Easy 12" cab build

[vinceom]

Hi

This is the cab with ports (flared diy !). The cab itself passed the "knuckle" test, very very little vibration of cab panels. Tomorrow, i'll  bevel the edges with a 12mm radius router.

Vinceom

 

 

[vinceom]

Hi everyone 

here it is my bass cab . Sound is great. 

Question : does the driver need a break-in period and what is the best way to do it?

thanks!

Vinceom

[Dan Dare]

Looks good. Re break-in, I wouldn't hammer it for the first few hours. You could connect up the iPad or similar and play some stuff through it at moderate volumes for a while to loosen things up. 

[Chienmortbb]

To break mine I need I usually put 20 Hz through them overnight. The advantage of 20Hz is that you cannot hear it but can see the cone moving.

 

[Phil Starr]

It's like looking at an old friend

Well done, it's great to see a successful build. I really hope you get as much fun out of it as I have as soon as the restrictions are lifted and you can get out with your band.

FWIW I never worry about 'breaking in' a cab. The first few hours are best spent playing bass IMO and with a new cab I'm going to spend at least an hour playing bass, trying all my amps and basses in turn and fiddling with eq, but then I need all the practice I can get. The changes in sound from breaking in aren't dramatic and a few people have questioned whether you can hear them at all. 

[Stub Mandrel]

Here's what Eminence say, my bold:

https://www.eminence.com/speaker-break-in/

Quote

Speaker break-in is no myth and something significant really does happen. All speakers are built to meet certain specifications, and we work diligently through QC efforts during and after production to ensure that happens. Every component used in a speaker has tolerances, which can relate to small variances in initial performance. The mechanical properties of a speaker are slightly modified once a speaker is put into service, and the tone is affected by these changes. Speaker break-in is a natural process that is influenced by how much you use the speaker and how loud you play it. Think of a new pair of shoes. They are not most comfortable right out of the box. They feel best after you have worn them for a while, softened up, and formed to your feet. Much like your new pair of shoes, new speakers need time to “break in”, and will not sound best until they do.

The components making up the speaker’s suspension are primarily what changes during break-in. These components are the spider (lower suspension) and the cone surround (upper suspension). As the speaker is used, the spider and cone surround begin losing some of their initial stiffness. The sonic results you will hear are an increase in overall warmth, slightly deeper/fatter lows, and warmer/smoother highs. Subtle changes will continue throughout the life cycle of the speaker, but the most noticeable amount occurs in the early stages of use.

The duration of time required to achieve break-in will vary between speakers. Your environment can affect speaker break-in as well. It may take longer in a cold, dry climate versus a hotter, more humid environment. Again, your usage and volume will also affect break-in time. There are several methods people use to speed up the process, but these methods can be damaging to the speaker and are not recommended. The best method is to simply play your new speaker at normal to high volume as frequently as possible. You may even find it is fun and enlightening to experience the changes in your speaker as it breaks in!

 

[vinceom]

3 hours ago, Phil Starr said:

It's like looking at an old friend

Well done, it's great to see a successful build. I really hope you get as much fun out of it as I have as soon as the restrictions are lifted and you can get out with your band.

FWIW I never worry about 'breaking in' a cab. The first few hours are best spent playing bass IMO and with a new cab I'm going to spend at least an hour playing bass, trying all my amps and basses in turn and fiddling with eq, but then I need all the practice I can get. The changes in sound from breaking in aren't dramatic and a few people have questioned whether you can hear them at all. 

Thank you Phil. I was very lucky to arrive few weeks ago to your messages and on basschat. The result wouldn't be so great. Thanks again for all your advices. And your video on Youtube is very useful !!

 

Vinceom

[Phil Starr]

On 04/05/2020 at 11:14, Stub Mandrel said:

Here's what Eminence say, my bold:

https://www.eminence.com/speaker-break-in/

Speaker break-in is no myth and something significant really does happen. All speakers are built to meet certain specifications, and we work diligently through QC efforts during and after production to ensure that happens. Every component used in a speaker has tolerances, which can relate to small variances in initial performance. The mechanical properties of a speaker are slightly modified once a speaker is put into service, and the tone is affected by these changes. Speaker break-in is a natural process that is influenced by how much you use the speaker and how loud you play it. Think of a new pair of shoes. They are not most comfortable right out of the box. They feel best after you have worn them for a while, softened up, and formed to your feet. Much like your new pair of shoes, new speakers need time to “break in”, and will not sound best until they do.

