Is it me?

[Osiris]

1 minute ago, Frank Blank said:

Obviously this reasoned response is what I meant by fvck em'.

That's my usual response, but I seem to be experiencing a brief moment of diplomacy and tact. Normal service will no doubt resume shortly. 

[chris_b]

If you like the band as a musical unit then stick with it. If you think the band can only gig with one set of musicians then it seems that the rest of the guys have a different opinion.

Bruised ego, dented pride or reality check? Dunno. If you think this is an assault on your ego I'd say get over it. I read it that the band is just trying to do a gig under difficult circumstances, which were beyond everyone's control. This is a reality check. No one in any band is indispensable. Look at Peter Gabriel, Roger Waters and Brian Jones.

IMO the advice you're being given in this thread to throw your toys out of the pram and tell them where to go is bad advice. I've seen guys do this, it never turns out well, and they always look rather silly.

[Al Krow]

4 minutes ago, Osiris said:

That's my usual response, but I seem to be experiencing a brief moment of diplomacy and tact. Normal service will no doubt resume shortly. 

Yes, will someone please return the real Osiris to us asap, I don't recognise this impostor 

[casapete]

Dep bass player and hire the PA to them. 

[Conan]

44 minutes ago, chris_b said:

What's the problem? The band has a gig and you can't do it.  Happens all the time. Get a dep or let them do it as a 3 piece. Why stop them?

Really? If it "happens all the time", how come so many of the responses on here (presumably from people who are band members) seem to indicate the opposite? Usually a "band" is just that - a group of individuals working together towards a common, shared purpose. Most people here seem to agree that getting a dep in would have been an acceptable solution, but not the way that it has been handled.

[Conan]

13 minutes ago, chris_b said:

If you like the band as a musical unit then stick with it. If you think the band can only gig with one set of musicians then it seems that the rest of the guys have a different opinion.

Bruised ego, dented pride or reality check? Dunno. If you think this is an assault on your ego I'd say get over it. I read it that the band is just trying to do a gig under difficult circumstances, which were beyond everyone's control. This is a reality check. No one in any band is indispensable. Look at Peter Gabriel, Roger Waters and Brian Jones.

IMO the advice you're being given in this thread to throw your toys out of the pram and tell them where to go is bad advice. I've seen guys do this, it never turns out well, and they always look rather silly.

On the other hand, I do agree with this 

[Conan]

1 hour ago, pbasspecial said:

  I wasn't keen on them doing it as I felt it would cheapen the brand we are slowly building.  What would you guys suggest?

In hindsight, and having re-read the OP, I'm not so sure. Maybe I'm starting to see it a bit from their side. And surely cancelling the gig would also "cheapen the brand". Do you really have a "brand" at this stage? 

[Guest MoJo]

I think the writing's on the wall. Expect your P45 when you get back off your holiday (only kidding)

[stingrayPete1977]

24 minutes ago, Conan said:

In hindsight, and having re-read the OP, I'm not so sure. Maybe I'm starting to see it a bit from their side. And surely cancelling the gig would also "cheapen the brand". Do you really have a "brand" at this stage? 

They didn't cancel the gig the venue did. 

[Monkey Steve]

Sounds to me like there's a bigger issue behind all of this, certainly from the OP's side, than whether or not the band play the gig.  Personally I'd also be a bit miffed if a band i was in suggested doing a gig without me, but if it was clearly a situation where everybody else wanted to play it and I couldn't make it (rather than them, say, telling me that they've got a dep in for the next gig so I don't need to show up) then I'd let them get on with things with my blessing.  And if it's a rearranged gig that I couldn't make (rather than a gig that they had booked knowing that I wouldn't be available), I'd expect the band to see if they could do it without me.   I certainly wouldn't be expecting any share of the money, even if I'd loaned them a load of my gear.  As others have said, this sort of thing does happen from time to time.   So it's all about how you deal with it.

