MARKBASS: Is the ’Little Mark 800’ head compatible with the ‘Traveler 102P’ cabinet?

[Greg.Bassman]

Hi all. My current rig is the ‘Little Mark 800’ head through the ‘Standard 104HR’ cabinet (4 Ohm); but I was looking into a smaller cabinet to save on space, namely the ‘Traveler 102P’ (4 Ohm). However, I wondered if the two would be compatible with one another though, as the traveler only have a power of 400W RMS? I don’t know too much of the science behind bass equipment; I’ve just always assumed that the head and cabinet should both be of similar power.... what does it mean to have a cabinet of less power, in conjunction with a higher powered head? Cheers.

Edited August 18, 2018 by Greg.Bassman

[Lozz196]

Without wanting to appear sarcastic it means use your ears and watch the volume and bass controls.In reality if you manage to blow a 400 watt cab there is some serious volume going on, but it can happen. Markbass do an 8ohm version, in your position I`d look at that one, less potential for accidents, even though your amp puts out 500 watts at 8ohms.

[Greg.Bassman]

1 hour ago, Lozz196 said:

Without wanting to appear sarcastic it means use your ears and watch the volume and bass controls.In reality if you manage to blow a 400 watt cab there is some serious volume going on, but it can happen. Markbass do an 8ohm version, in your position I`d look at that one, less potential for accidents, even though your amp puts out 500 watts at 8ohms.

Duly noted lol. But fundamentally, what I want to be sure of is that its not going to blow up on me?! lol

[TrevorG]

I use a 102P with a K1 and despite being rated at 400 watts it handles the 500 watts the K1 puts intro it easily. Getting an 8 Ohm cab would remove your fears. I haven't managed to find all the stats on the drivers but the K1 on its own drives 600 watts into it's 8 Ohm cab but the driver itself is actually rated at 800 RMS. I would not be surprised if the 102P driver had the same headroom(but that's just my guess). Keeping an ear on it as Lazz suggests is the best option with a 4 ohm cab but why risk it?

Edited August 19, 2018 by TrevorG

[Sparky Mark]

You could easily blow a 400 watt  cab with a 250 watt amplifier if you don't listen for distress. 

[TrevorG]

1 hour ago, Sparky Mark said:

You could easily blow a 400 watt  cab with a 250 watt amplifier if you don't listen for distress. 

Are you talking tube amps or solid state as well m

[Greg.Bassman]

2 hours ago, Sparky Mark said:

You could easily blow a 400 watt  cab with a 250 watt amplifier if you don't listen for distress. 

What constitutes as ‘distress’? Buzzing? Cutting out? Thin sounding? 

Forgive the daft sounding question, just making sure that inform myself as much as possible 😉

[Greg.Bassman]

1 hour ago, TrevorG said:

Are you talking tube amps or solid state as well m

Cheers for the feedback. To clarify, I use the solid state LM800.

[TrevorG]

7 hours ago, Greg.Bassman said:

Cheers for the feedback. To clarify, I use the solid state LM800.

Understood. I was wondering if Sparky Mark was referring to tube amps blowing higher rated cabs(as they are much louder than solid state).

[Sparky Mark]

A 300 watt solid state amplifier has the same power output as a 300 watt valve amp, it's the way that valve amps start to break up at their limit which makes them appear louder. A watt is a watt is a watt whether it's from a class A, AB or D or any other type of amp.

If you EQ a 250 watt amp with lots of lows (and hi if you want to blow the tweeter too) and push the volume too high you will hear what is best described as a farting/distorted sound. You may also hear a clicking sound as the voice coil bottoms out on the yoke (back plate) of the speaker. Square wave clipped distorted output from amps can damage speakers capable of handling many times more powerful clean (sine wave) signals. 

If you hear farting or hard clicks from your speaker then immediately back off the lows and some volume. Once you've blown your first speaker it'll become common sense. My first (and last) was when I destroyed an 18" PA sub with a Sound City 120 and my Shergold Marathon bass back in 1977. Lesson learned. 

 

[spongebob]

Traveler 102P is a seriously cool cab. Love mine. I went for the (slightly) more powerful 4 ohm version, as I had no intention of adding to it. They can DI me out if I need to stand in front of any more than 400w!

FWIW I used to run a 2x12 MB rig, and to my ears, the 2x10 is a lot more direct.