The components making up the speaker’s suspension are primarily what changes during break-in. These components are the spider (lower suspension) and the cone surround (upper suspension). As the speaker is used, the spider and cone surround begin losing some of their initial stiffness. The sonic results you will hear are an increase in overall warmth, slightly deeper/fatter lows, and warmer/smoother highs. Subtle changes will continue throughout the life cycle of the speaker, but the most noticeable amount occurs in the early stages of use.

The duration of time required to achieve break-in will vary between speakers. Your environment can affect speaker break-in as well. It may take longer in a cold, dry climate versus a hotter, more humid environment. Again, your usage and volume will also affect break-in time. There are several methods people use to speed up the process, but these methods can be damaging to the speaker and are not recommended. The best method is to simply play your new speaker at normal to high volume as frequently as possible. You may even find it is fun and enlightening to experience the changes in your speaker as it breaks in!

 

I pretty much agree with all of that but particularly with the last bit. Changes occur in speakers over time. Paper cones are made from wood fibre (plant fibre strictly, as some fibres from other plants are sometimes mixed in) Paper holds together because of chemical bonds which form mainly in the lignin which forms the bulk of plant fibres, these bonds will increase slowly across time increasing the bonding. The cone will also absorb some moisture from the air and the physical movement and flexing of the cone will break some of the bonds and also over time the fibres themselves. There are loads of other factors too and other materials in the speaker will change over time too. This process doesn't stop either the speaker will go on changing over it's whole lifetime. 

Even so Eminence is just one voice, there is a lot of conflicting evidence in the literature about this and it was a hot topic amongst hi-fi enthusiasts in the 80's, and probably since then too. Some of the changes are self cancelling and listening tests proved inconclusive, even with some pretty expensive hi fi speakers people couldn't reliably hear the difference. You don't need many watts of 20Hz to push these speakers beyond their limits so to leave an inaudible signal running through possibly a 300W bass amp overnight untended fills me with dread. Especially since it is to no long term advantage. For me the fun bit is to play bass through the speaker, particularly one you've just finished building. The changes are going to happen whatever you do and as Eminence themselves imply they are going to happen over time anyway. 

[Beer of the Bass]

I wonder if that Eminence article might be primarily aimed at guitarists, where the speakers have stiffer paper surrounds that might "break in" more noticeably than the coated fabrics used on bass and PA drivers.

[naxos10]

Speaker break in has been carried out by many in the hi-fi fraternity for a long time. As suggested above play some music through it overnight just to free up the cone and suspension mechanism.

Edited May 9, 2020 by naxos10

[stevie]

1 hour ago, naxos10 said:

Speaker break in has been well carried out by many in the hi-fi fraternity for a long time. As suggested above play some music through it overnight just to free up the cone and suspension mechanism.

As has capacitor burn-in and cable burn-in. The hi-fi market is full of marketing myths.

[stevie]

1 hour ago, Beer of the Bass said:

I wonder if that Eminence article might be primarily aimed at guitarists, where the speakers have stiffer paper surrounds that might "break in" more noticeably than the coated fabrics used on bass and PA drivers.

That's the only explanation I can think of, and it might make sense for open-backed cabs.

Edited May 9, 2020 by stevie

[Stub Mandrel]

I think it goes almost without saying that paper cones will get less stiff over time and this will have an effect on sound.

I struggle to think of any practical benefits of 'breaking them in' though, as they are designed and capable of taking full output from the moment they are installed.

[Balcro]

Breaking in loudspeaker drivers probably started with the hi-fi fraternity way back. The purpose being to soften up the suspension parts that Phil Starr has mentioned before. After a little time - not necessarily at full bore - the suspension un-stiffens and the fundamental resonance drops 3 or 4Hz!
Hey! More bass. Not really, it just gets the the driver to it's optimum more quickly. All fs ratings for loudspeakers are + or - something just because of manufacturing tolerances.

My advice is treat a new speaker like a new car - run it in progressively. The same goes for new tyres. The front and rear suspensions on a speaker are analogous to engine bearings & cylinder bores.

[nilebodgers]

On 03/05/2020 at 17:14, vinceom said:

Hi everyone 

here it is my bass cab . Sound is great. 

Question : does the driver need a break-in period and what is the best way to do it?

thanks!

Vinceom

Nice! What does the completed cab weigh?

[sergelebasse75]

Hallo, new to BASSCHAT, I was just thinking of building the 30 lt sm212 versión, i have some PVC with internal diammeter 118, i calculated 173,5mm length as equivalent of 2 x 64mm 160 length. Would It work the same in the rear panel? Thanks Phil ,Steve and the rest of members that contribute 

[stevie]

Rear panel mounting is fine and a single port tube will work better than two (less friction).

