1973. Not long after that they popped off to the States.

no ,,lowdown ,, we call out the average white band ( & others ) not as a names ,, but as a bands that were helping the other bassists , yeah ,,, so when we went to the music shop eg MK worked in ,, we were with ? people from very small circles ,,

[Bean9seventy]

3 hours ago, lowdown said:

Although not labelled as ‘Brit Funk’, ‘Olympic Runners’ & ‘ Gonzalez’ were two British Funk/Disco bands that were very active from about 1974 onwards. Bassist DeLisle Harper and Drummer Glen LeFleur were in both bands. A couple of funky players who played on quite a few sessions in the 70’s.

1976

 

 

1976

 

 

yes along with billy ocean & others the 3 degrees ? ,,, it was soul music before the big bang ,, in 1978 the Olympic runners launched them selves at the london disco finals of the world dsco champ ,, using star wars props ,i should know , i was on stage with them ,

The Real Thing lowdown ,,, you know # lord woodbine #

[lowdown]

You lost me dude....

[Bean9seventy]

4 minutes ago, lowdown said:

You lost me dude....

cool down lowdown ,,,, take it easy ,,

 

[lowdown]

3 minutes ago, Bean9seventy said:

cool down lowdown ,,,, take it easy ,,

 

I’m chilled, ol’ Bean, really. Like I said, you just started to lose me.

 

 

[Bean9seventy]

2 minutes ago, lowdown said:

I’m chilled, ol’ Bean, really. Like I said, you just started to lose me.

 

 

right on , lowdown  eg ,, Greg Edwards , as advertised on capital radio along side kenny everet who played at londons 1st pub disco

[lojo]

2 hours ago, Bean9seventy said:

no ,,lowdown ,, we call out the average white band ( & others ) not as a names ,, but as a bands that were helping the other bassists , yeah ,,, so when we went to the music shop eg MK worked in ,, we were with ? people from very small circles ,,

Sorry I don't get this ? 

[Misdee]

I was about in those days and remember only too well what things were really like.The  mid - to - late  1970's in Britain is not a time I am particularly nostalgic about, for all kinds of reasons.  School disco dancing exhibitions would be one of those reasons.

I also remember the BritFunk movement all too well. Sorry to say it, but much of that music was a second-rate imitation of it's more sophisticated American inspiration. Listening back now, most has not aged well. A very notable exception would be the Average White Band. They were one ( perhaps the only one ) of the very few British bands who were playing  funk/soul music in such an authentic and convincing manner that they enjoyed great success in the USA. They were also notable in that they attracted a multi-racial audience in America - a phenomenon far less common in the 70's than now.  American listeners thought AWB's music sounded just as good as it's US equivalent.

Also, it is my recollection that people were well aware of the  jazz funk and soul music that was coming out of the USA during that era. It certainly wasn't like today where you can go on Youtube and get slapping lessons from Victor Wooten, but records featuring bass techniques like slapping were everywhere. When I had my first bass lessons in a provincial town in the North of England about 40 years ago, the chap giving me tuition knew all about slapping and his technique was perfectly legitimate and correct. It might not have been the information age we live in now, but players still had enough ingenuity and know-how to work out how to play new techniques. In fact, I would venture that musicians were actually better at working out things by ear precisely because  they weren't being spoonfed as they are today.

Edited April 1, 2018 by Misdee

[Bean9seventy]

44 minutes ago, Misdee said:

I was about in those days and remember only too well what things were really like.The  mid - to - late  1970's in Britain is not a time I am particularly nostalgic about, for all kinds of reasons.  School disco dancing exhibitions would be one of those reasons.

I also remember the BritFunk movement all too well. Sorry to say it, but much of that music was a second-rate imitation of it's more sophisticated American inspiration. Listening back now, most has not aged well. A very notable exception would be the Average White Band. They were one ( perhaps the only one ) of the very few British bands who were playing  funk/soul music in such an authentic and convincing manner that they enjoyed great success in the USA. They were also notable in that they attracted a multi-racial audience in America - a phenomenon far less common in the 70's than now.  American listeners thought AWB's music sounded just as good as it's US equivalent.

Also, it is my recollection that people were well aware of the  jazz funk and soul music that was coming out of the USA during that era. It certainly wasn't like today where you can go on Youtube and get slapping lessons from Victor Wooten, but records featuring bass techniques like slapping were everywhere. When I had my first bass lessons in a provincial town in the North of England about 40 years ago, the chap giving me tuition knew all about slapping and his technique was perfectly legitimate and correct. It might not have been the information age we live in now, but players still had enough ingenuity and know-how to work out how to play new techniques. In fact, I would venture that musicians were actually better at working out things by ear precisely because  they weren't being spoonfed as they are today.

i hear what you say ,,  disco people were really into American music , its the music discos & dancers rated most of all , brit funk was all about fans in clubs who wanted to play American music on instruments in bands ,,

one of brit funk missions was to eventually learn how to produce music as good as the Americans ,, that event of "crossing the bridge took place in the mid 80s ? with jaki graham , mica paris etc lisa stansfield ,

i agree brit funk tracks can be fly dropping cheesy , bad mixing ,, because many tracks were recorded in punk rock studios ,,  bad deals , the MTV saga ,

but however the story goes, it all started here ,,, paul tubbsy williams hi tension atmosphere & freeze , later with central line level42 & incognito ,,etc & they got it from ??  Bootsy & The Brothers Johnson ,,  ??

it can not be air brushed out of history or side stepped , yes ,, there will be exceptions to the rule but they will only prove the point  thanks ,