Christine Posted July 22, 2018 Posted July 22, 2018 (edited) A few weeks ago before i went on holiday I was asked to start a thread about the newish Rocklite synthetic replacement s for fretboards and the like. Initially it was available only as an Ebony replacement but earlier this year a Rosewood replacement also became available. I have been using these on my current builds and have been very impressed. The topic has been discussed quite extensively on another forum but it would be nice if we had our own here so: Most of the information I have isn't my own so I won't pretend I know all this stuff, I have had the permission of the American luthier Bruce Johnson www.xstrange.com to copy his posts from another forum and share that info here with you but for now I will just paste in some posts of his with good information in them and eventually I will post some of my own with my own findings. I'll have to edit them slightly to try and keep them in context so please forgive any references that don't seem to relate to any question. I truly believe that the like of Rocklite will become the future for exotic hardwoods in musical instruments with the current restrictions with CITES. Edited July 22, 2018 by Christine Quote
Christine Posted July 22, 2018 Author Posted July 22, 2018 Quoting Bruce Johnson I thought I'd start a thread here specifically about Rocklite, the new synthetic alternative to ebony for fingerboards. I've started working with it now on some necks for clients (other Luthiers). I'll share my observations as I go, and encourage any of you who try it to join in. Tell us how it works or doesn't work for you. First, some background about ebony and the synthetics: There is a revolution taking place in the world of ebony fingerboards. Real ebony, particularly African ebony, is getting very scarce, very expensive, and highly regulated. There are many sub-species of ebony, but the hard, dark black species are often grouped together as "African ebony". Included are Gabon ebony, Madagascar ebony, West African ebony, and others. Good quality African ebony bass fingerboards are getting difficult to find, and are often costing $100 or more. They are highly regulated by CITES. And ebony boards frequently have serious problems with cracking and warping. I gave up on using African ebony on my basses about ten years ago. Too expensive, too many problems. Macassar ebony is a somewhat different wood, not part of the African Ebony group. It's not pure black, and usually has some brown streaks. Compared to African ebony, Macassar ebony is a bit softer, isn't as brittle, machines easier, and has less problem with cracking. There's still a reasonable supply of it, and it's not too expensive. I've been using Macassar ebony fingerboards on all of my basses for about 12 years. They cost me about $40 each from LMI. Those are the two kinds of real ebony: African ebony is pure black, very dense and hard, scarce and expensive. Macassar ebony is black with brown stripes, less dense and hard, still available and reasonably priced. Synthetic Ebony: Over the years, several "synthetic ebony" products have been introduced and used for instrument fingerboards. I'll mention Ebanol, Richlite, and now Rocklite. These are three different types of materials, made by different processes. They are not the same thing at all. Ebanol and Rockwood: Ebanol has been around since the '70's, I believe, and has been used in some mass production instruments. Fender was using it for a while. Ebanol (and a few similar products) are made by taking a softer, more porous board of some other wood and soaking it under pressure with a black plastic resin. It's a better version of dying the wood, filling the pores with black-dyed resin. It makes it black and hardens it somewhat. It's generally regarded as a cheap substitute for ebony, although some people like it for what it is. It tends to look and feel like, well, a block of black plastic. On fretless basses, Ebanol fingerboards have a similar feel and sound to epoxy coated fingerboards. As a side note, Rockwood is a similar product to Ebanol, made about the same way. Rockwood is available in many rainbow colors, and is commonly sold in smaller blocks for making knife handles, pens, etc. It's made by saturating soft wood laminates with clear or tinted hard resins. Like Ebanol, it machines and feels like a block of plastic. It has a high content of plastic resin, usually a polyester. It's tough to saw, gumming up blades and smoking. Richlite: Richlite has been around for