Woodinblack Posted April 4, 2018 Share Posted April 4, 2018 That sounds very loud. We are very loud, far too loud in fact, but I have never turned my RH450 past half way going into 2 1x12s. Basically we have to go up to the volume of the drummer, and he is loud. I wear in ear monitors, they also work like earplugs, I wouldn't be in that volume without them. We are way to loud to have a good sound, if you are louder, I would hate to hear what it sounds like. I have a dream of not having a backline, but I can't imagine it ever happening. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thumperbob 2002 Posted April 4, 2018 Share Posted April 4, 2018 The band leader has no idea........simple as . I think I would be out of there forthwith 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elfrasho Posted April 5, 2018 Share Posted April 5, 2018 My new project has a pa with 2 tops and two subs. Seemed a bit overkill to me, but after a few load ins/load outs without amps and stage monitors (in ears) it makes life very easy! With a digital mixer too, the mix is almost perfect for every gig straight away. The idea of having amps and that sort of set up on stage, baffles me! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EBS_freak Posted April 5, 2018 Share Posted April 5, 2018 3 hours ago, Elfrasho said: The idea of having amps and that sort of set up on stage, baffles me! That's the dinosaurs for you. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solo4652 Posted April 5, 2018 Author Share Posted April 5, 2018 (edited) Quick update: Quietly and carefully, behind the scenes, I've put the main points from this message thread to the band leader, including Mike257's kind offer of advice. Not a word back yet. We're gigging 7th and 13th April. I'll watch what happens - see what changes, if any are made - and then take a view on the situation. You can lead a horse to water, but..... Edited April 5, 2018 by solo4652 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FuNkShUi Posted April 5, 2018 Share Posted April 5, 2018 17 minutes ago, solo4652 said: Quick update: Quietly and carefully, behind the scenes, I've put the main points from this message thread to the band leader, including Mike257's kind offer of advice. Not a word back yet. We're gigging 7th and 13th April. I'll watch what happens - see what changes, if any are made - and then take a view on the situation. You can lead a horse to water, but..... You cant push the bast*rd in and drown him? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solo4652 Posted April 5, 2018 Author Share Posted April 5, 2018 18 minutes ago, FuNkShUi said: You cant push the bast*rd in and drown him? He's a nice guy, actually, and I get on well with him. Part of the problem may be that he's trying to keep the band's two sub-camps happy - there's the loud 'n' blokey rockers, and there's the groove-oriented soul funksters, which is where I am. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jazzmanb Posted April 5, 2018 Share Posted April 5, 2018 (edited) We are a room shaking rock band with a 10k 4 speaker EV set up(just ticking over) They sit in front of the band and everyone goes through them,then your backline is purely that and shouldn't really bleed out front though the guitar amp is miked so it will no doubt travel.My bass rig is quite loud but its pretty much for my benefit only.We can get stage mix right down bu the drums limit how low you can go Edited April 5, 2018 by jazzmanb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingrayPete1977 Posted April 5, 2018 Share Posted April 5, 2018 49 minutes ago, jazzmanb said: the drums limit how low you can go Strictly speaking it's the 'drummer' rather than the drums but you often get more sense from the drumkit! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EBS_freak Posted April 5, 2018 Share Posted April 5, 2018 Tiny kits, miced up. Let the PA do the work. But drummers generally see their kits as an extension of their lower regions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lazzer Posted April 5, 2018 Share Posted April 5, 2018 Absolutely no good reason to have those PA cabs at the back! Sorry but it'd be them, or me that goes! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redbandit599 Posted April 5, 2018 Share Posted April 5, 2018 Might just be worth mentioning that no other band uses this approach - that would seem to speak for itself. We use two RCF 15 tops (325s), and either no sub, one sub or two depending on venue size. Most pubs no subs. The subs aren't to give that 'chest thumping' bass (that's just vanity imho for pub gigs) just on tick over to free up the tops and provide a full sound. Bass Di and keys, guitars, vox and drums all in the PA.Guitarist uses a Helix with an Alto 110 for stage monitoring. Another 110 back with the drummer firing forward with a full mix. Ditched all other monitors as we can hear the FOH . I have my rig so I can hear it. Had a gig recently where due to the space had to have a sub and top behind me. The FOH sound was great but it wasn't pleasant having the rig firing behind me. Not something we'd be keen to replicate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dad3353 Posted April 5, 2018 Share Posted April 5, 2018 4 hours ago, EBS_freak said: T...But drummers generally see their kits as an extension of their lower regions. We'd better not discuss the Fender neck and headstock then, eh..? