Easy 12" cab build

[Chienmortbb]

Just innxase anyone is looking to build this, I have two of the 12CVM2 drivers for sale at £40 they have both had between 50-60 hours use. Reasomfor sale? Downsizing.

[Bassybert]

I’m thinking of building one of these cabs and wondered if it will handle the Motown/Stax sounds I play on my P bass with flats - that flattish eq but with the low mids boosted?

 

Or would the traditional 15” speaker be a better option?
 

I bought a set of Bill Fitzmaurice’s simplexx 15 plans a while back which look great and was thinking about building that, but the simple 12 would be a much more straightforward and cheaper build. 

[Phil Starr]

Hi Bert, I would have thought it would be great for what you need. I designed it to cut the low bass and emphasize the upper bass/low mids. I think it would certainly do the Motown sounds quite well. However I'm not the words greatest tone freak or the best musician in the world (by quite a distance). I notice you are in Somerset so maybe you should come over and have a try sometime. I live just the other side of Chard

[Bassybert]

Thanks a lot Phil, much appreciated.

 

I'm not obsessed about tone either, I love getting a good sound and feeling the trousers flap but I'm not good enough to be that fussy. I'm just looking for something that's portable, sounds good with a nice rounded low mid sound and has enough power to handle some gigs with a modest drummer.

 

I love a bit of DIY so this sounds right up my street!

[Phil Starr]

Brilliant, I think this will be ideal for you.

[Stub Mandrel]

10 hours ago, Bassybert said:

a modest drummer

 

Easier to find than a modest guitarist 😈

[fleabag]

Scuse me chaps, but i thought there was an EASY 10" CAB BUILD thread, but i cant find it.

 

I'm thinking of  stuffing my two  Beyma CMV2 10" drivers  into 2 lightweight cabs.  Since i havent sold the 2 drivers i thought better to do something with them.

The drivers only weigh 3.1 kg each so depending on the weight of the cab, these could pretty good weight wise.

 

I was possibly looking at 2 TE Elf 1x10 cabs, which are an ideal weight of about 16lbs each.  Trouble is, those 2 cabs would be a £550 purchase

 

 

https://www.beyma.com/speakers/Fichas_Tecnicas/beyma-speakers-data-sheet-low-mid-frequency-10CMV2.pdf

 

[Stub Mandrel]

4 minutes ago, fleabag said:

Scuse me chaps, but i thought there was an EASY 10" CAB BUILD thread, but i cant find it.

 

I'm thinking of  stuffing my two  Beyma CMV2 10" drivers  into 2 lightweight cabs.  Since i havent sold the 2 drivers i thought better to do something with them.

The drivers only weigh 3.1 kg each so depending on the weight of the cab, these could pretty good weight wise.

 

I was possibly looking at 2 TE Elf 1x10 cabs, which are an ideal weight of about 16lbs each.  Trouble is, those 2 cabs would be a £550 purchase

 

 

https://www.beyma.com/speakers/Fichas_Tecnicas/beyma-speakers-data-sheet-low-mid-frequency-10CMV2.pdf

 

 

Funnily enough, I'm considering a TE Elf as a backup amp.

 

The logical next step is a decent, compact 10" cab or a 2x8" or even 1x8" for practice and maybe things like backing acoustic folk, but capable of coping with the 120W of the Elf (into 8 ohms).

 

The TE 2x8 is pointless - it weighs as much as my 2x12. And teh 1x10 is expensive enough to make a home build appealing - I like making such things.

 

So I, too, tried finding an EASY 10" CAB BUILD thread this morning.

 

Haven't got further than browsing Eminence and Beyma drivers.

[fleabag]

Yeah, i love the look of the TE 1x10 Elf cabs, but hell, 550 squid for a pair ?   I looked at the Elf 2x8  TE and said ' no'      The weight put me off.  Also i want the choice of one cab or two. 

