Paid to play

[ARGH]

[quote name='OutToPlayJazz' post='337777' date='Nov 26 2008, 10:11 PM']LOL! I usually have one week of serious flu & chest infection a year. That's this week, actually! I've been off work since Monday, but really need to be at school tomorrow & have a rehearsal tomorrow evening.

There's no pension, nope. But then again pensions are worthless these days. I opted out of the local council one as it would've been worth less than I paid in by the time I got to it, LOL!

Rich.[/quote]
God you have got Balls......Lemsip Max and a chuck bucket. I hope you never stop playing.

[Guest]

I think ARGH's point was very valid, how many people in the UK are really in the position of earning a decent living from playing full time? What other profession could you choose where you have to spend so long learning the trade and yet still have the potential to earn so little.

[Prosebass]

[quote name='OldGit' post='337817' date='Nov 26 2008, 10:33 PM']So true (oh and she thinks [i]you[/i] do live in the shed )

Q: How do you make sure a luthier has £1 million by the time he is 30?
A: Give him £2 million when he's 29[/quote]

I do live in the shed.....and it is a shed......although business is so good I am building a 6 x 4 extension on it at the weekend
My last business had 2 retail showrooms and a 4000sq ft warehouse and I sold close on £1 million in 3 years and hardly made a living from it .....making basses is way better.

Somebody has to buck the trend of this "starving artisan" business....

[jakenewmanbass]

[quote name='ARGH' post='337834' date='Nov 26 2008, 10:49 PM']But thats 2 people working at it,support,and love,and I dont totally believe you both have not had to at least at some point do a little extra summat on the side to make ends meet..a shift of something,temp work,had sacrifice's..all that romantic sh*t that at the time utterly stink,but draw you together....

House prices,depends on where you are,but I bet you had to drop a massive deposit,being self employed.
If you can do it..Then I applaud you,and you can borrow my gear anytime.[/quote]

What I find interesting in your "honesty" is that you are not open minded to anothers experience. You are telling me how it has been for me and ignoring what I say to suit your argument. I have to say I don't appreciate that as I have a much better idea of my own existence than you do by dint of having lived it.
I was sole bread winner for 10 years while my wife looked after the kids.
I have never as you put it "done summat on the side" I had 2 years in an alternative career (and was other things before music. Cook, nightclubs, barman etc) The 'alternative career' was while I established new contacts after relocation. But I soon realised that regular income from a mindless activity was utterly without joy.
I have a large equity in my property yes, I earned it playing bass as well as a help from price rises I have made over payments in my mortgage for my entire life so far, and I have had no inheritance.

The 2 people working at it you refer to is only for the last 12 months and all it means is that I take less of the gigs that don't pay the money. Although there are plenty of gigs I do that don't pay well cos I love to play, and I love meeting new musicians... all of which has meant that for my whole gigging life the phone has rung.
There is less work for musicians than say in the fifties but that is true of all sectors of our employment base.

I think the most important thing that you miss is that I am a very happy musician. If I wasn't I would do something else.


I will also reiterate that I know literally hundreds of musicians who survive and are happy some of them having earned more from one job than many would in a years work.

Edited November 26, 2008 by jakesbass

[steve-soar]

Argh, have you considered councilling, it worked a treat for me, seriously.

[ARGH]

[quote name='jakesbass' post='337863' date='Nov 26 2008, 11:12 PM']What I find interesting in your "honesty" is that you are not open minded to anothers experience. You are telling me how it has been for me and ignoring what I say to suit your argument. I have to say I don't appreciate that as I have a much better idea of my own existence than you do by dint of having lived it.
I was sole bread winner for 10 years while my wife looked after the kids.
I have never as you put it "done summat on the side" I had 2 years in an alternative career (and was other things before music. Cook, nightclubs, barman etc) The 'alternative career' was while I established new contacts after relocation. But I soon realised that regular income from a mindless activity was utterly without joy.
I have a large equity in my property yes, I earned it playing bass as well as a help from price rises I have made over payments in my mortgage for my entire life so far, and I have had no inheritance.

The 2 people working at it you refer to is only for the last 12 months and all it means is that I take less of the gigs that don't pay the money. Although there are plenty of gigs I do that don't pay well cos I love to play, and I love meeting new musicians... all of which has meant that for my whole gigging life the phone has rung.
There is less work for musicians than say in the fifties but that is true of all sectors of our employment base.