about 20 years. It's kind of a derivative of Bakelite in how it's made. Many thin layers of wood paper are saturated with black resin and stacked up and cured under high pressure. It's more like a hard black cardboard. In the world of industrial plastics, there's a similar product called Garolite. It's tough and black and looks good for flat plates. It's commonly used to make insulator blocks in electrical equipment, and insulating parts in machines. I use 1/16" black Garolite sheet as the backing when I make wood veneer pickguards. As far as I can tell, Richlite is a similar material to Garolite. I've worked with smaller pieces of Richlite, but I've never used it for a fingerboard. Like Garolite, it's shiny and black as a block or a sheet. But, it doesn't look as good when you carve it into contours, such as a radiused fingerboard. It gets greyish, and you can see some ghost lines of the layers. It can be re-coated with polyester resin or epoxy to make it shiny black again. Then it's about like Ebanol. It's strong and hard, but it's not going to fool you for ebony. It has a synthetic look. Pretty nasty to saw and machine. Rocklite: Rocklite is a relatively new synthetic ebony that's come on to the market. It's made in England, and is now being imported by LMI. Right now, they are the only source of it here in the US. It appears that Rocklite is a much more sophisticated product than Richlite or Ebanol. Their goal is to closely match the properties of real ebony. From what I understand, Rocklite is made by grinding up wood into long thin splinters, which are then packed into a mold in a linear orientation, saturated with black resin, and cured under high pressure. The process is more like MDF, but using long oriented splinters, rather sawdust. The result is a closer replication of the material structure of real ebony. And the density, hardness, etc. are all really close. It has more wood and less resin than Ebanol or Richlite. It should behave more like wood, particularly in gluing and in temperature expansion. If true, those are big advantages over Ebanol and Richlite. I have several Rocklite fingerboard blanks here in my shop right now, which are going on custom necks for two of my Luthier clients. I'll be gluing, radiusing, and slotting them over the next few days. Holding these bare boards here in my hands, I can tell you that Rocklite is very, very close to real ebony in color, weight, hardness, and overall look and feel. It's like a flawless piece of Macassar ebony, but pure black with no brown stripes. It has a fairly realistic grain and texture, but no growth rings. For reference, the Rocklite 5-string size bass fingerboard is currently $46 from LMI. That's about equal in price to Macassar ebony, and about half the price of top grade African ebony. So here's a Rocklite fingerboard on a guitar neck blank for Mike Lipe. The Rocklite blank came through sanded fairly rough, like 100 grit. It appears to be a medium density fine-grained dry wood, like birch or alder. But all black. It's not packed full of resin or wax, like cocobolo. It looks like wood. I was originally thinking that I would glue it on with West Systems epoxy, like I do with all the Macassar ebony fingerboards on my Scroll Basses. But Mike usually prefers that I use LMI's Yellow Instrument Makers Glue on his necks. So, I went ahead and used the LMI glue on this one. There doesn't seem to be any problem. The glue does sink into the surface well and grab hold. Here's a closeup after radiusing the surface in my router fixture. My router process cuts the radius as about 10 flat facets. The lighter lines are the edges of those facets. You can see that the Rocklite actually has grain. It's fine and very uniform, running along the length of the fingerboard. About like ebony's grain, although much more perfect. That's down in the wood, not caused by the router. And here it is after cutting the fret slots and sanding the surface. No problems at all sawing the slots. No binding or smoking like a waxy wood. It feels a little softer to cut than Macassar ebony, and much softer than African ebony. This is sanded with 150 and 220 to round off the facet ridges. Again, notice the grain. From here, it goes to Mike. He'll put in the inlays and fine sand it to 600 or 800. I'm not sure what he plans to do for coating on this one. Coming up, I'm putting a Rocklite fingerboard on a bass neck for Jeremy (aka FreekMagnet on here). On that one, I'll be radiusing and slotting it, then taking it all the way up to a full polish, like I