What Killed Rock & Roll?

[skankdelvar]

1 hour ago, PaulWarning said:

of course one of the reasons Rap might be popular is precisely because it upsets so many middle aged fuddy duddy's, as did Elvis in the mid 50's

Quite so, though we should not ignore the contributory nature of established male mating rituals when it comes to matters of presentation.

Rappers are rather like those chaps of one's youth who upon encountering an attractive woman would proceed to do handstands or knock tennis balls all over the landscape. In short, they swagger and show off in manly fashion, this - as they freely admit - in the expectation of a tsunami of punani. 

By contrast, young rock performers today are like those bookish, bespectacled fellows of the 1930's, all pale and doomed, quoting Auden and Trotsky, and expatiating about the plight of the international working man. By assuming a weedy demeanour these types endeavour to convey the impression that they are un-threatening and trustworthy, and were they to be invited back for 'coffee' they would sit nervously on the edge of their seats and mumble diffidently about kittens and knitting. All self-serving guff, of course, unless they actually mean it, in which case their genetic line will come to a dead stop and the problem will solve itself.

In days of yore, rock performers conformed broadly to two paradigms, these best exemplified in the respective stage personas of Mr Ronald 'Bon' Scott and his successor Mr Brian Johnson. One was described as 'a lascivious pirate', the other as 'a randy bricklayer'. No prizes for guessing who was which.

Mr Robert Plant was / is an interesting conflation of the Scott model and a modified Pastoralist. One minute he'd be singing about his unfeasibly large penis, the next about fairy queens in hedge rows, thus demonstrating both his masculinity and his sensitivity, a shrewd strategy which enabled him to maximise his chances of docking. In this respect, today's rappers are missing a trick; were they to throw in some stuff about Hobbits or the Misty Mountains they'd get even more than they're already getting. Fact.

Edited October 1, 2018 by skankdelvar

[SubsonicSimpleton]

1 hour ago, cetera said:

 

I never said anything about 'economic dominance'. All that shows is the spending power of a large demographic.
The subject is 'What (if anything) killed rock 'n' roll?'

You claimed that rap music that is disrespectful to women is very popular, I expressed the opinion that MTV bling 'n' beaches rap is largely irrelevant to the general poulation of this planet beyond 12 year old virgins with no access to pornhub and backed it up with some evidence.

In Rick Beato's video, one of the main discussion points is that everyone is fed up with music that has been quantised and tuned to the point it resembles a processed cheese slice, and the reluctance of the music industry to take risks on music that still contains human imperfections is at the root of the problem - look at the list, both in terms of the artists on it and the detail of their incomes and draw your own conclusions.

[dmccombe7]

Its all getting a bit too in-depth and descriptive for me. This could be leading into Frasier Crane territory 

Dave

[Bridgehouse]

Just now, dmccombe7 said:

Its all getting a bit too in-depth and descriptive for me. This could be leading into Frasier Crane territory 

Dave

I'm not sure I even know what Rock n Roll is.....

[dmccombe7]

1 minute ago, Bridgehouse said:

I'm not sure I even know what Rock n Roll is.....

All before my time 

Its Blues i think

Edited October 1, 2018 by dmccombe7

[Bridgehouse]

1 minute ago, dmccombe7 said:

All before my time 

Its Blues i think

Really? I'll pass then...

[skankdelvar]

30 minutes ago, SubsonicSimpleton said:

You claimed that rap music that is disrespectful to women is very popular, I expressed the opinion that MTV bling 'n' beaches rap is largely irrelevant to the general poulation of this planet beyond 12 year old virgins with no access to pornhub and backed it up with some evidence.

 These two opinions are not mutually exclusive

30 minutes ago, SubsonicSimpleton said:

... look at the list, both in terms of the artists on it and the detail of their incomes and draw your own conclusions.

The things that struck me about the list were:

* Only 22 of the top 50 billing artists were Rock, of whom 14 are legacy acts - Springsteen, U2, Metallica, etc. Most of the 'newer acts' date from the late 20th century or the early noughties while only two could be reasonably described as 'new'. Further evidence that Rock is curling up at the edges like a stale sandwich.

* The highest billing act U2 grossed a mere $1.7m in recorded music sales but $52m from touring. This sort of disproportionate ratio seems to be the norm all the way down the list and - given that tours are now basically greatest hits packages - suggests that the real money is in hawking one's back catalogue round the boonies rather than recording new offerings.

 

Edited October 1, 2018 by skankdelvar

[dmccombe7]

I would add that concert ticket prices have gone up considerably compared to album prices whether that be vinyl, cd or streaming. 

Going back to 70's an album would cost almost the same price as some concert tickets. These days an album is circa £10 compared to a minimum £50 for a concert ticket hence more income from concerts. 

Dave

Edited October 1, 2018 by dmccombe7

[skankdelvar]

56 minutes ago, Bridgehouse said:

I'm not sure I even know what Rock n Roll is.....