[TrevorG]

6 hours ago, Sparky Mark said:

A 300 watt solid state amplifier has the same power output as a 300 watt valve amp, it's the way that valve amps start to break up at their limit which makes them appear louder. A watt is a watt is a watt whether it's from a class A, AB or D or any other type of amp.

If you EQ a 250 watt amp with lots of lows (and hi if you want to blow the tweeter too) and push the volume too high you will hear what is best described as a farting/distorted sound. You may also hear a clicking sound as the voice coil bottoms out on the yoke (back plate) of the speaker. Square wave clipped distorted output from amps can damage speakers capable of handling many times more powerful clean (sine wave) signals. 

If you hear farting or hard clicks from your speaker then immediately back off the lows and some volume. Once you've blown your first speaker it'll become common sense. My first (and last) was when I destroyed an 18" PA sub with a Sound City 120 and my Shergold Marathon bass back in 1977. Lesson learned. 

 

Thank you. I have read most of this but misconstrued "apparent" to be "actual" volume. The "clipping" you mentioned... does that occur with regular playing or a snap connection between the string and the pickup?

Edited August 19, 2018 by TrevorG

[TrevorG]

2 hours ago, spongebob said:

Traveler 102P is a seriously cool cab. Love mine. I went for the (slightly) more powerful 4 ohm version, as I had no intention of adding to it. They can DI me out if I need to stand in front of any more than 400w!

FWIW I used to run a 2x12 MB rig, and to my ears, the 2x10 is a lot more direct.

Totally agree. My K1 has a 12"  driver which I love but along side the 102P it sounds deep and edgy. "With" the 102P there's a sweetness I've not heard on many other rigs.

[Greg.Bassman]

On 19/08/2018 at 13:31, spongebob said:

Traveler 102P is a seriously cool cab. Love mine. I went for the (slightly) more powerful 4 ohm version, as I had no intention of adding to it. They can DI me out if I need to stand in front of any more than 400w!

FWIW I used to run a 2x12 MB rig, and to my ears, the 2x10 is a lot more direct.

 

On 19/08/2018 at 15:47, TrevorG said:

Totally agree. My K1 has a 12"  driver which I love but along side the 102P it sounds deep and edgy. "With" the 102P there's a sweetness I've not heard on many other rigs.

Cool. Incidentally, I have a new york 122 in storage. I’ve often wondered how the traveler would compare. I kinda know what to expect tone wise, but how does the traveler hold up in terms of volume? I know that it isn’t going to be loud as the new york, or indeed the standard hr, but will it hold its own against a loud drummer regardless?

[TrevorG]

7 hours ago, Greg.Bassman said:

 

Cool. Incidentally, I have a new york 122 in storage. I’ve often wondered how the traveler would compare. I kinda know what to expect tone wise, but how does the traveler hold up in terms of volume? I know that it isn’t going to be loud as the new york, or indeed the standard hr, but will it hold its own against a loud drummer regardless?

Not used a 122 before so not sure. Only have one 12" driver in my K1 rated at 800RMS and the balance between them is great. No doubt the 4 Ohm version would be a little louder. What the 8 Ohm version "might" lack in volume it would make up for with a tone that can cut through the mix. Certainly the corresponding 102P combo is one of the loudest combos I've yet to try but I wouldn't like to underestimate the power of your 122.

[Sparky Mark]

On 19/08/2018 at 15:44, TrevorG said:

A 4 ohm version of a speaker is no more powerful or louder than its 8 ohm version, they simply present a different load on an amplifier. The speaker's thermal rating and sensitivity will be the same. With a 210 cab it's unlikely that a 4 ohm version could be driven any louder than its 8 ohm version when using a 500 watt at 4 ohm/300 watt at 8 ohm head. 

[TrevorG]

But the same head delivering 4 ohms instead of 8 into a 212 cab will do what?

[Sparky Mark]

An amp doesn't deliver an impedance, it sees that load which means it can deliver up to its maximum output. A 212 cab may be able to utilize more than the 300 watts if it isn't hitting its limits/maximum output already. Thermal ratings have little to do with volume, just how much heat the speaker can dissipate. A high sensitivity/efficient speaker will get loud with less power and then have to dissipate excess input energy as heat. A larger speaker should be able to move more air and dissipate more heat.