S'Rays Old & New

[B.Flat]

Hi all.

In my 74th year and still playing, I have never really recovered from the theft of my '77 Stingray some 15 years ago.

I used to be a "one bass guy" but since that time I have never really felt so "at home" again and have been through a handful of basses since, though choice limited by pension and her indoors.

I did manage to land a year of issue Sabre bass from US but it didn't quite hit the button.

So.......... the purpose of this thread is to ask if anyone out there has been able to A/B a pre EB S'Ray with a post EB S'Ray and their conclusions. The date of any compared basses would be useful.

I know I should be over this by now, they are only peaces of wood, but heart refuses to be ruled by head !!

[tom1946]

I know how you feel. I sold my Stingray to Linus27 of this parish and have regretted it ever since. If you're out there Linus I'd like it back please?  

[stingrayPete1977]

The new 'Classic' is worth a try, you might like it,a lot!

[Linus27]

1 hour ago, tom1946 said:

I know how you feel. I sold my Stingray to Linus27 of this parish and have regretted it ever since. If you're out there Linus I'd like it back please?  

Hi Tom, is this the teal 2eq one? Still have her and she is lovely. If I do decide to sell, you get first dibs 😊

[Roger2611]

22 hours ago, B.Flat said:

Hi all.

In my 74th year and still playing, I have never really recovered from the theft of my '77 Stingray some 15 years ago.

I used to be a "one bass guy" but since that time I have never really felt so "at home" again and have been through a handful of basses since, though choice limited by pension and her indoors.

I did manage to land a year of issue Sabre bass from US but it didn't quite hit the button.

So.......... the purpose of this thread is to ask if anyone out there has been able to A/B a pre EB S'Ray with a post EB S'Ray and their conclusions. The date of any compared basses would be useful.

I know I should be over this by now, they are only peaces of wood, but heart refuses to be ruled by head !!

I am sorry to hear that you lost "the one" I stupidly sold my "the one" Precision bass, despite having a whole bunch more I still miss that one everyday. Have you tried the USA sub bass? From what I understand it has wiring that is the same as the original basses which is the opposite of most of today's Ray's....or something like that! Anyway for me after many years of trying to find a Ray that I liked the sound of, I picked up a USA sub and bang! I have that perfect Ray that I always wanted, I did A/B it against a modern 3 eq Ray and for me and the rest of the band the USA sub won hands down, if you are local to Northampton you are more than welcome to come and have a play on it

[Chiliwailer]

It’s a tricky one, I’ve found that many pre EB’s vastly differ, even if the same year. Last year I bought a 79 Sabre as I always regretted selling one of the same year. It was a lovely bass, but it just wasn’t the same as my old one. Marcus at Bass Direct was recently telling me how they had 2 pre EB Stingrays in stock at the same time, and they were chalk and cheese. I can believe that having played a fair few in the past, and also found that on old Fenders of the same year and spec. 

It’s an old cliche, but a good Music Man is a good one, and an average one is an average one, no matter what the year is. 

Sorry to hear your story pal, hope you find a good Ray that you click with. 

[Beedster]

I'm no expert, but I have some views!

1. I have never played a bad pre-EB, whilst I have played and owned a few decidedly average EBs, and one that was ****ing awful. 3-band EQ is a factor for sure in many of the comparisons, it should be better, it isn't

2. Pre EBs seems to be able to do a Precision tone far better than EBs. I need that, many don't, but I think it says something about them as an instrument.

3. Whilst I doubt if I measured the action there'd be a difference, pre-EBs have always felt much more playable to me, they feel and play like the Modulus basses I've owned, I've never found an EBMM that did the same

I have a late-70s and an early 90's MM at present. I have £2000 invested in the former and about £800 in the latter. The EBMM is to my ear and feel a very good example of a post-EB. So, I thought that if the two were equivalent I could sell the pre-EB as I'm currently paying for a load of building work. However, I felt the neck wasn't as good as the pre-EB so decided to buy a Status neck for it (thought it might do the Modulus thing). Guess what, it's SO much better, tone, playability, etc. But, it ain't the pre-EB. Is it worth the £1100 invested in it, hell yes, in fact much more. I plug it into my SVT and it sounds awesome.