I think the most important thing that you miss is that I am a very happy musician. If I wasn't I would do something else.


I will also reiterate that I know literally hundreds of musicians who survive and are happy some of them having earned more from one job than many would in a years work.[/quote]
Point taken....
But we all know the opposite,good musicians that have not made it,WAYYY more than 100s,that really deserved too,or been crushed.....Playing paid for my downpayment on the house a couple of years back,it paid a fair wedge of my bills too.If you are totally happy,and satisfied....then brilliant. And you have got to the point of picking the best ones...a prized position. Is it all Bass playing? No teaching? Just Bass?

Have you never had to struggle? Was it that easy? All the time? You admit you have had to do 'Summat else'...for at least a while.
Ive not had the luck to be in a financial situ where I couldnt say no,its been hard sometimes,this weekends the 1st originals gig Ive played in aeons..Ive ditched the moneyspinners to have one more shot at the mad dream.....If it dont work,Guess the Rat & Parrot and golf gigs will come a'calling.

We are very different people,in different places,from different times.

Guess Im crazy

Edited November 26, 2008 by ARGH

[steve-soar]

Life is a journey, and the walls are not lined with steel clad guarantees, your average adult has to make decisions that will have to provide the best solutions to their dilemas, it's called being savvy.
You seem to think that there is some shame in deviating from being a total, pure musician and not making 100% of your living from it.
I have had many jobs and have had some rough times but the one thing that keeps me golden is music.
Life is great and we are only here for a very short time, we need to leave a lasting impression of art, love and togetherness, constant negitivity can only slow this down.

Edited November 26, 2008 by steve-soar

[jakenewmanbass]

[quote name='ARGH' post='337881' date='Nov 26 2008, 11:40 PM']Point taken....[/quote]
thank f*** for that
[quote name='ARGH' post='337881' date='Nov 26 2008, 11:40 PM']Have you never had to struggle? Was it that easy? All the time?[/quote]
Never struggled, never missed a bill, never missed a mortgage payment, never felt skint. All the time. Yes
[quote name='ARGH' post='337881' date='Nov 26 2008, 11:40 PM']You admit you have had to do 'Summat else'...for at least a while.[/quote]
Like I said you use my words to suit yourself.
That is not an admission it's a choice, When a musician relocates he or she has to re-establish just like in any self employment.
[quote name='ARGH' post='337881' date='Nov 26 2008, 11:40 PM']We are very different people,in different places,from different times.[/quote]
accuracy at last.... :-P
[quote name='ARGH' post='337881' date='Nov 26 2008, 11:40 PM']Guess Im crazy[/quote]
Aren't we all to an extent?

Edited November 27, 2008 by jakesbass

[ARGH]

[quote name='steve-soar' post='337903' date='Nov 26 2008, 11:54 PM']Life is a journey, and the walls are not lined with steel clad guarantees, your average adult has to make decisions that will have to provide the best solutions to their dilemas, it's called being savvy.
You seem to think that there is some shame in deviating from being a total, pure musician and not making 100% of your living from it.
I have had many jobs and have had some rough times but the one thing that keeps me golden is music.
Life is great and we are only here for a very short time, we need to leave a lasting impression of art, love and togetherness, constant negitivity can only slow this down.[/quote]
Refer to the OP. The Guy was talking about earning a crust 'Playing'..pure PLAYING!

Theres no shame,and I never say that there was..thats you reading something that isnt there,nor do I say that ,I just dont think that '100% Pure player exists' anymore,at least in/where I am living right now......as Ive posted before,Noo Yawk,LA,London or cruiseship,maybe..but not in Bradford,Wrexham,Aberdeen,Swansea etc etc.

But Ive expanded that now to encompass the M25...(London)

There isnt anything negative about what Ive posted,its just a little raw for people to agree with.

[ARGH]

[quote name='jakesbass' post='337913' date='Nov 27 2008, 12:05 AM']Never struggled, never missed a bill, never missed a mortgage payment, never felt skint. All the time. Yes[/quote]
You are one lucky f***er..Im going to remember you,if we ever pass by,You get a pint,no questions.

But you never answered my question,....Have you always just played Bass?,ever taught?

EDIT-Just read,that you have done and do.