do with Macassar ebony. We'll see how that works out. So far, I'm impressed. This may be the answer to the ebony problem. Not a cheap substitute, but an actual better replacement, that we may prefer over real ebony. Within a few years, Rocklite (and maybe some competitors) may just replace all ebony on instrument fingerboards. And, as they keep developing this technology, they will work out formulas for other properties and colors. I suspect that pretty soon, it'll be available with realistic looking striping for those who want it. And then, maybe they will come up with a good synthetic Brazilian rosewood. We're looking at the future of exotic woods in our business. Like it or not. Quote
Christine Posted July 22, 2018 Author Posted July 22, 2018 Quoting Bruce Johnson I haven't finished an instrument with it yet, but at this point, I'd be really surprised if it sounded any different from Macassar ebony. I'd say its properties are more like Macassar ebony than African ebony. It's a little softer than most African ebony. And I think that's a good thing. I showed these boards to all of us Luthiers here in the Lab, handing them a Rocklite board along with new African and Macassar ebony boards. We all agreed that the Rocklite looked, felt and sounded (by tapping) very, very close to the real thing. What gave it away was that it's so perfect. No streaks, no flaws, no weave in the grain. Quote
Christine Posted July 22, 2018 Author Posted July 22, 2018 Quoting Bruce Johnson An added note: Mike Lipe is finishing up that guitar neck that I showed above. He's got the dots and frets in it now. He says that he really likes the Rocklite, that it works like wood, not like plastic. He's used Ebanol and Richlite in years past. He agreed with me that Rocklite's hardness is less than African ebony, but more than rosewood. A nice workable range. Quote
Christine Posted July 22, 2018 Author Posted July 22, 2018 Quoting Bruce Johnson Yes, Rocklite is somewhat porous. It soaks in glue just fine. I haven't tried oils, like Stew-Mac's Fingerboard Oil yet. Hmmm. I have some cutoff scraps. An interesting test would be to accurately measure a piece, then soak it in water for a while, then measure it again to see if it swells. Yes, Rocklite has a "grain" of parallel lines which look almost like it's a stack of quarter-sawn veneers. But I don't think it's really made from a stack of sheets, like Richlite or Garolite or Bakelite. From their description, it's made from "toothpicks", long splinters which are aligned. Rocklite is much more like wood than the others, in weight, hardness, porosity, etc. It doesn't really appear to have resin content at all. Quote
Christine Posted July 22, 2018 Author Posted July 22, 2018 Quoting Bruce Johnson Right from their own mouths, here's Rocklite's announcement about their new Faux Indian Rosewood. Coming in January 2018: Rocklite - Environmentally friendly tonewoods & hardwoods | eco friendly ebony Quote
Christine Posted July 22, 2018 Author Posted July 22, 2018 Quoting Bruce Johnson No, good synthetic exotic woods aren't going to be the cheap option. Rocklite's Ebano (which is what they are calling the synthetic ebony) currently costs about $46 for a 5-string size bass fingerboard. In comparison, a Macassar ebony fingerboard of that size is about $42. I'd expect that their Faux Rosewood will be around the same price range, at least initially. It's a similar process. Over time, the prices for these synthetic woods will probably come down, as they build up their production and distribution. And, we'll probably see some competitors emerge as acceptance of the use of synthetic woods grows. If Rocklite sells well, there will almost certainly be an inexpensive far-eastern import version before long. That's the way the marketplace works. From my experience so far, I see Rocklite's Ebano as an improvement over real ebony, not a cheap substitute. And I mean for technical reasons, not just price and availability. Quote
Christine Posted July 22, 2018 Author Posted July 22, 2018 Quoting Bruce Johnson Here's another Rocklite fingerboard on a neck-through flying V guitar neck that I made up for Mike Lipe. This is sanded to 150 grit after radiusing and slotting. You can see how much it really does look like ebony. When you cut it, it smells like wood, not plastic. A couple of the guys commented that it smells faintly like pot! We were half jokingly wondering if they are using hemp as the fibers to make it. Maybe? Quote
