Stylon Pilson Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 Some great songs from days of yore have lyrics that, sadly, reflect the prejudices of their time. What is your approach to incorporating these songs into a set list for a covers band? Would you refuse to do them on principle? Would you perform them accurately? Or would you modify them to make them a bit more palatable? S.P. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Jack Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 Veering off topic, but staying on theme, I played a big social club a few months back and the regulars complained about the music I put through the PA during the breaks ... "not 70s enough", they said. We played there again last Saturday so I brought along a double CD of "Top Of The Pops - Best Of The Seventies". Halfway through the second break I realised that my PA was belting out "Whoah Black Betty - Bam-a-Lam!". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uk_lefty Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 We will change the offending word to something else often. Seems best, these days with the culture of being easily offended by anything and everything and being able to spread that by social media we just don't want the hassle. Plus, we don't want to offend people either, we play for people to enjoy themselves and don't want to have anyone genuinely upset. Aware others will have very different views but we are a party band that want bookings, not an originals band making its own stamp on the world, so we need to be friendly and acceptable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bassalarky Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 Same as UK lefty. If the song seems generally inappropriate we'll drop it from the set (eg. 'creep' at a summer ball for special needs students) or the singer might just replace a swear word here and there. If it's the local Rugby Club then we'll just have at it 😀 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hobbayne Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 We do the radio friendly version of Creep with the "So Very Special" lyric Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ead Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 Do folk not understand that the world and its views change over time? If I don't like a particular lyric then I choose to not listen to it, I don't write to my MP. Just loop the Pistols "No Fun" endlessly.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Akio Dāku Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 I'd never change an "offensive" lyric if I was covering a song. The composer wrote those words for a reason and I think it's a greater offence to bastardise someone's art than to offend someone who deams their language to be inappropriate. It's your God given right to be offended and it's my God given right to offend you. Words are not and will never be violence; "Sticks and stones... Etc." to equate "offence" with "assault" is a very dangerous road to tread in my eyes. 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uk_lefty Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 1 minute ago, Akio Dāku said: I'd never change an "offensive" lyric if I was covering a song. The composer wrote those words for a reason and I think it's a greater offence to bastardise someone's art than to offend someone who deams their language to be inappropriate. It's your God given right to be offended and it's my God given right to offend you. Words are not and will never be violence; "Sticks and stones... Etc." to equate "offence" with "assault" is a very dangerous road to tread in my eyes. I agree with you to a large extent, but I am confident my bands approach is the right thing for us as a band. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Akio Dāku Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 4 minutes ago, uk_lefty said: I agree with you to a large extent, but I am confident my bands approach is the right thing for us as a band. Cheers man and that's totally understandable, it's something each individual has to choose for themselves. There's no right or wrong way, I'm happy providing things like this are left to the preference of the individual performer and not imposed by external forces. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phil.c60 Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 Yeah - We're a blues band and I love the groove of "Hey Little Schoolgirl" but we decided against it as we're all in our fifties and the "Can I Come Home With You" line seemed somewhat inappropriate to say the least. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uk_lefty Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 6 minutes ago, phil.c60 said: Yeah - We're a blues band and I love the groove of "Hey Little Schoolgirl" but we decided against it as we're all in our fifties and the "Can I Come Home With You" line seemed somewhat inappropriate to say the least. Times have indeed changed! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikel Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 (edited) 12 minutes ago, phil.c60 said: Yeah - We're a blues band and I love the groove of "Hey Little Schoolgirl" but we decided against it as we're all in our fifties and the "Can I Come Home With You" line seemed somewhat inappropriate to say the least. Well, I can understand, to a degree, but anyone who is into The Blues will know the song and understand you are not speaking from a personal point of view but merely covering an old classic. I am a married man, so should I avoid covering any song that mentions attraction to a woman who is patently not my wife? I think things can be taken too far. It didnt stop old blue eyes singing "Something stupid" as a duet with his own daughter. Its a love song by the way. Edited August 3, 2018 by mikel 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingrayPete1977 Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 Our lady singer vetoed 'brown sugar', we decided that there are enough songs to cover without forcing any band member to play anything they don't want to. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
police squad Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 you scum bag, you maggot, you cheap lousy faggot That little faggot with the ear ring and the make up leave em be 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ambient Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 1 hour ago, Akio Dāku said: I'd never change an "offensive" lyric if I was covering a song. The composer wrote those words for a reason and I think it's a greater offence to bastardise someone's art than to offend someone who deams their language to be inappropriate. It's your God given right to be offended and it's my God given right to offend you. Words are not and will never be violence; "Sticks and stones... Etc." to equate "offence" with "assault" is a very dangerous road to tread in my eyes. The composer might have written them because racism or sexism was fine at the time. There are words that are deemed to be offensive now simply because they are offensive, personally I couldn't care less that they were fine 30 or 40 years ago, it's now that we're living in. If I was playing in a covers band, then yes I would change the lyric. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fretmeister Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 1 hour ago, Akio Dāku said: I'd never change an "offensive" lyric if I was covering a song. The composer wrote those words for a reason and I think it's a greater offence to bastardise someone's art than to offend someone who deams their language to be inappropriate. It's your God given right to be offended and it's my God given right to offend you. Words are not and will never be violence; "Sticks and stones... Etc." to equate "offence" with "assault" is a very dangerous road to tread in my eyes. Kirsty MacColl regretted using the word "faggot" in "Fairytale of New York" and even when performing it live in the same year it was released changed the word to "blaggard" She never got a chance to re-record it as we know. I love the song, and I amend it as the writer did. There is a difference in preserving history as it was and actively presenting outdated terms as entertainment. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scalpy Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 We were playing a fundraiser the other day with our acoustic trio at the local hospice. Halfway through our Ace of Spades I realised the lyric ‘That’s the way I like it baby, I don’t want to live forever’ was coming up, but the vocalist was committed and she belted it out anyway. We skipped the next number, Locked Out of Heaven. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger2611 Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 We used to do American Idiot in the covers band, we settled on looking around the venue, if there were kids present we would all go "Beep" in place of the offending words, no kids present we left the swear words in, it got quite funny as there were a few people who had come to see us at festivals that used to still scream "Beep" even when we played in a pub! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Akio Dāku Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 1 hour ago, fretmeister said: Kirsty MacColl regretted using the word "faggot" in "Fairytale of New York" and even when performing it live in the same year it was released changed the word to "blaggard" She never got a chance to re-record it as we know. I love the song, and I amend it as the writer did. There is a difference in preserving history as it was and actively presenting outdated terms as entertainment. 1 hour ago, ambient said: The composer might have written them because racism or sexism was fine at the time. There are words that are deemed to be offensive now simply because they are offensive, personally I couldn't care less that they were fine 30 or 40 years ago, it's now that we're living in. If I was playing in a covers band, then yes I would change the lyric. I'm not disputing those stances and I'm totally down with any performer exercising whatever approach they're most comfortable with. I'm just making sure we're all in agreement that it should remain the performer's choice if they wish to offend/alienate their audience or not. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stylon Pilson Posted August 3, 2018 Author Share Posted August 3, 2018 4 minutes ago, Akio Dāku said: I'm just making sure we're all in agreement that it should remain the performer's choice if they wish to offend/alienate their audience or not. Why's it so important to you that we all agree on that? S.P. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discreet Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 (edited) 10 minutes ago, Akio Dāku said: I'm just making sure we're all in agreement that it should remain the performer's choice if they wish to offend/alienate their audience or not. That's what rock 'n' roll is all about. There's enough bland, generic and inoffensive music out there to choose from, if that's your thing. Edited August 3, 2018 by discreet 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fretmeister Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 1 minute ago, Akio Dāku said: I'm not disputing those stances and I'm totally down with any performer exercising whatever approach they're most comfortable with. I'm just making sure we're all in agreement that it should remain the performer's choice if they wish to offend/alienate their audience or not. Would you actually use the "n" word in a performance? An artist doing original works may well want to ignite debate, or make a point. But a pub covers band? They've just picked the song because they like it. They are not invested in the subject. It doesn't mean as much as to the original writers - and the cover performer cannot truly know what the original intent was. I can't think of much more stupid (within music anyway) of the chance a white man might use the "n" word when covering a song in a pub. Might get a kicking, might even get a conviction depending on what the rest of the lyric was. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Akio Dāku Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 (edited) 46 minutes ago, Stylon Pilson said: Why's it so important to you that we all agree on that? S.P. Because of the overwhelming importance of freedom of speech/expression. 42 minutes ago, fretmeister said: Would you actually use the "n" word in a performance? An artist doing original works may well want to ignite debate, or make a point. But a pub covers band? They've just picked the song because they like it. They are not invested in the subject. It doesn't mean as much as to the original writers - and the cover performer cannot truly know what the original intent was. I can't think of much more stupid (within music anyway) of the chance a white man might use the "n" word when covering a song in a pub. Might get a kicking, might even get a conviction depending on what the rest of the lyric was. I'm a white bloke and I'd happily say "nigger" or any other lyric. It's important I'm clear about this so I'll try my best to expand on my position; in this sense "nigger" has the meta context of "lyric", even if it's being used as a pejorative term in the context of the song. As a performer playing a cover; I am a glorified CD player and if Kendrick Lamar's coming out of the speakers, no-one starts to impose narratives onto the CD player, no-one starts asserting the CD player has a certain set of motivations behind reproduceing the acoustic wave of a small mouth noise produced by a bipedal ape. That's a double standard in my eyes. I quote the great philosopher Bob Marley; "one good thing about music, when it hits you, you feel no pain." Being offended by music/language is something you have to activatly engage in, it's not something that's imposed on you, it's a stance you choose to take, thus it's on the shoulders of the offended not the offenders. And I don't want to spend my weekend defending this, that's just my take but I'm open to being wrong if someone points out a flaw in my logic. Love you all so let's keep this discussion, as a discussion and not an argument. 🙏 Edited August 3, 2018 by Akio Dāku Typo 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stylon Pilson Posted August 3, 2018 Author Share Posted August 3, 2018 5 minutes ago, Akio Dāku said: Because of the overwhelming importance of freedom of speech/expression. What makes your freedom of speech more important than someone else's freedom to live free of oppression? S.P. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skankdelvar Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 (edited) I suspect even the stoutest foe of Bowdlerisation might demur at chirpily singing the N-Word down the Frog and Spigot. Besides, where's the opportunity? Off the top of my head I can only think of one song that might be played by a pub covers band and which contains the offending term, this being Mr Elvis Costello's hit single 'Oliver's Army'. Difficult to pull off without the big piano sounds, though. It is vaguely amusing that we have come so far in deploring a word that - by coyly abbreviating it - we edge towards the view that things are getting better. Perhaps the next step will be to drop the letter N and refer to it simply as 'the word'. Everyone will feel so much better. Yet the bitter, abhorrent and vengeful sentiments that underpin the N-word are just as alive and well today as if the tacit prohibition did not apply. If we are truthful, many of us do really very little about the causes and outcomes of racism beyond fervent public expressions of disdain for the practice; rather, we accommodate ourselves to prevailing opinion by making tiny adjustments to old song lyrics, this in the self-interested hope that we can continue to play a song we like without fear of 'get(ting) a kicking'. Edited August 3, 2018 by skankdelvar 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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