Edited November 27, 2008 by ARGH

[noelk27]

[quote name='ARGH' post='337881' date='Nov 26 2008, 11:40 PM']Guess Im crazy[/quote]

It's anyone who claims to be totally sane that I worry about.

"It's a madhouse!"

[ARGH]

[quote name='noelk27' post='337920' date='Nov 27 2008, 12:14 AM']It's anyone who claims to be totally sane that I worry about.

"It's a madhouse!"[/quote]
It depends on what your GP writes down......

[steve-soar]

Refer to the OP. The Guy was talking about earning a crust 'Playing'..pure PLAYING!


Why do you shout so much?
The world makes me feel ARGH! nearly every day, so try a little tenderness.

[Jase]

I earn some of my crust from playing, I earn some more crust from a part time brainless job, I would love to play 7 nights a week and earn all my crustiness. I make bugger all from original projects nor do I expect to, I can't teach, if there is such a thing as a session "scene" or "circle" I've no idea where it is...... I have considerable debt due to original projects. This has been my situation for many, many years. This isn't a "woe is me" or bitter post, just thought I'd post a bit about my situation.

[ARGH]

read my sig....

[ped]

[quote name='ARGH' post='337827' date='Nov 26 2008, 10:42 PM'][url="http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=V1tXhJniSEc"]http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=V1tXhJniSEc[/url]
You make a Judgement about me,without,meeting me,talking to me,or seeing how I play......Thanks.[/quote]

Careful ARGH - you did the same to me a few posts ago!!

To address a couple of points:

- No idea why you are dragging the prices of basses into this, and my bass was £500, if that matters?
- I wasn't name dropping, quite the opposite. I simply said I knew some people who are pro who love it, to counter your rather one sided opinion.
- How can you say I know 'sh*t all' about this subject when we have never met or spoken to each other?

Otherwise, you make one or two good points.

ped

[ped]

[quote name='OutToPlayJazz' post='337805' date='Nov 26 2008, 10:27 PM']Ped, I was getting the impression you're writing "library" music for radio/tv, etc. Is this correct? If so, keep at it. A friend of mine has been writing it for some years now & has a contract with Chappel music & Sony BMG. He's getting about £20k every quarter in royalties now!

Rich.[/quote]

Yo Rich,

Sort of - my staple band is a studio group and we record music for fun, we all prefer it to gigging actually. It is normally instrumental fusion groove stuff. With my dad being a cameraman for various production companies and now I work with the BBC myself, our music has been requested from a few places such as Sky Sports, just out of the blue. It's great because they like what we do and we don't have to take any orders. As I said we do it for fun so any financial gain is a bonus really.

Hook me up with your friend please!!!

Cheers
ped

[Jase]

[quote name='ARGH' post='337949' date='Nov 27 2008, 01:07 AM']read my sig....[/quote]

Gives me wood, does that.

[ARGH]

[quote name='ped' post='337950' date='Nov 27 2008, 01:08 AM']Careful ARGH - you did the same to me a few posts ago!!

To address a couple of points:

- No idea why you are dragging the prices of basses into this, and my bass was £500, if that matters?
- I wasn't name dropping, quite the opposite. I simply said I knew some people who are pro who love it, to counter your rather one sided opinion.
- How can you say I know 'sh*t all' about this subject when we have never met or spoken to each other?

Otherwise, you make one or two good points.

ped[/quote]
We have,via msn..you were rude,ignorant,and creepy....and after reading what you have,and others have said about 'us' the greater mass,on Basschat, said in 'other' places,I dont care.

You basically called me a liar,your opinon is as valid as mine....except my point is Ive never met a Pure player..at the very least not a happy one,seeing as theres a few teacher/players on here,I can keep to that side.....Jake is incredibly lucky,I couldnt make enough cash to live in Surrey,I can or rather could in Yorkshire..and have done..Im now playing originals because I need to blow out the stress of my life,see if I can have one last shot at the title (ARGHspeak for record deal) if it dont work,Back to the covers/functions.

I dont think a kid at 21, fresh out of Uni can leave and be a pure player,unless they either cruiseship it,do the corporate when/wherever,and do it purely by playing alone...except in a hit band or in the Cities Ive cited (inc M25)....there are exceptions,there always are...but Ive not met one,nor met anyone that would take them on,a few kids I know are suffering coz of that,theres less and less to go round here,pubs venues etc,and everyones holding on tight,at least round here....ask Adreno. I dont know anyone that is rich from it,and I compound that with the fact that one lecturer from Brighton,(Damien) stated that there was not enough work available and its getting smaller,and another from Bradford said the same with extra.