But I plug in the pre-EB to the same rig.............. WOW. It's an entirely qualitative difference, not more or less of anything, just a different thing entirely.

Dan (Chiliwailer) really knows his stuff, so I'm not putting this up against him, it's just an alternative viewpoint. His thoughts reflect everything I've experienced with Fender, where perhaps 50% of pre CBS are better than the rest others. With MMs I'd put that at closer to 90%. I've had many basses that I'd never sell and sold all but two of them, my pre-EB and an old Precision FL.  

Look forward to reading further posts on this thread

Chris

[ezbass]

1 hour ago, Roger2611 said:

I picked up a USA sub and bang! I have that perfect Ray that I always wanted, I did A/B it against a modern 3 eq Ray and for me and the rest of the band the USA sub won hands down, 

I have similar findings. My first ‘Ray was a US SUB, I then bought a full fat, 3 band,  US ‘ Ray and I much preferred the tone and playability of the SUB to the vastly more expensive instrument. It sounded more organic and less processed/clattery to the 3 band. I did have an issue with the paint finish on the SUB’s neck, where, after a time, it started to drag on my hand, but a quick strip and Danish oil sorted that out. The best VFM money bass out there (even new)? Yeah, quite possibly.

[Chiliwailer]

45 minutes ago, Beedster said:

I'm no expert, but I have some views!

1. I have never played a bad pre-EB, whilst I have played and owned a few decidedly average EBs, and one that was ****ing awful. 3-band EQ is a factor for sure in many of the comparisons, it should be better, it isn't

2. Pre EBs seems to be able to do a Precision tone far better than EBs. I need that, many don't, but I think it says something about them as an instrument.

3. Whilst I doubt if I measured the action there'd be a difference, pre-EBs have always felt much more playable to me, they feel and play like the Modulus basses I've owned, I've never found an EBMM that did the same

I have a late-70s and an early 90's MM at present. I have £2000 invested in the former and about £800 in the latter. The EBMM is to my ear and feel a very good example of a post-EB. So, I thought that if the two were equivalent I could sell the pre-EB as I'm currently paying for a load of building work. However, I felt the neck wasn't as good as the pre-EB so decided to buy a Status neck for it (thought it might do the Modulus thing). Guess what, it's SO much better, tone, playability, etc. But, it ain't the pre-EB. Is it worth the £1100 invested in it, hell yes, in fact much more. I plug it into my SVT and it sounds awesome.

But I plug in the pre-EB to the same rig.............. WOW. It's an entirely qualitative difference, not more or less of anything, just a different thing entirely.

Dan (Chiliwailer) really knows his stuff, so I'm not putting this up against him, it's just an alternative viewpoint. His thoughts reflect everything I've experienced with Fender, where perhaps 50% of pre CBS are better than the rest others. With MMs I'd put that at closer to 90%. I've had many basses that I'd never sell and sold all but two of them, my pre-EB and an old Precision FL.  

Look forward to reading further posts on this thread

Chris

 

I’m with you Chris, great post.

I just re-read mine, I suppose I didn’t make it clear that the pre EB’s I played, and Marcus talked about, differed in tone, I didn’t mean quality. 

These days I have a 3 band which does exactly what I need a 3 band with rounds to do, and I’m beginning to bond nicely with my new Old Smoothie with flats. They are both so Stingray, but oh so different to each other! 

[stingrayPete1977]

I had two pre EBs at the same time, they had totally different neck shapes, the 82 was the lightest bass I've owned and the 79 the heaviest at around 13lbs. They were both nice but different no doubt about it.

[Burns-bass]

We’re all talking about objective criteria here but the truth is that you had an emotional attachment to that bass and it’s going to be hard to find that with another one. 

Try and explain it to anyone who isn’t a musician and they’d laugh; but we’ve all been through similar things.

Youll never be able to replace the years of investment in that instrument and you’ll probably have to settle for the closest approximation.

[B.Flat]

I am in agreement with all your viewpoints, and thank you for all advice and experiences.

I think it will always be a little black stone in the pit of my stomach but I do feel a bit pathetic at my age, after all it is the notes that matter at the end of the day, not equipment !!