 

The Beymas seem to be pretty good drivers with good specs.  I've already owned 2 cabs , years ago, with the SM110 drivers inside and they were awesome.  Hoping the CMV2 drivers are equally as good.

 

Where's that 10" cab build when you need it ??   😎

Edited August 8, 2021 by fleabag

[Stub Mandrel]

1 hour ago, fleabag said:

Where's that 10" cab build when you need it ??

 

 

I'd have ago at a design but WinISD keeps coming up with strange results, like a cabinet of over  a million litres!

 

That's what it suggests for an Eminenece 102 for a vented enclosure and default chebeshev design.

 

... ah just tried again and It's come up with a 16.5 litre box, but the curve -3dB point is about 110Hz - this is a speaker with a resonance of 35Hz claimed to work down to 40Hz.

 

What is going on?

 

Edit - I was choosing B102 instead of Legend BP102. Now the -3dB point is at 42Hz and the volume is 106 litres which looks a little big but potentially doable.

 

10cm x 10cm x10cm is a litre =  1 cubic decimetre. 5^3 is 125. so a 50cm cube would be 125litres, so if using thos external dimensions and 13mm ply...

 

Internal volume would be 4.74^3 =  106.4 litres A 50cm cube with the front inset 1cm would be about 105 litres. WinISD suggests a vent 10cm x 9.03cm long.

 

Any skilled WinISD joockeys want to check these figures or suggest a better driver*?

 

*Particularly one happy in a smaller box.

 

Edited August 8, 2021 by Stub Mandrel

[Stub Mandrel]

1 hour ago, fleabag said:

Yeah, i love the look of the TE 1x10 Elf cabs, but hell, 550 squid for a pair ?   I looked at the Elf 2x8  TE and said ' no'      The weight put me off.  Also i want the choice of one cab or two. 

 

The Beymas seem to be pretty good drivers with good specs.  I've already owned 2 cabs , years ago, with the SM110 drivers inside and they were awesome.  Hoping the CMV2 drivers are equally as good.

 

Where's that 10" cab build when you need it ??   😎

 

Ahh.... it's reappeared:

 

 

[fleabag]

That build is bigger than i wanted, probably because it features a tweeter and crossover.  I thought i'd seen  a plain 10"  build without tweeter on the forums, but i could  be imagining this

[Mottlefeeder]

1 hour ago, Stub Mandrel said:

 

 

I'd have ago at a design but WinISD keeps coming up with strange results, like a cabinet of over  a million litres!

 

That's what it suggests for an Eminenece 102 for a vented enclosure and default chebeshev design.

 

... ah just tried again and It's come up with a 16.5 litre box, but the curve -3dB point is about 110Hz - this is a speaker with a resonance of 35Hz claimed to work down to 40Hz.

 

What is going on?

 

Edit - I was choosing B102 instead of Legend BP102. Now the -3dB point is at 42Hz and the volume is 106 litres which looks a little big but potentially doable.

 

10cm x 10cm x10cm is a litre =  1 cubic decimetre. 5^3 is 125. so a 50cm cube would be 125litres, so if using thos external dimensions and 13mm ply...

 

Internal volume would be 4.74^3 =  106.4 litres A 50cm cube with the front inset 1cm would be about 105 litres. WinISD suggests a vent 10cm x 9.03cm long.

 

Any skilled WinISD joockeys want to check these figures or suggest a better driver*?

 

*Particularly one happy in a smaller box.

 

I've just looked on the Eminence site for their recommended enclosure designs, and the links don't work. Searching by product type does not bring up B102, and a search for B102 finds it, but when you click on that product, the link takes you elsewhere. I'm not sure if that is a fault on the website, or an indication that the product in no longer available, but either way it doesn't move us forward.

 

David

[Mottlefeeder]

3 minutes ago, fleabag said:

That build is bigger than i wanted, probably because it features a tweeter and crossover.  I thought i'd seen  a plain 10"  build without tweeter on the forums, but i could  be imagining this

Might have been this one?