Now I have to sleep.....

Edited November 27, 2008 by ARGH

[slaphappygarry]

I play and teach for a living. Do other things on the side (recording being the main one which I love) but on the whole its sh*t wedding gigs etc... that bring in the bread.

I f***ing hate it but put all effort into doing a good job. I work long, anti-social hours and make about 10k a year tops. I know several top players doing more or less the same as me but feel blessed that they do it.

G

[thisnameistaken]

[quote name='ARGH' post='337965' date='Nov 27 2008, 01:30 AM']I dont think a kid at 21, fresh out of Uni can leave and be a pure player,unless they either cruiseship it,do the corporate when/wherever,and do it purely by playing alone...except in a hit band or in the Cities Ive cited (inc M25)[/quote]

It's difficult to make a living playing original music over here, but honestly if your band is any good it's a doddle in the states. That's what I did when I was 20 - jumped on a plane, went to gig 5 nights a week with a band out there, did it for three years until I got homesick. I was living very comfortably too.

Music was never about making money for me particularly, I just wanted to play what I wanted to play, and I turned down a couple of offers from major labels when I was younger just because they seemed like unpleasant people to have to work with.

[ped]

[quote name='ARGH' post='337965' date='Nov 27 2008, 01:30 AM']We have,via msn..you were rude,ignorant,and creepy....and after reading what you have,and others have said about 'us' the greater mass,on Basschat, said in 'other' places,I dont care.

You basically called me a liar,your opinon is as valid as mine....except my point is Ive never met a Pure player..at the very least not a happy one,seeing as theres a few teacher/players on here,I can keep to that side.....Jake is incredibly lucky,I couldnt make enough cash to live in Surrey,I can or rather could in Yorkshire..and have done..Im now playing originals because I need to blow out the stress of my life,see if I can have one last shot at the title (ARGHspeak for record deal) if it dont work,Back to the covers/functions.

I dont think a kid at 21, fresh out of Uni can leave and be a pure player,unless they either cruiseship it,do the corporate when/wherever,and do it purely by playing alone...except in a hit band or in the Cities Ive cited (inc M25)....there are exceptions,there always are...but Ive not met one,nor met anyone that would take them on,a few kids I know are suffering coz of that,theres less and less to go round here,pubs venues etc,and everyones holding on tight,at least round here....ask Adreno. I dont know anyone that is rich from it,and I compound that with the fact that one lecturer from Brighton,(Damien) stated that there was not enough work available and its getting smaller,and another from Bradford said the same with extra.

Now I have to sleep.....[/quote]

Well apart from not answering my questions I found that pretty harsh. 'rude,ignorant,and creepy'? How so? What does 'after reading what you have,and others have said about 'us' the greater mass,on Basschat, said in 'other' places,I dont care' mean?

ped

[ped]

'You basically called me a liar'

No more than you called me one! You asked me to prove it by naming people! Come on ARGH! I am inclined to agree with jakesbass' point earlier -

'Aargh I know it may look like it doesn't work for you, maybe you have an attitude that makes you a less desirable proposition than musicians that do make money..'

Other than that, again, as I said, you make some good points. All wrapped up in a very angry kind of attitude!

ped

[William James Easton]

[quote name='steve-soar' post='337928' date='Nov 27 2008, 12:28 AM']Refer to the OP. The Guy was talking about earning a crust 'Playing'..pure PLAYING!


Why do you shout so much?
The world makes me feel ARGH! nearly every day, so try a little tenderness.[/quote]

LOL yes i seem to have opened a can of Negi-worms here!

p.s. to most of you - i never mentioned i wanted to become pro, only wish to be enchanted by tales of pro bass. I enjoy my new pj's too much and as for not having any money, forget about it I spent mny years living in a van with 5 other sweaty man back in my 'punk' days.

VIVA LA BASS PLAYING!

[Happy Jack]

[quote name='Buzz' post='337780' date='Nov 26 2008, 10:12 PM']I think it was Biffy Clyro who up until only a couple of years ago, had band members working in a chippy, while at they same time they were playing Reading/Leeds/Glasto et al.[/quote]

There are many musicians whose only wish is to make the world a better plaice ...