Christine Posted July 22, 2018 Author Posted July 22, 2018 Quoting Bruce Johnson One small caution about Rocklite Ebano: I trimmed the edges of that Ebano fingerboard on the 7-string guitar this morning on my edge sander. I managed to clog up the belt. The Rocklite does have enough resin content in it that, if you lean it heavily into a powered sander, it can melt a band of hard resin into the sanding belt. It's in there hard enough that I couldn't clean it off with the sanding eraser. I'm not saying that you can't belt sand Rocklite. But you need to be careful not to generate too much heat while sanding. Sand with light pressure, moving it around. Keep cleaning it with the sanding eraser. It's about the same as cocobolo. Note from me: just use light pressure when using sanding machines that generate high heat like disk or belt sanders Quote
Christine Posted July 22, 2018 Author Posted July 22, 2018 Quoting Bruce Johnson Does the ebano have a similar density to the real thing, i.e. does it sink in water? That's an interesting question. Here's the answer, from extensive laboratory testing, just minutes ago: The Rocklite is floating, but chunks of African ebony and Macassar ebony sink. The Rocklite is just barely floating, so its SPG is probably right near 1.0. But it's clearly a little lighter weight than real ebony. Quote
songofthewind Posted July 22, 2018 Posted July 22, 2018 I’ve got a couple of pieces of Rocklite Ebano here. They are thin veneers, which would be suitable for headstock facings. The grain is quite open and very regular, it seems to me, and maybe a little soft. I think Christine’s idea that it may be plant fibre could be on the money. 1 Quote
Christine Posted July 22, 2018 Author Posted July 22, 2018 Quoting Bruce Johnson Something more to add to this general discussion: A Luthier client brought me a Richlite fingerboard to radius and slot this week. I'd worked with a few smaller pieces of Richlite before, but this was the first time I recall doing a full fingerboard. A good chance to compare it against the Rocklite. If you go back to my first post, Richlite is a completely different material from Rocklite. It's a synthetic substitute for ebony, but it's made by a completely different process. Richlite is a more modern version of Bakelite, the old industrial material that was used in the structures of electrical switch gear. Richlite is made from recycled paper, saturated in black-dyed resin, and cured under high heat and pressure. Richlite has been around for 20 years or so in fingerboard blank sizes. LMII carries it in guitar and bass sizes. For comparison, a Richlite bass fingerboard blank is $26. A Rocklite bass fingerboard is $46. Richlite is also available in brown. So, here's the Richlite: Basically, Richlite is about halfway between wood and plastic. It's solid black, with no real grain structure. The lines you see in the pictures are just sanding scratches. I radiused this board with the router, cut the slots, and then sanded it with 150, 220, and 400 grit paper. Those are 400 grit scratches. You can go up through the grits and polish it up to a fairly high gloss. I didn't do that here. Note the slight greyish ripply figuring. That's not visible on the flat board, but it appears after radiusing. I assume that's some of the layers of the paper base. It's not horrible or ugly, but it's not wood-like. It machines about like soft Plexiglass. Not difficult to cut, but it sprays fine black dust and tends to heat and bind on saw blades. My slotting saw was bogging down going through it, from heat and friction. It's a not a real hard material. Sharp metal will easily gouge it or scratch it. I would rate its hardness as a little harder than Rocklite, but less than African ebony. Overall, it's black and can be made into a decent working fingerboard. But, it's not going to fool anyone for ebony or real wood. It looks and feels like a plastic-base material. I definitely would rather use Rocklite on my basses, even at the higher price. But, Richlite is an alternative. Quote
Christine Posted July 22, 2018 Author Posted July 22, 2018 Very interesting thread, I've been looking at Rocklite for a while and wondered what it might be like. Could I trouble you with a couple of questions please Is the Sundari similar in physical properties to the Ebano? If so it sounds like an improvement over real Indian Rosewood (apart from the smell which I love when machining it) Have you had any feedback from owners of your instruments with the Rocklite boards? Quote