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluewine Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 (edited) It can be Overkill. Depends how your using the PA. If it's used to fine tune and control your sound I think that's a good thing. And I'd say you really need a dedicated sound guy. Just because some of us are playing small bars and pubs doesn't mean we shouldn't sound our best. If your using an advanced PA for volume only, then I'd say that's questionable. I've seen guys play clubs with no PA and guitar amps for vocals. Doesn't work for me. Blue Edited April 6, 2018 by Bluewine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jus Lukin Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 (edited) - Edited February 25, 2022 by Jus Lukin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bazzbass Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 tell the BL that there is a very good reason that he is the ONLY PERSON IN ROCK AND ROLL HISTORY to have a PA at the BACK of the STAGE. Explain the principle of feedback to him. A PA speaker's job is to project music to the AUDIENCE, foldback speakers are used for on stage monitoring. Seriously, insist on a sound engineer to run sound from now on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dad3353 Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 3 hours ago, bazzbass said: ...he is the ONLY PERSON IN ROCK AND ROLL HISTORY to have a PA at the BACK of the STAGE... [Pedantry] Not strictly true, of course ... (Grateful Dead's 'Wall Of Sound', 1973...) Abandoned quite rapidly, not for acoustic reasons, but the logical complexity of setting up/tearing down was too much for touring. [/Pedantry] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FinnDave Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 7 minutes ago, Dad3353 said: [Pedantry] Not strictly true, of course ... (Grateful Dead's 'Wall Of Sound', 1973...) Abandoned quite rapidly, not for acoustic reasons, but the logical complexity of setting up/tearing down was too much for touring. [/Pedantry] That's what you get when you give a man like Bear an open cheque book and ask him to design the most perfect PA system possible. Still unsurpassed to this day. (they had two of them, and two crews, who leapfrogged each other from gig to gig). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dad3353 Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 (edited) @solo4652: Show your BL the photo ^^; ask if he's prepared to go to those lengths to make it work..? (Be prepared for him to say 'Yes', of course..! ) Edited April 6, 2018 by Dad3353 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
la bam Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 Could the issue be you have a drummer with an electronic kit? And your BL is worried that everyone (but most likely him) must hear him - hence the amount / positioning of the monitoring? And that hes giving everyone the same monitor mix? As said, theres so many better ways to do this, but it could be just the limitations on the desk dont give you enough monitor outs, so hes kind of using a pa sound for everyone. For me, it defeats the point of taking an electronic kit if you then have to put it tbrough a full pa and on top of that upset the othet band members. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BassBunny Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 1 hour ago, la bam said: Could the issue be you have a drummer with an electronic kit? And your BL is worried that everyone (but most likely him) must hear him - hence the amount / positioning of the monitoring? And that hes giving everyone the same monitor mix? As said, theres so many better ways to do this, but it could be just the limitations on the desk dont give you enough monitor outs, so hes kind of using a pa sound for everyone. For me, it defeats the point of taking an electronic kit if you then have to put it tbrough a full pa and on top of that upset the othet band members. I've worked with lots of drummers who used electronic kits and most used either a back line amp themselves and monitor for choice of mix or 2 monitors. One for the drums and one with an overall mix for the fallbacks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rushscored4 Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 (edited) 30 minutes ago, BassBunny said: I've worked with lots of drummers who used electronic kits and most used either a back line amp themselves and monitor for choice of mix or 2 monitors. One for the drums and one with an overall mix for the fallbacks. We have a deputy drummer (last resort) who uses a Roland electronic kit plugged into a keyboard amp. It still sounds terrible however. Edited April 6, 2018 by rushscored4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jazzmanb Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 21 hours ago, stingrayPete1977 said: Strictly speaking it's the 'drummer' rather than the drums but you often get more sense from the drumkit! Well how loud they play is how loud the play .Wouldn't expect someone to tell me to stop hitting the strings so hard or to hit harder 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EBS_freak Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 1 hour ago, jazzmanb said: Well how loud they play is how loud the play .Wouldn't expect someone to tell me to stop hitting the strings so hard or to hit harder That's it, dynamics are officially dead. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EBS_freak Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 2 hours ago, rushscored4 said: We have a deputy drummer (last resort) who uses a Roland electronic kit plugged into a keyboard amp. It still sounds terrible however. Depends on the kit and the amp - this isn't necessarily true for all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.