When producers nause things up

[Barking Spiders]

The thread on overplaying made me think a lot of the fault lies with producers rather than players. Often I hear the kernal of a great song only for it to be ruined by OTT orchestration, leaden drumming to the fore , inappropriate metal widdling in dance songs etc etc. One of the worst examples has to be the hit version of Sound of Silence  when the drums come in. Up to that point of course it's a great tune but for me the drums and kitchen sink the producer throws in ruin it. I also think Beat It would've been a better tune if the van Halen solo had been left out. I think Quincy Jones and MJ had a bit of a lapse there. So, what other  essentially fine songs do you reckon have been mullered by inappropriate production?

[ambient]

I don’t think beat it would have been anywhere near as good or as successful without Van Halen’s solo.

Often it’s down not so much to the producer but to him pandering to the A&R people who want it to sound like something it’s probably not written to sound like, just so that it sells more, which I guess is the point.

[casapete]

5 minutes ago, ambient said:

I don’t think beat it would have been anywhere near as good or as successful without Van Halen’s solo.

Definitely, although I do feel after the brilliance of the solo the song dips a bit and struggles to maintain the drive and energy it creates.

[Barking Spiders]

1 minute ago, ambient said:

I don’t think beat it would have been anywhere near as good or as successful without Van Halen’s solo.

Often it’s down not so much to the producer but to him pandering to the A&R people who want it to sound like something it’s probably not written to sound like, just so that it sells more, which I guess is the point.

each to their own but I don't like the sounds of most metal/hard rock guitar solos. Love brain slamming riffage from the likes of Rammstein and Lamb of God but not trebly widdling .Prefer more jazzy, funk tones and the sounds Dave Gilmour gets even though I'm no PF fan. 

[Jus Lukin]

-

Edited February 27, 2022 by Jus Lukin

[Lozz196]

A lot may also be down to record company wants/requirements to fit a certain format. A band I know have signed to a company recently and already the company are offering their guidance on stagecraft etc. Nothing wrong with that, they are the ones who are investing, but it does make me wonder how much influence over sounds/image/recordings/performance etc that the companies exert.

[Cat Burrito]

36 minutes ago, Barking Spiders said:

So, what other  essentially fine songs do you reckon have been mullered by inappropriate production?

A lot of the 80s! Reverb on snare drums, chorus on bass - a lot of great stuff sounds very dated now and not in a good way like some of those earlier recordings.

I think the 80s was responsible for a huge leap in technical advances but sometimes the kit was used as overkill and hadn't fully developed its potential.

[discreet]

1 hour ago, Barking Spiders said:

The thread on overplaying made me think a lot of the fault lies with producers rather than players. Often I hear the kernal of a great song only for it to be ruined by OTT orchestration, leaden drumming to the fore , inappropriate metal widdling in dance songs etc etc. One of the worst examples has to be the hit version of Sound of Silence  when the drums come in. Up to that point of course it's a great tune but for me the drums and kitchen sink the producer throws in ruin it. I also think Beat It would've been a better tune if the van Halen solo had been left out. I think Quincy Jones and MJ had a bit of a lapse there. So, what other  essentially fine songs do you reckon have been mullered by inappropriate production?

Agree in principle, but Van Halen's solo on Beat It is to die for. Quincy and Michael Jackson can do no wrong afaic. Not quite as impressed with Phil Spector's work on 'Let It Be', however. That was definitely gilding the lily.

[AdrianP]

Back in the day, one of my guilty pleasure bands was Evanescence. Particularly the Fallen album. Really loved the guitar riffs on it, plus Amy Lee's appealing vocals. But, my god, was it over produced. Orchestrals. Strings. Pianos. Hosts of angelic choirs. The whole kitchen sink chucked into just about every song. Felt like what an album produced by Michael Bay might sound like.

[Graham]

I listened to Kate Nash's big single - Foundations the other day, when I realised she was the English one in GLOW. It struck me it's a pretty decent song that was probably written on piano or acoustic guitar, but has been "produced" to within an inch of it's life with a load of unnecessary layers and orchestration.

[chris_b]

+1 on the 80's drum sound.

[Sibob]

2 hours ago, Barking Spiders said:

I also think Beat It would've been a better tune if the van Halen solo had been left out.

Said no-one ever lol

Si

[Monkey Steve]

I got the reissues of all of the Scorpions early/classic albums.  There was a time before Winds of Change that they were a seriously good metal band and the run of albums from Lovedrive to Blackout are some of my favourite albums of all time.

But what becomes apparent reading the booklets and listening to the interviews with the band is that he move to producing awful, radio friendly AOR music was all down to the producer Dieter Dierks looking at Def Leppard's album sales and deciding that we wanted to have a go at producing a Mutt Lange style album

[Skol303]

1 hour ago, chris_b said:

+1 on the 80's drum sound.

See... 80s drum sounds (and that classic snare) are a bit of guilty pleasure for me  

I don't think I've ever used anything similar on my own material, but I think those now retro drums do still have a place on some tracks.

[Dad3353]

8 minutes ago, Skol303 said:

... those now retro drums do still have a place on some tracks.

I agree. The tracks of a bulldozer. 

[Hobbayne]

Phil Spectors' Wall Of Sound on The Beatles "Long & Winding Road" is a famous example of overproduction. With its wailing choir and flailing violins.

I, personally don't mind it. The original unadorned version is just another bland piano ballad with a disastrous bass line.

REM got Stephen Hague to produce their debut album album and hated it.

What worked with New Order and OMD was not suitable and his synth pop style was out of its depth in a jangly college rock band.

 

Edited September 5, 2018 by Hobbayne