eBay Conundrum

[ZilchWoolham]

I posted this over at Guitarchat, but since it isn't very densely populated at the moment, I thought I'd take the liberty to post it here as well. 

Recently I bought a used/vintage Martin (over 46 years old but not quite vintage by Martin standards) on eBay. This particular model is braced for, and to be strung with, either nylon or silk and steel strings (or compound strings as they're called in the old catalogues) and I noticed from the images in the listing that the owner, as most people do, had it strung up with bronze strings. I notified him of this, in as friendly a manner as possible, in a message and asked if he had noticed any bowing or damage as a result of the higher tension strings. He told me he hadn't and that he played it down-tuned with a nice low action. Finding the price reasonable I bought the guitar. 

The listing had not included any close-up images of the bridge, and I, rather foolishly had not asked for any. When it arrived and I strung it up with silk and steel strings, I immediately noticed some issues. The strings had really dug into the bridge quite hard, leaving noticeable wear and small cracks by the bridge pins. More importantly, the saddle has at some point been sanded down and is basically flush with the bridge. This probably wasn't an issue with bronze strings, but with the silk and steel strings it was actually made for back in 1972, there is significant buzzing coming, not from the frets, but from the strings hitting the bridge as the saddle isn't giving them enough height. In standard tuning, it's mostly noticeable when hitting the strings forcefully, but it's unplayable in, for example, DADGAD. 

So, what is the best course of action at this point? It's clear that I need to have a new saddle fitted and slotted, and while a bone saddle isn't expensive, it's something I need a luthier to do for me, as I have neither confidence nor competence nor tools to do it myself. (I also have a fear that doing so will raise the action to an uncomfortable level, but it should be said that I haven't noticed any bowing in the neck or soundboard, with my untrained eyes anyways.) Should I let this go or is it reasonable to request some sort of compensation from the seller? 

Cheers!

[yorks5stringer]

I seem to recall when I worked at a luthiers , he regularly took in old martin and gibson guitars  to repair where there was no more relief in the neck. What happens over the years is the top of the guitar gradually moves vertically, so the bridge  saddle and often the bridge get shaved to reduce the gap back down. I don't know if that is what you describe  but it's something that just happens to old guitars due to the pull of the strings. He used to reset the neck by steaming it out ( often not an easy job if someone had done it before and not used the correct glue afterwards), re-set the angle and often fit a new bridge too. You could check yourself  if the top of the guitar is fairly flat or if it has started to bulb outwards?

If you look at Dan Erlewine's Youtube channel he'll doubtless have a quick tutorial showing the issue.

[jonno1981]

Replacing a saddle falls into a standard acoustic setup for most luthiers. It’s a cost  of up to £50-60 inc parts although I imagine this varies due to complications/ region etc. 

Ive found that trying to discuss setup issues with any seller really difficult when trying to ascertain the playability of an instrument. It’s all so subjective down to the players expectations and playing style. I’ve never bought anything described as playing well that didn’t arrive requiring some amount of tweaking that would fall into the broad category of a setup. Depending on how much you paid for it this might be one you have to swallow up. I think I would in the circumstances unless it requires any more serious tech work. 

Id see it as a minor investment into the potential enjoyment of owning the guitar. A luthier might well be able to make it play better than it ever did for any of its previous owners! 

[KiOgon]

Buying a nearly 50 year old Martin is never going to be hassle free, suck it up, go to a decent luthier, new saddle and a decent setup, you'll have yourself a superb guitar!

[fleabag]

What KiO said 

[ZilchWoolham]

16 hours ago, jonno1981 said:

Replacing a saddle falls into a standard acoustic setup for most luthiers. It’s a cost  of up to £50-60 inc parts although I imagine this varies due to complications/ region etc. 

Ive found that trying to discuss setup issues with any seller really difficult when trying to ascertain the playability of an instrument. It’s all so subjective down to the players expectations and playing style. I’ve never bought anything described as playing well that didn’t arrive requiring some amount of tweaking that would fall into the broad category of a setup. Depending on how much you paid for it this might be one you have to swallow up. I think I would in the circumstances unless it requires any more serious tech work. 

Id see it as a minor investment into the potential enjoyment of owning the guitar. A luthier might well be able to make it play better than it ever did for any of its previous owners! 

 

16 hours ago, KiOgon said:

Buying a nearly 50 year old Martin is never going to be hassle free, suck it up, go to a decent luthier, new saddle and a decent setup, you'll have yourself a superb guitar!

Yes, I'm thinking along these lines, too. My concern is that the luthier might inform me of a more substantial problem, i.e. the guitar needing a neck reset, or the soundboard not being level (it doesn't seem like it from just looking at it, though). In that case it might be better to see if I can return it. Hopefully that won't be the case, though. I'll take it to a luthier and he'll probably be able to tell what work has to be done, before he does it.

Thanks!

Edited September 23, 2018 by ZilchWoolham

[PatrickJ]

4 hours ago, ZilchWoolham said:

 

Yes, I'm thinking along these lines, too. My concern is that the luthier might inform me of a more substantial problem, i.e. the guitar needing a neck reset, or the soundboard not being level (it doesn't seem like it from just looking at it, though). In that case it might be better to see if I can return it. Hopefully that won't be the case, though. I'll take it to a luthier and he'll probably be able to tell what work has to be done, before he does it.

Thanks!

If it was me, I'd take it to a luthier and get it checked out in the first instance.  I'd inform the seller of my  concerns and that I was doing this.  If the luthier highlights a significant problem I'd go back to the seller then and look at returning it.  If it's just a case of a setup and its relativey inexpensive I'd pay for the repair and make an appropriate comment in the feedback I leave.

Edited September 23, 2018 by PJ-Bassist

[TheGreek]

I believe that feedback should be honest and reflect what actually happened in the transaction - not just an a55 kissing exercise or a nondescript bland statement which means nothing.

If there is a fault let people know..only fair on future buyers.

[taunton-hobbit]

Ebay is very sniffy about adverse feedback - just sayin' ............

😎

[fleabag]

Ebay only has a problem with feedback if it's insulting or rude.  If a seller didn't perform, or sent duff rubbish,  appropriate feedback can be left, but attacks / rude / insults can be removed.

Of course, a seller cannot leave anything but good feedback for a buyer, as we all know