Rikkers Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 (edited) Although Gibsons aren't made of aluminium or steel (at least for the most part), Gibson Brands could be troubled by the thread of a possible trade war. I'm a Gibson fan myself and it pains me to see such a train accident happening in slo mo. Kind a like Amy Winehouse.............✝️ What are your views about this subject? Edited June 9, 2018 by Rikkers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T-Bay Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 Another Gibson fan here, still can’t understand how a once innovative company are at where they are now, whereas Fender ‘two designs in any colour you want’ are doing well. They diversified in weird ways that were poor business decisions I suppose. My thunderbird will be prised from my cold dead hands. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rikkers Posted June 9, 2018 Author Share Posted June 9, 2018 4 minutes ago, T-Bay said: My thunderbird will be prised from my cold dead hands. I agree. I only have mine about two months now. It's my dream bass. But me being a lefty I'd have to wait untill Gibson started to build lefties again. When I heard of Gibson's plans to build a lefty I pulled the plug. No regrets here. Auto tuners was a very bad idea. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank Blank Posted June 9, 2018 Share Posted June 9, 2018 32 minutes ago, T-Bay said: Another Gibson fan here, still can’t understand how a once innovative company are at where they are now... Massively overpricing coupled with a steep decrease of build quality will see off even the most iconic brand eventually. 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bassassin Posted June 10, 2018 Share Posted June 10, 2018 29 minutes ago, Frank Blank said: Massively overpricing coupled with a steep decrease of build quality will see off even the most iconic brand eventually. If that was true Rickenbacker should've folded 40 years ago. Ricks have always fallen to bits if you look at them funny. Maybe Trump will succeed where John Hall's bloodyminded incompetence has failed. 1 hour ago, T-Bay said: ...can’t understand how a once innovative company are at where they are now, whereas Fender ‘two designs in any colour you want’ are doing well. Probably because Fenders were designed to be mass-produced inexpensively & they've sensibly decided to maximise the cheap & cheerful end of their product range for the last 35 years or so. Can't help thinking their cleverest trick might have been to persuade some people it's worth paying £3000+ for a bass/guitar that's fundamentally identical to a £200 one with Squier on the end. 4 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skankdelvar Posted June 10, 2018 Share Posted June 10, 2018 1 hour ago, Rikkers said: What are your views about this subject? Hopefully someone will buy Gibson and do what is needed to be done to restore it to its pre-eminence among guitar manufacturers. As for the impact of any trade wars; frankly, that's the least of Gibson's worries: paying their debts to their suppliers, restoring domestic US consumer confidence and putting Henry Juszkiewicz to the sword should be top priorities. More discussions here back in February: And in May: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rikkers Posted June 10, 2018 Author Share Posted June 10, 2018 1 hour ago, Frank Blank said: Massively overpricing coupled with a steep decrease of build quality will see off even the most iconic brand eventually. Nothing wrong with my 2018 TBird. And compared to a US Fender or a Ric very well priced. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rikkers Posted June 10, 2018 Author Share Posted June 10, 2018 (edited) @skankdelvar I know these discussions. The point is that Trump doesn't make it easier. Edited June 10, 2018 by Rikkers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikel Posted June 10, 2018 Share Posted June 10, 2018 Fender basses and more so guitars have been the trendy instruments to own for decades. In the late 60s and 70s the Les Paul was the guitar to have. Slash briefly caused a Gibson resurgence but it was short lived. Nothing wrong with the quality, just wrong time wrong place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T-Bay Posted June 10, 2018 Share Posted June 10, 2018 9 hours ago, Frank Blank said: Massively overpricing coupled with a steep decrease of build quality will see off even the most iconic brand eventually. I meant it more in the ‘I don’t understand why they made the decisions they did’ as opposed to why did it happen, but you are right to a degree on some models. That said I have a 2013 EB and the quality is excellent and it was keenly priced, certainly better made and cheaper than some Fender models I looked at, but I think the damage had already been done. I think the major error was in making all sorts of weird and wonderful stuff but only doing one or two options on their main sellers, whereas Fender concentrated on a small range but did them in every colour and option you could imagine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Jack Posted June 10, 2018 Share Posted June 10, 2018 I've not seen any reportage that musical instruments have become part of the new tariffs imposed by the EU - have I missed something? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpondonBassed Posted June 10, 2018 Share Posted June 10, 2018 (edited) 9 hours ago, Bassassin said: If that was true Rickenbacker should've folded 40 years ago. Ricks have always fallen to bits if you look at them funny. Maybe Trump will succeed where John Hall's bloodyminded incompetence has failed. Probably because Fenders were designed to be mass-produced inexpensively & they've sensibly decided to maximise the cheap & cheerful end of their product range for the last 35 years or so. Can't help thinking their cleverest trick might have been to persuade some people it's worth paying £3000+ for a bass/guitar that's fundamentally identical to a £200 one with Squier on the end. I've always thought that too. Isn't it the same with die-hard Harley Davidson owners? Image is all. Edited June 10, 2018 by SpondonBassed 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikel Posted June 10, 2018 Share Posted June 10, 2018 8 minutes ago, Happy Jack said: I've not seen any reportage that musical instruments have become part of the new tariffs imposed by the EU - have I missed something? True, but why not? Trump claims EU steel is unfair competition, meaning the U S steel industry is simply not up to speed and fails to compete. We could do the same to their musical instrument industry. Even better, tarrifs on all the junk food they dump on the unsuspecting. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skybone Posted June 10, 2018 Share Posted June 10, 2018 (edited) IMO, it's certainly going to hit most, if not all, of the US Manufacturer's. Add CITES into the mix, and we could potentially have a situation like that of the late 50's/early 60's where US made instruments were out of reach from all but the very well off. Gibson's recent financial history doesn't help the situation either, and Ric's are just seriously overpriced outside of the US anyway. The EU appear to have "targeted" these tariff's to key Republican States, so whether they'll hit the guitar manufacturer's, we shall have to wait & see. Edited June 10, 2018 by Skybone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve-bbb Posted June 10, 2018 Share Posted June 10, 2018 11 hours ago, Rikkers said: Although Gibsons aren't made of aluminium or steel (at least for the most part), Gibson Brands could be troubled by the thread of a possible trade war. I'm a Gibson fan myself and it pains me to see such a train accident happening in slo mo. Kind a like Amy Winehouse.............✝️ What are your views about this subject? i think linking it to trumpy pumpy or any politician for that matter, and inferring that gibson's decline could be terminal because of politics is a bit disingenuous - gibson's ceo and his board chums managed that all by themselves with their executive "lifestyle choice" decisions without any need for political scapegoating 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rikkers Posted June 10, 2018 Author Share Posted June 10, 2018 3 minutes ago, Skybone said: IMO, it's certainly going to hit most, if not all, of the US Manufacturer's. Add CITES into the mix, and we could potentially have a situation like that of the late 50's/early 60's where US made instruments were out of reach from all but the very well off. Gibson's recent financial history doesn't help the situation either, and Ric's are just seriously overpriced outside of the US anyway. Exactly my point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woodinblack Posted June 10, 2018 Share Posted June 10, 2018 1 hour ago, T-Bay said: I think the major error was in making all sorts of weird and wonderful stuff but only doing one or two options on their main sellers, whereas Fender concentrated on a small range but did them in every colour and option you could imagine. I don't think it was an error making all sorts of weird and wonderful stuff, I think their main error was buying loads of other unrelated companies and running them very very badly. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve-bbb Posted June 10, 2018 Share Posted June 10, 2018 16 minutes ago, Woodinblack said: I don't think it was an error making all sorts of weird and wonderful stuff, I think their main error was buying loads of other unrelated companies and running them very very badly. this and the "aspirational lifestyle marketing BS " Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cato Posted June 10, 2018 Share Posted June 10, 2018 14 minutes ago, Woodinblack said: I don't think it was an error making all sorts of weird and wonderful stuff, I think their main error was buying loads of other unrelated companies and running them very very badly. Exactly. It's not the core Gibson guitar business that's caused the problems. It's the period during the late 90s to now during which Gibson borrowed a load of money to buy up numerous other businesses, some of them not even remotely related to instrument manufacture, then proceeded to run those businesses in to the ground without ever coming close to recovering the cost of their initial investment. If they'd stuck to just making Gibson and Epiphone guitars they'd probably have been fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_b Posted June 10, 2018 Share Posted June 10, 2018 IMO it is the core Gibson business that is in serious trouble. The Gibson reputation and QC is so bad that they are not selling. Most of the guys I played with leading up to the 90's had at least one Gibson. 99% of the guitarists I've played with since have used Fender guitars, mostly Strats. The last 2 Gibson playing guitarists I was in a band with both stooped playing Gibson's several years ago. One bought a Burny and the other an Orville. These guys would rather have been playing Gibson's but they are not made as well as the competition it seems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T-Bay Posted June 10, 2018 Share Posted June 10, 2018 35 minutes ago, Woodinblack said: I don't think it was an error making all sorts of weird and wonderful stuff, I think their main error was buying loads of other unrelated companies and running them very very badly. That is a good point, I had forgotten about all their rubbish they had tagged on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drTStingray Posted June 10, 2018 Share Posted June 10, 2018 (edited) 13 hours ago, Rikkers said: Although Gibsons aren't made of aluminium or steel (at least for the most part), Gibson Brands could be troubled by the thread of a possible trade war. What are your views about this subject? There are lots of reasons not to buy a Gibson in recent years but still lots of reason to buy one - in particular if you want to sound like Paul Kossoff or any number of famous guitarists over the last 50+ years then a Les Paul, 335 and others are what you need - and I believe there'll always be people who want them. The basses have a similar following for reason like Andy Fraser and others. Those who play All Right Now using the thinner sounding Fender instruments have a parallel with thin, soprano level vocals emulating Paul Rogers or Rod Stewart to me. Haven't got the depth of the original. Turning to Mr Trump, I personally find his international pariah attitude tiresome and bullying as a European (he seems to be aiming a lot of his spleen in our direction currently) - and have noticed that since he pulled the US out of the Iran deal the price of my fuel has gone up a massive amount - so thanks for that!! How could this affect Gibson - well apart from trade sanctions those of us who purchase American goods, particularly as luxury items, may well choose to not buy them as a result at being incensed by being treated with such disdain and ignorance by the US leader - so mcds and Starbucks watch out (and pay your tax as well) - Gibson, Fender et al - well do we really need to buy any right now??? I suspect this is exactly what's happened to Gibson guitars over the last few years owing to the reported QC issues. But people will always want their guitars - possibly less so when there is growing anti US feeling!! Edited June 10, 2018 by drTStingray Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Jack Posted June 10, 2018 Share Posted June 10, 2018 Trump has, at most, another three years. The anti-Trump backlash, both in the USA and abroad, will be sufficient to see a complete reversal of all his insane policies. IMHO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cato Posted June 10, 2018 Share Posted June 10, 2018 5 minutes ago, Happy Jack said: Trump has, at most, another three years. The anti-Trump backlash, both in the USA and abroad, will be sufficient to see a complete reversal of all his insane policies. IMHO. I admire your optimism. It's quite unusual for a President not to get 2 terms George Dubya got re-elected even after his Iraq intervention went completely pear shaped. I think his dad was the only president in the last 40 years who didn't get a second term. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drTStingray Posted June 10, 2018 Share Posted June 10, 2018 (edited) 15 minutes ago, Happy Jack said: Trump has, at most, another three years. The anti-Trump backlash, both in the USA and abroad, will be sufficient to see a complete reversal of all his insane policies. IMHO. International consumers walking away from US goods and services will assist in hastening that. I also admire your optimism - I actually wonder if he did get voted out when the time comes whether he would willingly go. There was a previous nation's leader in the 30s who campaigned on the basis of putting his nation first - at all costs - different coloured combover though 😏 Edited June 10, 2018 by drTStingray Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.