 

https://www.basschat.co.uk/topic/322103-battery-powered-rig/?tab=comments#comment-3959658

 

David

 

[fleabag]

That might be it

What did that extension cab weigh in the end ?  The Beymas i have are only 3.1 kg each

 

I dont do WinISD, too  thick, so do you think a cab for the Beyma would be equally small as your little cab ?

[Phil Starr]

Since it is you

 

I'll have a look at the Beyma 10CMV. I was toying with the idea of designing a 2x10 as a next project and if it needs to be low cost then those Beymas look to fit the bill. It's little extra effort for me to give you a set of designs for a 1x10  and a 2x10 so you can then make your own choice as to what you want to build.

 

The only thing you need to do is to put up plenty of pictures of the build and then to tell us what you think of the sound at the end. I know you'd do that anyway and it will be good to share another design without having to fill my house with yet more speakers and sawdust.

 

I'll get back to you tomorrow hopefully.

 

[Mottlefeeder]

47 minutes ago, fleabag said:

That might be it

What did that extension cab weigh in the end ?  The Beymas i have are only 3.1 kg each

 

I dont do WinISD, too  thick, so do you think a cab for the Beyma would be equally small as your little cab ?

My cab came in at 7kg I think - I'm away for a couple of days, so I can't weigh it.

 

I'll let others comment on whether you can swap speakers. 

[fleabag]

21 minutes ago, Phil Starr said:

Since it is you

 

I'll have a look at the Beyma 10CMV. I was toying with the idea of designing a 2x10 as a next project and if it needs to be low cost then those Beymas look to fit the bill. It's little extra effort for me to give you a set of designs for a 1x10  and a 2x10 so you can then make your own choice as to what you want to build.

 

The only thing you need to do is to put up plenty of pictures of the build and then to tell us what you think of the sound at the end. I know you'd do that anyway and it will be good to share another design without having to fill my house with yet more speakers and sawdust.

 

I'll get back to you tomorrow hopefully.

 

 

Ta      I think it was you or Stevie ( or both ) who gave me  advice  a couple of times now on builds.  A 1x15 and 2 adapted Peavey 210 TX 's

 

What i'm hoping for is that the  Beyma specs will allow a small box , to a similar size of the TE Elf 1x10   which is  quite small.   I guess the slotted port helps

Getting close would be good enough.  Elf cab size is   Width: 12''   Depth: 14''     Height: 12.5''

[fleabag]

20 minutes ago, Mottlefeeder said:

My cab came in at 7kg I think - I'm away for a couple of days, so I can't weigh it.

 

I'll let others comment on whether you can swap speakers. 

 

That's a weight that i would like to achieve, though if  guru  Phil Starr says there's too much compromise to build a cab so small using the Beymas, then we'll see how close we can get.

It will all depend on the TSP of the CMV2  10"

[Stub Mandrel]

1 hour ago, Mottlefeeder said:

I've just looked on the Eminence site for their recommended enclosure designs, and the links don't work. Searching by product type does not bring up B102, and a search for B102 finds it, but when you click on that product, the link takes you elsewhere. I'm not sure if that is a fault on the website, or an indication that the product in no longer available, but either way it doesn't move us forward.

 

David

 

This is the beast:

 

http://www.bluearan.co.uk/index.php?id=EMILEGBP102&browsemode=category

 

I didn't think of going to Eminence, using the proper name:

 

https://www.eminence.com/pdf/Legend_BP102.pdf

 

Edited August 8, 2021 by Stub Mandrel

[JohnDaBass]

11 hours ago, fleabag said:

 

Ta      I think it was you or Stevie ( or both ) who gave me  advice  a couple of times now on builds.  A 1x15 and 2 adapted Peavey 210 TX 's

 

What i'm hoping for is that the  Beyma specs will allow a small box , to a similar size of the TE Elf 1x10   which is  quite small.   I guess the slotted port helps