Christine Posted July 22, 2018 Author Posted July 22, 2018 Quoting Bruce Johnson I haven't tried the Sundari yet, so I don't know whether it's just a different colored version of Ebano, or if they have adjusted the formulation to make it softer. Their web site indicates that they have developed it to imitate Indian rosewood. In a hardness comparison, Ebano is about equal to Macassar ebony, and a good bit harder than Indian rosewood. So, if they are trying to closely match the properties, Sundari would need to be softer than Ebano. Has anyone else tried Sundari yet? Mike Lipe has completed four guitars now (I machined the fingerboards) with Ebano fingerboards. On one, we also put on an Ebano headstock cap. In all cases, the customers have said it's beautiful, looks and feels just like real ebony. No trace of any shrinkage or swelling or cracking. Ebano is exceptionally stable. It's the perfect wood. Quote
Christine Posted July 22, 2018 Author Posted July 22, 2018 If no one has used it I might try it on my next two builds and report back. I would be using Ebano headstock veneers so I should get some idea of a comparison, certainly in grain and density and maybe an indication of hardness Quote
Christine Posted July 22, 2018 Author Posted July 22, 2018 Small update, the fretboards arrived this morning. First impressions were that they both looked like the real thing even though the sanding tends to obscure the grain within the material. As you can see from the photos the Sundari looks just like Indian Rosewood, honestly from looking at it and holding it I wouldn't know what it really was. It's lighter in shade than some but darker than others, wetting it darkens it just like real wood too. The Sundari is definitely lighter in weight than the Ebano despite being slightly longer, The Ebano weighed in at 437g and the Sundari at 391g so there's a definite attempt to mimic the real properties of the individual timbers. I'm very impressed with the Sundari, I've used an awful lot of Indian Rosewood over the years as a furniture maker so I think I'm a fair judge, no they're not the most decorative boards but they're exactly the board I'd choose for a fretboard. I'll report back when I'm working on them, the builds will be concurrent so I should be able to give a fair comparison Another observation is that they have sealed the endgrain. I can only assume that because of the linear like construction they have found that it can absorb moisture easily, I can't imaging it's to control checking Quote
Christine Posted July 22, 2018 Author Posted July 22, 2018 Quoting Bruce Johnson Wow, that Sundari looks amazing! The color striping is more randomly natural than I had expected. They even got those tiny fine lines in there. I'm going to have to try the Sundari. I build partially finished guitar necks for my buddy Mike Lipe. Lately we've been using roasted Pau Ferro in place of rosewood, which is quite nice. But it isn't cheap, and the Sundari may be in the same price range. Quote
Christine Posted July 22, 2018 Author Posted July 22, 2018 (edited) This is the colour change when the Sundari is wet with water. It's actually very absorbent and looks like it will glue and take an oil finish very well. Bruce, the small detail in the grain and figure is quite frankly amazing, honestly you'd have a hard time distinguishing it from a genuine board of Rosewood Edited July 22, 2018 by Christine Quote
Christine Posted July 22, 2018 Author Posted July 22, 2018 my concern is that it is so realistic, what would happen if an instrument made from this was inspected by customs? If I can't tell the difference in the raw then what chance will an unfamiliar customs person have seeing it fretted and oiled? I have emailed Rocklite to ask them how can we prove that it's a substitute for the real thing without destructive testing. I'll let you know their response as soon as I have it Quote
Christine Posted July 22, 2018 Author Posted July 22, 2018 Just heard back: Rocklite said: Hi, thanks for your very complimentary email. When we first started out trying to accurately replicate a true Rosewood, obviously we were totally consumed with this one thought. But yes you are right after we has succeeded, we quickly realised that we would have to find a way to help couriers and customs understand our products. This was especially true for couriers as they have to except some responsibility for true Dalbergia’s (rosewoods) moving across boarders without the necessary paperwork. So we developed a hidden website page especially for customs and couriers, explaining how to tell the difference and some of the