Yank Posted August 25, 2018 Share Posted August 25, 2018 Sure, there have been other great female soul singers, but as the song goes, "You can bet your boots, or you can put up your dukes" I'm sticking with Aretha! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowdown Posted August 25, 2018 Share Posted August 25, 2018 8 hours ago, bubinga5 said: If I asked 10 people randomly in the high street who they knew as a singer. Aretha Franklin or Anita Baker.? We know the answer to that. If you asked that question to 10 people in Somerset, yes, we would know the answer to that. "Did they both sing with the Wurzels?" 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikel Posted August 25, 2018 Share Posted August 25, 2018 10 hours ago, bubinga5 said: I always thought if I put" of course this is only my opinion"😀 it would take the controversy out of the post. its an open discussion. Surely all opinions on forums are just that, its a given. There are many artists on music who I believe to be average at best, but thats just my opinion and I try to keep " I dont agree with" posts to a minimum. She can be called the queen of soul because she made it popular and was lauded by her peers. You prefer someone else and that is your choice, the fact you are into soul music still dousnt make your opinion more relevant. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_b Posted August 25, 2018 Share Posted August 25, 2018 I'm not big on labels. They just cause endless hair splitting, as we are doing in this thread, but Soul in the 60's was a thing. With many influences and a level of creativity seldom seen since. Aretha was the best in that genre and for many since. I've seen Anita Baker described as R&B and Urban Soul. Not labels I know very well but I guess that's not the same thing. In reality both singers deserve as many superlatives as we can come up with. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGreek Posted August 25, 2018 Share Posted August 25, 2018 13 hours ago, bubinga5 said: I doubt a hullabaloo is going to sprout from this.. I could be very wrong I think you underestimate the BC Massive...😃😃 11 hours ago, lowdown said: Yeah, she is a terrific singer and certainly one of my favourite vocalists/musicians. But she certainly isn’t/wasn’t overlooked/unheard of. ‘The Rapture Album’ sold over 8 million copies, with two tracks receiving a Grammy each. There are over 30 of America’s finest session musicians and singers on that Album and it was a pretty big deal back in the 80’s. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rapture_(Anita_Baker_album) I had this on tape (remember that?) - I probably need to get it again in some other medium. 4 hours ago, AndyTravis said: I went to a James Brown gig once, it was bloody hard work. I can believe that. I've seen snippets of JB Live - always felt like a chore watching. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyTravis Posted August 25, 2018 Share Posted August 25, 2018 16 minutes ago, TheGreek said: I can believe that. I've seen snippets of JB Live - always felt like a chore watching. It was 45 minutes of introduction, he came on and intermittently squawked “HEY!” And “YEAH!” for about 20 minutes. The band and backing singers did all the Work. luckily I didn’t pay to see him. ”THE HARDEST WORKING MAN IN SOUL” how? He seemed to be on a good screw for doing nowt... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wateroftyne Posted August 25, 2018 Share Posted August 25, 2018 (edited) There are a lot of queens reigning in countries around the world. I imagine most of them are well respected, and do lots of great stuff. Also, some are more well-known than others. In those terms, Aretha is Queen Elizabeth II. Edited August 25, 2018 by wateroftyne Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ambient Posted August 25, 2018 Share Posted August 25, 2018 Isn’t the ‘queen’ title there because of the longevity of her career, and the massive influence she had on so many during her time? She didn’t just appear and then disappear just as fast. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stewblack Posted August 25, 2018 Share Posted August 25, 2018 Why don't folk who disagree with the OP just nominate their fave soul singers? That way I might discover someone I'd previously not known then this would be an extremely useful thread, which would in turn placate those who think it worth contributing to what they see as a pointless thread. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGreek Posted August 25, 2018 Share Posted August 25, 2018 1 hour ago, wateroftyne said: There are a lot of queens reigning in countries around the world. I imagine most of them are well respected, and do lots of great stuff. Also, some are more well-known than others. Elton John? 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SubsonicSimpleton Posted August 25, 2018 Share Posted August 25, 2018 I think that it is important to look at the question with reference to the situation in America at the time she was first referred to as "the queen of soul"; Was this a label she was given by the black community in celebration of her undeniable talent, or was it a label promoted by the white establishment who couldn't sweep her under the carpet in a time of racial segregation in society, the music charts and radio stations, but still tried to diminish her greatness by emphasising her blackness and implying inferiority - I suspect that the mainstream US media wanted Dusty Springfield to be the queen of soul, much like Elvis was the king of rock and roll (despite being not a patch on Little Richard and Chuch Berry IMHO) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGreek Posted August 25, 2018 Share Posted August 25, 2018 1 minute ago, stewblack said: Why don't folk who disagree with the OP just nominate their fave soul singers? That way I might discover someone I'd previously not known then this would be an extremely useful thread, which would in turn placate those who think it worth contributing to what they see as a pointless thread. I love Randy Crawford and would dearly like to nominate her for this title but recognise that this would really be based on 1 album (Secret Combination) plus "One Day I'll Fly Away". Still a great voice. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EssentialTension Posted August 25, 2018 Share Posted August 25, 2018 I googled 'Queen of Soul' and apparently it's definitely Aretha Franklin. 🤪 1 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bubinga5 Posted August 25, 2018 Author Share Posted August 25, 2018 6 hours ago, Mickeyboro said: Pointless thread... Yeah maybe, but at least it gets people talking about great music. I worry when I see threads that ask "which way should I point the knobs on my bass for it to be aesthetically pleasing".. 1 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ambient Posted August 25, 2018 Share Posted August 25, 2018 1 hour ago, stewblack said: Why don't folk who disagree with the OP just nominate their fave soul singers? That way I might discover someone I'd previously not known then this would be an extremely useful thread, which would in turn placate those who think it worth contributing to what they see as a pointless thread. I think there’s an awful lot of crossover with singers anyway, what one person would class as soul someone else would describe as pop. To me at least soul is heavily blues influenced, I’d have described most of the singers mentioned as alternatives to the role as ‘queen of soul’ as being pop singers, for me at least they don’t fulfil the remit for being soul singers. Is Motown soul? I’d argue no, it’s pop; it doesn’t have the earthiness of soul. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silverfoxnik Posted August 25, 2018 Share Posted August 25, 2018 Aretha's place as one of the all time greats is assured, and some certainly think of her as the greatest female vocalist of all time (within popular music of the last 50 or 60 years).. There are other female singers out there who mean more to me, but in the end that's only my personal taste. And in the end, that's what it comes down to - which singer, songwriter, band etc, etc, connects with us the most. Bit out of context and a tad sexist maybe, but that Arsene Wenger quote from a few years ago sums it up... 'Everyone thinks they have the prettiest wife at home..' We're just lucky to have / had so many to choose from.. ☺ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Misowaki Posted August 25, 2018 Share Posted August 25, 2018 28 minutes ago, ambient said: Is Motown soul? I’d argue no, it’s pop; it doesn’t have the earthiness of soul. Uhh... Just... wait, it's gonna take me a long time to get my head around this one... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ambient Posted August 25, 2018 Share Posted August 25, 2018 (edited) 15 minutes ago, Misowaki said: Uhh... Just... wait, it's gonna take me a long time to get my head around this one... I would say that Motown derived from soul, Motown itself isn’t soul. Soul itself derived from gospel, jazz and blues. I am of course probably totally wrong, I personally dislike most popular music, my posting is just based on what I picked up in the musicology module at uni, when I could stay awake 😊. Edited August 25, 2018 by ambient Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Misowaki Posted August 25, 2018 Share Posted August 25, 2018 (edited) But Motown's a record label that put out loads of some, if not most of the most widely recognised Soul music regardless of whichever exceedingly specific boxes people like to use... You know what, to paraphrase you, horses for courses. I'm gonna leave it there. Edited August 25, 2018 by Misowaki Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EssentialTension Posted August 25, 2018 Share Posted August 25, 2018 (edited) 42 minutes ago, ambient said: ... Is Motown soul? ... One of the several labels that made up the Motown roster of labels was in fact called SOUL ... Are you also going to say the the Funk Brothers weren't funky? Edited August 25, 2018 by EssentialTension Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bubinga5 Posted August 25, 2018 Author Share Posted August 25, 2018 Was Motown a genre or a record company.? Im sure it was the latter, but I'm open to be educated Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Misowaki Posted August 25, 2018 Share Posted August 25, 2018 23 minutes ago, bubinga5 said: Was Motown a genre or a record company.? Im sure it was the latter, but I'm open to be educated Given that it was a record label, I'd be willing to put money on saying it was/still is a record label. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ambient Posted August 25, 2018 Share Posted August 25, 2018 2 minutes ago, bubinga5 said: Was Motown a genre or a record company.? Im sure it was the latter, but I'm open to be educated But what they produced, was it pop or soul? i did say I’m probably completely wrong, anything like this is anathema to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EssentialTension Posted August 25, 2018 Share Posted August 25, 2018 (edited) 8 minutes ago, bubinga5 said: Was Motown a genre or a record company.? Im sure it was the latter, but I'm open to be educated It was about a dozen labels operated by one company. Tamla was the originial label, Motown as a label came second. Other labels included Soul, Gordy, etc. I think, in the UK the label was issued initially as Oriole, then as $tateside (an EMI label), then as Tamla-Motown (also EMI). I just checked and before Oriole, the UK issues were London American (a Decca label) and then Fontana (a Phillips label) Edited August 25, 2018 by EssentialTension Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EssentialTension Posted August 25, 2018 Share Posted August 25, 2018 6 minutes ago, ambient said: But what they produced, was it pop or soul? i did say I’m probably completely wrong, anything like this is anathema to me. It seems very odd to me to reduce the likes of Stevie Wonder, Marvin Gaye, Smokey Robinson, and many others to 'pop' even if it was extremely popular. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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