Getting close would be good enough.  Elf cab size is   Width: 12''   Depth: 14''     Height: 12.5''

I built a 10ins combo cab with the speaker cab dimensions were similar to your target sizes. I used a Celestion neo 10" 300w 8ohm driver with no tweeter and tuned the cab to 50Hz. It sounds really good and compares quite favourably to my BF One10 which I subsequently sold. The combo cab had less coloration than the BF One10 but could match that Old School tone with some amp EQ settings. I think my contribution is around page 6 or 7 of the thread. I have previously used Beyma 12s in two Basschat builds I am sure those 10s you  have will turn out fine. Good luck with your build. 

Edited August 9, 2021 by JohnDaBass
Correction

[Phil Starr]

OK as a starting point here are the responses of the 10" Beyma CMV in a variety of cabs. 50l which is WinISD's first suggestion (green) the 12" Easybuild/110T cab (red) and the 25l cab you were hoping for (blue).

 

You can see the 50l cab gives you a lot more bass and the flattest response the 35l cab gives -5dB @ 50Hz and the 25l cab significantly less bass and an audible  extra warmth at 100-120Hz.  If you went for this speaker in the smaller cab it is flat down to 80Hz which is important as it is the second harmonic that we mainly hear as bass. It's going to sound like a bass speaker but bass will sound light and fast if that makes sense. The Beyma also has a slight peak in the upper midrange so it should cut through quite nicely with a bit of 'old school' sound about it. The Eminence Legend would show a similar pattern of responses but it has a more significant upper mid boost which would give a genuine old school feel about the response. 

 

Essentially if you want extended bass in a small package you need a more powerful magnet system than these speakers have. hence the iron law about you can have small, cheap and loud but not all at the same time. However if you you don't mind compromising on the deep bass I think any of these cabs would 'work' especially for home practice where deep bass isn't really helpful. The SM110 was a better driver but as they don't make them....

 

 

[Chienmortbb]

38 minutes ago, Phil Starr said:

OK as a starting point here are the responses of the 10" Beyma CMV in a variety of cabs. 50l which is WinISD's first suggestion (green) the 12" Easybuild/110T cab (red) and the 25l cab you were hoping for (blue).

 

You can see the 50l cab gives you a lot more bass and the flattest response the 35l cab gives -5dB @ 50Hz and the 25l cab significantly less bass and an audible  extra warmth at 100-120Hz.  If you went for this speaker in the smaller cab it is flat down to 80Hz which is important as it is the second harmonic that we mainly hear as bass. It's going to sound like a bass speaker but bass will sound light and fast if that makes sense. The Beyma also has a slight peak in the upper midrange so it should cut through quite nicely with a bit of 'old school' sound about it. The Eminence Legend would show a similar pattern of responses but it has a more significant upper mid boost which would give a genuine old school feel about the response. 

 

Essentially if you want extended bass in a small package you need a more powerful magnet system than these speakers have. hence the iron law about you can have small, cheap and loud but not all at the same time. However if you you don't mind compromising on the deep bass I think any of these cabs would 'work' especially for home practice where deep bass isn't really helpful. The SM110 was a better driver but as they don't make them....

 

 

@Phil StarrI have not modelled it in such a small cab, and having a bigger magnet, voice coil it may be too heavy but is that a good project for the Fane 10-300?

[Chienmortbb]

Back on track(ish). I still have one Beyma 12CVM2 12" driver, suitable for this Easy Build 12" Cab.

 

 

[Phil Starr]

Hi John, this is the Fane (purple) in a 25l cab against the Beyma in the same cab tuned slightly differently to get the flattest response. The Fane actually 'needs' a smaller cab to get the flattest response, around 20l. -3dB is 10hz lower and there is an extra 3dB at 50Hz so noticeable extra deep bass. There's a ripple I couldn't design out but no real peak. Which would sound best would be a matter of taste I think.