 

[Burns-bass]

14 minutes ago, B.Flat said:

I am in agreement with all your viewpoints, and thank you for all advice and experiences.

I think it will always be a little black stone in the pit of my stomach but I do feel a bit pathetic at my age, after all it is the notes that matter at the end of the day, not equipment !!

 

What you could do is to try and locate the instrument. Do you have the serial number of it and any photos?

It may have gone abroad or be broken up for parts, but who knows. The '6 degrees of separation' thing is likely to be shortened in the small world of bass players. Has to be worth at least a try.

[TheGreek]

I've only owned 3x Rays - a '94, a 2007 and the Japanese EX I sold here recently, The '94 was by far the best of the bunch with a great Bird's Eye maple neck which played like a dream. Sold this, tried to replace it with the 2007 - POC!! The Japanese EX played nice, great balance, nice neck but suffered from the weak G string which the others didn't. 

As somebody said, there are good uns and not so good uns...

[fleabag]

B.Flat - you have a message !

[drTStingray]

Hi, to an extent I understand how you feel as I had a pre EB from new and sold it in the late 80s - would love to have it back.

Ive played various pre EBs since but never bought one - there are indeed variances in sound but that is not surprising when you consider the EQ was updated several times between 76 and 79, the body woods were different on some colours (alder) especially in the early 80s plus they went from strings through to top load and 3 bolt to 4 bolt neck joint around 79/80. All of those points change the sound slightly although not fundamentally.

I have an EBMM Classic and Old Smoothie - these get as close to the pre EB vibe as I think you can - in fact I've compared recordings made with my pre EB and the classic - they are very close - the pre EB had an alder body whereas the Classic has ash and is slightly brighter especially for popping/slapping. The Old Smoothie (which has an alder body and replica 76 EQ - including degraded performance electrical components and an epoxy coating to the pre amp) is as close you'll get to a pre EB in a new package.

A standard 3 band EQ Stingray will get very similar sounds to a 3 band if you boost treble, bass and cut mids (quite a bit).

So you can get the old vibe in a new package (what I've done basically - a matter of opinion but as the largest proportion of my bass playing life has been as a Stingray lover I feel in a good position to say this).

You could go for a pre EB and there are nice ones around - depends whether you feel like paying over £2k and with no guarantee its all original, especially electronically. Andy Baxter has some nice ones but they often don't have their original cases - if that bothers you (I know it does buyers of old Fender basses). 

Anyway I wish you luck in your quest - as a matter of interest what colour was your pre-EB? 

Edited April 16, 2018 by drTStingray

[B.Flat]

Following Burns-Bass' suggestion I have put the details of my bass below. As it was taken 15 years ago I am not holding my breath but a reunion would seem like a miracle.

 

My stolen Stingray is as described below and  any info. as to its whereabouts can be communicated direct to the owner,

on 00 33 297 39 30 66, this is a French No. but if you ring me I will ring you back.

The instrument is Musicman Stingray Bass, pre-Ernie Ball, in natural finish, a pinkish stain on the back, a small chip in the nut between the E & A strings and a serial No. B003229 (I am pretty sure this was the serial N°. but it could have been B003922). The grain on the body was very straight, even and tight. The volume pot had been replaced with a new one but the two tone pots were original. At the time of the theft the volume knob had a chrome plastic push-on larger knob over it. It was in a Fender black oblong case, red plush lining and a rainbow-striped piece of elastic holding down the accessory compartment lid, and an added shaped piece of wood at the bottom to hold the bottom bout, this was covered on a darker red crushed velvet fabric.

The  above is an extract from an ad. I placed in the local paper just after the event, when all my guitars were stolenfrom my car about 30 minutes before I set out for the ferry in Plymouth to start my new life and retirement in Brittany.

[B.Flat]

I have just brought this to the top of the pile in case it might have been missed by someone with info on this instrument

[Paul Stingray]

Hi. I read you got your bass stolen a while ago. Sorry to hear it.

However the number B003229 is my bass (I've had it since '85, '86 or so), so yours must have had the other number you listed. 

Just thought I'd share.

I sincerely hope you'll be reunited with your Stingray.

Best

Paul