[Phil Starr]

19 hours ago, sergelebasse75 said:

Hallo, new to BASSCHAT, I was just thinking of building the 30 lt sm212 versión, i have some PVC with internal diammeter 118, i calculated 173,5mm length as equivalent of 2 x 64mm 160 length. Would It work the same in the rear panel? Thanks Phil ,Steve and the rest of members that contribute 

Hi, that looks great and using a bigger port is great, I only used the smaller diameter pipe because it is easily sourced and you can get cheap hole saw cutters in the right sizes. That ties in with the idea of 'easy build'. The only thing to remember is the obvious point of not blocking the rear port by pushing it hard against a rear wall. I checked your calculations and the sizes look good.

If you do go ahead and build it would be great to see some pictures when it is done and let us know how it sounds when you use it.

Good luck with the build.

[sergelebasse75]

Thanks both of you. Ill be posting pictures as son as I start,  Im curious how does It sound. I already bought the sm212, the PVC size im about to choose, its because little ones i found are like 50mm diammeter, so if i can get an over120mm circular saw, there Will be no problem. By the way, apart from some old school finger style rock jazz soul, has someone tried slapping this one? Does It have enough treble being tweeterless for a vintage slap Larry Graham Hair/Eartquake sound?

[Stub Mandrel]

9 hours ago, sergelebasse75 said:

Thanks both of you. Ill be posting pictures as son as I start,  Im curious how does It sound. I already bought the sm212, the PVC size im about to choose, its because little ones i found are like 50mm diammeter, so if i can get an over120mm circular saw, there Will be no problem. By the way, apart from some old school finger style rock jazz soul, has someone tried slapping this one? Does It have enough treble being tweeterless for a vintage slap Larry Graham Hair/Eartquake sound?

If you make a guide using masking tape or card, it's surprisingly easy to cut neatly with a hand saw.

[Phil Starr]

Hi again, The tube we all use is plastic downpipe used from guttering. If you are based in France or Belgium then it's possible they use a different sized tubing. In any case a single larger pipe would be better. 

I use a router or rarely an electric jigsaw to cut holes or you could use a hole cutter like this Silverline 427644 Adjustable Hole Cutter 40-300 mm: Amazon.co.uk: DIY & Tools. I'm not recommending that particular one as I haven't tried it but you get the idea. I'm making no judgements about how complex you want your woodwork to be either, a lot of it is about confidence and how much of a learning experience you want it to be.

Sorry I don't play slap and nobody has tried the cab for slapping whilst I've been there so no comment.

[sergelebasse75]

Spain located, so local stores had different sizes, but no problem, thanks a lot for the links and i try It myself, and if my 10" tweeterless Fender sideKick sounds good slapped, sure this one Will sound much better.

[Chienmortbb]

On 04/01/2021 at 11:15, Phil Starr said:

Hi again, The tube we all use is plastic downpipe used from guttering. If you are based in France or Belgium then it's possible they use a different sized tubing. In any case a single larger pipe would be better. 

I use a router or rarely an electric jigsaw to cut holes or you could use a hole cutter like this Silverline 427644 Adjustable Hole Cutter 40-300 mm: Amazon.co.uk: DIY & Tools. I'm not recommending that particular one as I haven't tried it but you get the idea. I'm making no judgements about how complex you want your woodwork to be either, a lot of it is about confidence and how much of a learning experience you want it to be.

Sorry I don't play slap and nobody has tried the cab for slapping whilst I've been there so no comment.

Those can be quite hard to use PhilIf you are not at 90^o to the work they can snatch, almost spraining your wrist. In addition you need a heavy duty  drill  and the weight of that, plus the hole cutter, is hard on the wrist.

[Beer of the Bass]

I used a hole cutter similar to that. The blades as supplied are not very sharp at all, so I gave them a quick sharpen much like you would with a chisel. There's a bit of a knack to adjusting them, if the "kerf" between inner and outer edges of the two blades is even slightly too wide, it's much harder work for the drill than if you get it just right. The results were fine once I'd got those two things figured though.

[stevie]

On 01/01/2021 at 13:15, sergelebasse75 said:

Hallo, new to BASSCHAT, I was just thinking of building the 30 lt sm212 versión, i have some PVC with internal diammeter 118, i calculated 173,5mm length as equivalent of 2 x 64mm 160 length. Would It work the same in the rear panel? Thanks Phil ,Steve and the rest of members that contribute 

I reckon there's some confusion here with port sizes here. The 118mm size you've mentioned is correct for the larger 50-litre cab. However, if you want to fit that tube to a 30-litre cab while maintaining the same tuning, it needs to be about 250mm long, which won't fit. I'd suggest you recalculate with a 100mm port, a size that's available everywhere.