tests they can run. The easiest test for fingerboards is the cellulose thinners test, whilst all true rosewoods will leach colour profusely when exposed to thinners, our products leach virtually no colour, they are also far more colour fast to light Neither getting lighter or darker when exposed to UV light. There are a number of other helpful tips on telling Rocklite Sundari from the real thing on our customs assistance page. Best regards Steve Keys. Click to expand... And my reply: Christine said: Hi Steve Many thanks for your reply, those tips sound helpful and reassuring that you are well ahead of me. I take it then as you have not included the link that all customs have been made aware of the hidden page to assist them? I assume then that it would also be a sensible precaution to include a note with an instrument to state that the fretboard etc is made from Rocklite and to advise looking at the hidden website? After that it would be the owners responsibility to keep the note with the guitar when crossing borders. Quote
Christine Posted July 22, 2018 Author Posted July 22, 2018 (edited) I never heard anything back from Rocklite but a member @samhay on the Basschat forum gave me this link Rocklite Ltd. So I think that will be printed out if I ever sell any basses with a Rocklite Fretboard Edited July 22, 2018 by Christine Quote
Christine Posted July 22, 2018 Author Posted July 22, 2018 Today I had a play with the Rocklite boards, still impressed you'll be glad to know. The Sundari is slightly softer than the Ebano when sawing fret slots but cuts very cleanly, very similar to real Rosewood. Very strangely and this might be my imagination but the smell was very reminiscent of Indian Rosewood but fainter. I routed a small bit and it cut very smoothly, easier than real Rosewood with no resistance from the annular rings, the cut quality was first class and completely clean. I forgot to take a photo but take my word for it, it's a joy to work. I sanded a coving into the endgrain as I would on an unbound fretboard sometimes as a test for the procedure but also to show how the Rocklite would look. It sanded easily and the faux endgraid shows clearly how the Sundari is constructed. It is less reminiscent of Rosewood here but still attractive and unless you worked with Rosewood a fair bit you wouldn't know I don't think. My biggest surprise was planing it, the Ebano is harder then the Sundari from a resistance to pushing a plane through it but bot cut miles cleaner and easier than the real thing, I used a block plane that I'd been using for other things before and wasn't as keen as it should have been but I'm sure you'll agree the results are good and the grain structure of both types is clearly visible. So honestly, I can really see myself using Rocklite from now on. Time will tell how it wears but from initial experiences I think it is easier than the real things and totally convincing Quote
Christine Posted July 22, 2018 Author Posted July 22, 2018 Another quickie to show you routing the Ebano, I'm still waiting on the MOP for the Sundari to arrive but it seems to rout exactly the same It as I said yesterday is a joy to rout, like cutting butter with a sharp knife as they say. For my inlays I routed close to the line and then pared to the line with a sharp chisel, apart from one little bit shown below where I made a slight wonder over the line with the router. My excuse is there was too much dust around the cutter LOL. After that I put a bit of masking tape on the cutter to blow it away and it never happened again. Chiselling was the first time I really found a difference to real wood, I don't really know how to describe it but paring Ebony, it's a clean forceful sort of cut, the Ebano felt more like paring balsa but harder, that said it cut very cleanly, certainly good enough for me. Anyway, the inlays fitted a treat with no stress at all other than that one little incident of my own doing. It cut so cleanly I'm thinking I may get away with no real need for edge filling with glue and dust (apart from that one bit shown again with the inlay). Quote
Christine Posted July 22, 2018 Author Posted July 22, 2018 (edited) A final update on the Sundari, just a picture to show it and the Ebano after one wipe with oil.A bit splodgey looking as it was still wet in parts, sorry Edited July 22, 2018 by Christine Quote
Christine Posted July 22, 2018 Author Posted July 22, 2018 Finally a video from Youtube (where would we be without it! Quote
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