Playing Devil's advocate, from their point of view, you expecting them to cancel the gig if you can't make it means that none of them are getting paid because you have booked a holiday - you've gone from a bad outcome for just you to a bad outcome for the three of them instead.

I've been on the other side of this a few times - one band did a gig when one of the guitarists was playing on a different continent with his other band and he was fine about it (in fact it was always understood that if a gig came up that he couldn't make then we'd do it without him),; and an old covers band was asked to do a Christmas gig at one of our favourite venues when the singer was away with his family so the rest of us filled in for him (and went down so well that it became a regular Christmas thing and we'd always check to make sure that he was going to be away before booking our Christmas gig).  We never fell out with the missing band members, and it was never put across as any sort of threat to their membership of the band.  The missing singer left his PA with us so that we could do the gig and it was all very grown up (although unusually among singers he is a genuinely lovely bloke who wants to see his mates doing well on stage even if he is watching from the side - we once did as gig supporting Edward Tudor Pole doing an acoustic set who asked us to learn Swords Of A Thousand Men so that we could be his backing band for his encore, and our singer retreated to the audience and later told us that it was his proudest moment as a band member).  If anything, it reinforced his position in the band that he was such a good mate about it all.

Ego aside, doesn't seem like there's much to gain by spitting your dummy out other than a big row and an ongoing feeling of resentment from the rest of the band that you're not a very good mate.  It's not like you're using the PA for something else that week so not letting the band borrow it isn't going to make them like you very much and lending it to them doesn't put you in a worse position.

I'm not sure if you're fed up with them and about to quit anyway, in which case telling them to F off is likely to bring things to a head, or if you're just feeling a bit taken for granted and under appreciated, maybe a bit insecure, in which case telling them to F off isn't likely to improve things.  I suggest an adult chat about how they see your role in the band, whether this is a deliberate sleight and they think you are dispensable, or if they think it's just a practical solution to honouring a rearranged booking that you now can't make.

Edited May 24, 2018 by Monkey Steve

[Conan]

55 minutes ago, stingrayPete1977 said:

They didn't cancel the gig the venue did. 

I know. What I meant was, if the band cancelled the rescheduled gig because the OP couldn't do it...

[Conan]

52 minutes ago, Monkey Steve said:

Sounds to me like there's a bigger issue behind all of this.....

No need to get all sensible on us!!  Only kidding. If you ever tire of your band, could you put in a good word for me please? It sounds like heaven...

[JellyKnees]

Personally, I think it depends on what type of band it is. If it's covers band whose main raison d'être is making money, then I wouldn't worry about it. If it's originals where your particular style and sound is key to the overall sound of the band, then I would argue it's an entirely different matter...

[josie]

We agreed from the start that we're more of a collective than a band. (Six core members and occasional guests.) We all have other commitments, and if we could only gig (or practice) when we can all be there, we wouldn't play many gigs. Some songs we won't do if a key member for that song isn't there, others we adapt. Nobody ever feels offended if a gig goes ahead without them.

We enjoy playing a fairly relaxed improv style. Blues classics which we do try hard to make interesting and "ours" in some way, but flexible. As said above, if we were playing tightly arranged originals, that wouldn't work.

[mcnach]

3 hours ago, pbasspecial said:

So here's the deal.  The band that I am in (co-founded but since changed to singer/guitarists name!) have a gig next week. Unfortunately it was moved by the pub from last week when I could do it to next week when I am away on holiday (which they have known about for 6 months).  The guitarist has decided to do it now as a 3 piece (drums, guitar and keys).  I wasn't keen on them doing it as I felt it would cheapen the brand we are slowly building.  

I wasn't happy about them doing the gig without me for several reasons, namely, it would make the band sound not as good, weaken our reputation and I thought I was a key member of the group, not a session player.  Ego slightly bruised and nose dislocated, etc

They also want to use my PA system, and the singer/guitarist said my share could go in the band kitty.  I was ok (ish) with this.

