MacDaddy Posted August 31, 2018 Share Posted August 31, 2018 (edited) Do your recorded bass lines have to be recorded by yourself, or even real bass? I'm old school, in that back in the day being able to nail the bass in the studio meant reducing I how much I cost my part of the recording. But these days I tend to agree with the Tony Visconti quote (to Clem Burke when recording Heart of Glass) "we're making a record, we're not documenting a live gig". Rick Savage admits most of Def Leppards bass parts were done by a sequencer, and Gene Simmons has always been happy to say he doesn't necessarily play on every Kiss song. So, does it matter to you? Edited October 2, 2018 by MacDaddy getting my Rick's mixed up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_b Posted August 31, 2018 Share Posted August 31, 2018 Yes. Very much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grangur Posted August 31, 2018 Share Posted August 31, 2018 (edited) Can't say about my own bass lines, but when I've listened to Jamiroquai, to catch the revered bass lines to learn from a master of the art, the more I listen, the more I'm convinced they're not done on a bass. In places they're ok, but at other times they're too repetitive and too spot-on accurate repetitive. They MUST be a drum machine or something similar. It's then I stopped listening and I feel cheated. Sorry if this isn't seen by others as answering the same question. Edited August 31, 2018 by Grangur Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discreet Posted August 31, 2018 Share Posted August 31, 2018 (edited) If it has been decided that I'm playing bass on a recording, then I'm VERY bothered about it, it matters very much and I will take the trouble to make it as good as it can be. Of course I expect the same level of attention to detail from everyone else involved. Get in the fecking pocket, you bastards! But I'm absolutely not precious about having 'real'' bass on a recording if a synth bass, or a sampled or sequenced or programmed bass is more appropriate for the song. Just as long as it's not too difficult to make a decent fist of it live, by whatever means. Edited August 31, 2018 by discreet 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulWarning Posted August 31, 2018 Share Posted August 31, 2018 when we made our last album I jokingly said (many a true word said in jest) that I only have to get it right once during the song then the engineer can cut and paste to the rest of it, and this did happen to get rid of one or two mistakes on otherwise good takes Must admit though I'd be annoyed if I hadn't played anything on my own songs at least. But is using drum machines and bass sequencers any different from using session musicians instead of band members? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigRedX Posted August 31, 2018 Share Posted August 31, 2018 I'm a songwriter first, a producer second and a musician a very distant third. So for me the most important thing is to get the best possible production and arrangement of the recorded song, by whatever means necessary. The various parts of the song are still my ideas even if I didn't actually play them. If someone else can play it better than me that's great. If a sequencer can do a better job that's also great. I have nothing against anything from moving/replacing a few duff notes, chopping up the bass part into its constituent notes and groove quantising it to the drums, or replacing the bass completely with a synth played or sequenced (I've done them all). Whatever give me the right end result for the song and the recording. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_b Posted August 31, 2018 Share Posted August 31, 2018 I know it was a fact of life in the early days that "producers" thought band members were dispensable and disposable, but I totally disagree with the arrogance of the likes of Toni Visconti and others who seem to think a record being made by a band isn't about capturing the sound and chemistry of the members of that band. They'd have to be paying me millions to make me accept that the band thought I was good enough for the gig but not good enough for the records. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Jack Posted August 31, 2018 Share Posted August 31, 2018 It matters a lot to me - not that I've done that many recordings. Seven years ago we decided to record our NYE gig in order to put together a showreel. One of the songs that featured was Play That Funky Music, especially the guitar solo with me playing an impeccable funk riff beneath it all the way through. Trouble was, I knew damned well that I'd screwed up that riff several times on the night. Sure enough, the BL (who happens to be a pro video editor) had isolated one of the few occasions I'd got it bang on, and then he'd simply treated that as a sample throughout. Despite lots of jocularity and band banter ensuing, I was genuinely whizzed off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EliasMooseblaster Posted August 31, 2018 Share Posted August 31, 2018 Perhaps it's one of the privileges of playing with a band that's typically recorded as many parts together as possible. It's nice to be able to vary the line a bit, and the fills always work best if they play off what the drums and guitar are doing. I think you'd have to put in an awful lot of effort to recreate that feel with a sequencer...possibly even enough effort that it would just be easier to set up the mics and record the band playing it! It's probably worth admitting that I'm not completely precious about it: I'm happy for engineer to edit out the odd bum note here and there, or let me "punch in" to replace a shonky couple of bars - god knows studio time is expensive, and those would be quicker than me insisting that my 15th attempt from the top will be a perfect take! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul_5 Posted August 31, 2018 Share Posted August 31, 2018 Yes. I’m miffed off with myself if I need more than 2 or 3 takes. On the other hand I’ve had studio gigs where I’ve just jammed over tunes (at the producer’s request) so that they had enough to comp together for a samples and looped bass line. Depends on the project really. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cat Burrito Posted August 31, 2018 Share Posted August 31, 2018 I suppose I've done a lot of recording over the last 30 years and I know stories of other players who have had their parts replaced when they have left the studio. To the best of my knowledge this has not happened to me. It's important to me that the recording reflects the band so I want it to be my playing. Simple as that really. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adamg67 Posted September 1, 2018 Share Posted September 1, 2018 I like to think I can get more expression playing something than programming it, so I’d always play it live. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skol303 Posted September 2, 2018 Share Posted September 2, 2018 Very bothered 🙂 As someone who doesn't play in a band, recorded material is my only outlet for my bass playing. So it's the one instrument I never emulate. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lozz196 Posted September 2, 2018 Share Posted September 2, 2018 Very important to me, being old-school I like to do a whole take in one, though appreciate that nowadays having the technology to be able to drop in saves a lot of time so will happily do it. Another thing that is really important for me is being present during the mixing to make sure the sound/tone I`ve recorded is used. Luckily our producer totally gets our band and the style of music we do, but I have had that "don`t worry, I`ll get you a great sound" comment in the past. As such I like to make sure that my sound - and that of the other instruments - is kept as it was recorded. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wateroftyne Posted September 2, 2018 Share Posted September 2, 2018 On 31/08/2018 at 13:53, MacDaddy said: Rick Allen admits most of Def Leppards bass parts were done by a sequencer, and Gene Simmons has always been happy to say he doesn't necessarily play on every Kiss song. Oh no. That's totally ruined my enjoyment of Def Leppard and Kiss. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevsy71 Posted September 7, 2018 Share Posted September 7, 2018 Very bothered - even when I'm just on the home DAW. For our only EP I practiced flat out for two weeks before. Made one blatant mistake on the day; a fumble of a fast 8-note lick that I got right for the other 39 bars it featured. Couldn't get back to re-record it but was not too ashamed at having it copy-and-pasted for that one glitch. Very pleased with the recorded tone too, again a lot of tweaking leading up to the recording during the band practices. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rollin Thunder Posted September 11, 2018 Share Posted September 11, 2018 On 02/09/2018 at 12:56, wateroftyne said: Oh no. That's totally ruined my enjoyment of Def Leppard and Kiss. Sarcy, With regards def leppard, Rick Savage plays bass by the way Rick Allen drums. Most of Hysteria album was bass samples and sequencers, I have tried to play gods of war bass line, and can play it pretty well, but never going to get it right as it's a synth bass and absolute no string noise what so ever, still a great bass line. Pretty much all other def leppard albums all bass is real. And certainly is live. love kiss but yeah pretty much apart from early stuff don't reckon too much bass in studio is Gene Simmons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank Blank Posted September 11, 2018 Share Posted September 11, 2018 I want the recording to be me, my bass, my tone along with my playing idiosyncrasies. That having been said I’m not averse to taking a good verse or chorus of Saturday d playing and dropping the good ones in, I doo feel a bit odd about it but I don’t really think I’m good enough, or consistent enough to get the takes in one, by the time I’ve played it enough to get consistency I’m so knackered the vibe has gone out of the song. There’s an excitement live of only getting one shot at it but I want a recording to be a document. I’m not averse to leaving mistakes in if it’s a good take, by that I mean a take that conveys the things I’m trying to impart with the song, to me the technical proficiency of the bass line is secondary to the feeling I want to get over. I’m an old punk so I don’t want to be virtuosic, I’m barely bothered about being proficient. I seem to remember extracting a particularly dug in bogey on stage one evening, no one noticed, I just played open dropped D until the b45t4rd was out, we still rocked the joint. Btw the particular concept I was trying to get over with this track was, I’m an unpleasant son of a Gündersson. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rubbersoul Posted October 1, 2018 Share Posted October 1, 2018 I’m a bass player. If my band is making a recording you’re damn right I’m playing on it. How can I get any pleasure from the finished product otherwise? A wee bit of minor copy / paste is ok in my book for the sake of expedience but it will be me playing nevertheless. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacDaddy Posted October 2, 2018 Author Share Posted October 2, 2018 On 11/09/2018 at 18:33, Rollin Thunder said: Sarcy, With regards def leppard, Rick Savage plays bass by the way Rick Allen drums. Most of Hysteria album was bass samples and sequencers, I have tried to play gods of war bass line, and can play it pretty well, but never going to get it right as it's a synth bass and absolute no string noise what so ever, still a great bass line. Pretty much all other def leppard albums all bass is real. And certainly is live. love kiss but yeah pretty much apart from early stuff don't reckon too much bass in studio is Gene Simmons. doh! Don't know one Rick from the other. Edited. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheddatom Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 On 31/08/2018 at 14:45, Happy Jack said: It matters a lot to me - not that I've done that many recordings. Seven years ago we decided to record our NYE gig in order to put together a showreel. One of the songs that featured was Play That Funky Music, especially the guitar solo with me playing an impeccable funk riff beneath it all the way through. Trouble was, I knew damned well that I'd screwed up that riff several times on the night. Sure enough, the BL (who happens to be a pro video editor) had isolated one of the few occasions I'd got it bang on, and then he'd simply treated that as a sample throughout. Despite lots of jocularity and band banter ensuing, I was genuinely whizzed off. It was to be used as a showreel and you'd rather him keep your f-ups on it? For me it really depends on the band/song. Some bands I record them all live in the same room and keep all the imperfections. Other bands I record them all separately and edit it until it might as well have been sequenced. For my own songs, I'll generally record one of each repetition and double or quadruple that, on guitar and bass, then do drums and any solos as proper takes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discreet Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 15 minutes ago, cheddatom said: For me it really depends on the band/song. Some bands I record them all live in the same room and keep all the imperfections. Other bands I record them all separately and edit it until it might as well have been sequenced. For my own songs, I'll generally record one of each repetition and double or quadruple that, on guitar and bass, then do drums and any solos as proper takes. Absolutely, it's whatever works for the song. If you let fluffs and guffs through, even small ones, you know they're there and for you, the final result will forever be unlistenable. Get it right! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Jack Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 1 hour ago, cheddatom said: It was to be used as a showreel and you'd rather him keep your f-ups on it? Come on Tom, you have to be better than that. It was a 3-hour gig where we played nearly 50 songs. Do you really imagine that he needed to choose the one song where I screwed up? Or that he shouldn't have checked with me first? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discreet Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 4 minutes ago, Happy Jack said: It was a 3-hour gig where we played nearly 50 songs. Do you really imagine that he needed to choose the one song where I screwed up? Or that he shouldn't have checked with me first? Yes, that does make a big difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheddatom Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 15 minutes ago, Happy Jack said: Come on Tom, you have to be better than that. It was a 3-hour gig where we played nearly 50 songs. Do you really imagine that he needed to choose the one song where I screwed up? Or that he shouldn't have checked with me first? Fair enough, I didn't know the story behind the decision making, just don't see the problem Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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