Now things have changed, without speaking with me, the keys player is now going to play bass and 'my' share of the gig money will now go to pay towards a rehearsal for the keys player to learn the bass parts, etc

I told him that I was not happy about this and would get back to him today.

What would you guys suggest?

 

I would not love it but... if you give it a few days you'll probably also feel that it's not a big deal. 

My main band booked a gig one NYE when I was away. A friend of the band was recruited to play bass. I felt the same as you... but in the end, it was fun for them, no kittens died, and I ended up having someone I could call if I really MUST back down a gig (which happened once). 

As an originals band, I don't want to use subs, but from time to time it can be useful and if it's a situation like this where it's either cancel or play the gig with rearranged personnel, why not?

[ricksterphil]

1 hour ago, mcnach said:

 

I would not love it but... if you give it a few days you'll probably also feel that it's not a big deal. 

My main band booked a gig one NYE when I was away. A friend of the band was recruited to play bass. I felt the same as you... but in the end, it was fun for them, no kittens died, and I ended up having someone I could call if I really MUST back down a gig (which happened once). 

As an originals band, I don't want to use subs, but from time to time it can be useful and if it's a situation like this where it's either cancel or play the gig with rearranged personnel, why not?

Yeah...if they start killing kittens, then defo tell 'em to do one!

[Thunderbird]

Tell them they are taking the P155 and dont lend them the PA I know this sounds childish but might make the guys realise they are taking the P155 out of you

[bassjim]

So a few years ago we had a gig our keyboard player couldn't do. The guitarist insists it can be done without him and he can use his synth thingy. I am dubious. I wanted to not do the gig but rather than the debating and agro , went along with it. It sucked actually. It was embarrassing too. All over the place. Thankfully it was in a shitty pub with no punters and the only real goal was get the money.

Good things that came out of it : Guitarist doesn't need telling he aint' all that cause he  just suffered a gigs worth proving the point to himself. Keys player is  held in higher esteem now plus valued a whole lot more by whole band. It put an end to the idea of we can just turn up and do it without a decent dep. 

For your band I'd let em get on with it without any objection. Place all emotional feelings to one side. The day will come and go and life will continue. Keep it all smiles and be that guy thats cool with things. If it goes well its something for the band to build on and will sound better with you next time around= win win. If it goes badly, its the last time they think this is a great idea.

 

[lemmywinks]

Wouldn't really bother me tbh, let them do the gig as they see fit and don't take it personally. As for the catty comments regarding sabotaging/renting/withholding the PA - I wouldn't expect to stay in bands very long following that advice.

Wish them well and enjoy your holiday, I'm pretty sure everything will be fine when you get back.

[stingrayPete1977]

4 hours ago, Conan said:

I know. What I meant was, if the band cancelled the rescheduled gig because the OP couldn't do it...

The gig shouldn't have been rescheduled without talking to the bass player first, even with a dep. 

[lojo]

Sounds to much hassle to be involved with 

[Wolverinebass]

In years gone by, people might have seen their own blood for stuff like this. However, as I've mellowed with age, I realise that some things aren't worth the hassle. 

If this is an originals band, I'd have left well before this stage occurred. However, my response to this conundrum is still the same "Go f@?k yourself" now as it would have been then. There just wouldn't be anyone getting chinned for it nowadays so I guess that's progress.

[Elfrasho]

Let them do it, enjoy your holiday. I bet you're not as key to the sound as you think you are.. No offence! 

If you're pals with them, let them use your stuff.. That's what pals do! 

[pbasspecial]

2 hours ago, Elfrasho said:

I bet you're not as key to the sound as you think you are.. No offence! 

If someone said to you "I bet you're a bit of a c*nt.. No offence" you'd probably be offended

[peteb]

I think that the clue was when the name of the band was changed to that of the guitarist. He is now the only key member of the band, that's just the way it works - not necessarily a bad thing but you have to recognise the reality of the situation. 

I would make a point of saying you think that they should get a dep bass player for the gig and that you expect a share of the gig money if they are going to use your PA. 

Edited May 24, 2018 by peteb