 

Here's my handy cut out and keep guide to the genealogy of Rock'n'Roll:

[Bridgehouse]

1 minute ago, skankdelvar said:

 

Here's my handy cut out and keep guide to the genealogy of Rock'n'Roll:

I’m not sure I even know what rock n roll is...

[skankdelvar]

4 minutes ago, Bridgehouse said:

I’m not sure I even know what rock n roll is...

Frank Sinatra defined rock n roll as: 

"the most brutal, ugly, degenerate, vicious form of expression it has been my displeasure to hear...

“It fosters almost totally negative and destructive reactions in young people. It smells phony and false. It is sung, played and written for the most part by cretinous goons and by means of its almost imbecilic reiterations and sly, lewd—in plain fact dirty—lyrics, and as I said before, it manages to be the martial music of every side-burned delinquent on the face of the earth'.

[Bridgehouse]

1 minute ago, skankdelvar said:

Frank Sinatra defined rock n roll as: 

"the most brutal, ugly, degenerate, vicious form of expression it has been my displeasure to hear...

“It fosters almost totally negative and destructive reactions in young people. It smells phony and false. It is sung, played and written for the most part by cretinous goons and by means of its almost imbecilic reiterations and sly, lewd—in plain fact dirty—lyrics, and as I said before, it manages to be the martial music of every side-burned delinquent on the face of the earth'.

I’m not sure I even know what.... nevermind

[dmccombe7]

15 minutes ago, skankdelvar said:

 

Here's my handy cut out and keep guide to the genealogy of Rock'n'Roll:

Brilliant 

[TheGreek]

15 minutes ago, skankdelvar said:

Frank Sinatra defined rock n roll as: 

"the most brutal, ugly, degenerate, vicious form of expression it has been my displeasure to hear...

“It fosters almost totally negative and destructive reactions in young people. It smells phoney and false. It is sung, played and written for the most part by cretinous goons and by means of its almost imbecilic reiterations and sly, lewd—in plain fact dirty—lyrics, and as I said before, it manages to be the martial music of every side-burned delinquent on the face of the earth'.

I'm sure this could be used to define every form of music since - Punk, metal, Grunge, Rap....you name it.

[skankdelvar]

28 minutes ago, TheGreek said:

I'm sure this could be used to define every form of music since - Punk, metal, Grunge, Rap....you name it.

Frank Sinatra on rock n roll: '...the most brutal, ugly, degenerate, vicious form of expression'
Bing Crosby on Frank Sinatra: 'A jumped-up, oleaginous goombah who wriggles his filthy hips for the bobby-soxers and utterly devoid of morals'
Rudy Vallee on Bing Crosby: 'A slick, crooning snake in the grass preying on muddle-headed American womanhood'.
Al Jolson on Rudy Vallee: (Holds finger and thumb a millimeter apart) - 'This much talent and thoroughly evil'
Dame Nellie Melba on Al Jolson: 'A foul beast bent upon undermining civilisation with his jungle-jazz rhythms'
Lily Langtree on Dame Nellie Melba: 'A shrieking Jezebel; no more, no less'
Franz Liszt on Lilly Langtree: 'Entirely without a spiritual compass and sings like a moose. A bad actress, too. Can't do an accent to save her life.'
Richard Wagner on Franz Liszt: 'His tight trousers are an offence to the eye. My special friend The King of Bavaria should do something'


 

Edited October 1, 2018 by skankdelvar

[Bridgehouse]

Just now, skankdelvar said:

Frank Sinatra on rock n roll: '...the most brutal, ugly, degenerate, vicious form of expression'
Bing Crosby on Frank Sinatra: 'A jumped-up, oleaginous goombah who wriggles his filthy hips for the bobby-soxers and utterly devoid of morals'
Rudy Vallee on Bing Crosby: 'A slick, crooning snake in the grass preying on muddle-headed American womanhood'.
Al Jolson on Rudy Vallee: (Holds finger and thumb a millimeter apart) - 'This much talent and thoroughly evil'
Dame Nellie Melba on Al Jolson: 'A foul beast bent upon undermining civilisation with his jungle-jazz rhythms'
Lily Langtree on Dame Nellie Melba: 'A shrieking Jezebel; no more, no less'
Franz Liszt on Lilly Langtree: 'Entirely without morals and sings like a moose. A bad actress, too. Can't do an accent to save her life.'
Richard Wagner on Franz Liszt: 'His tight trousers are an offence to the eye. My special friend The King of Bavaria should do something'


 

Ah, I get it now. 

Rock n roll is rubbish. 

[skankdelvar]

Just now, Bridgehouse said:

Ah, I get it now. 

Rock n roll is rubbish. 

We have a winner!

[Bridgehouse]

Just now, skankdelvar said:

We have a winner!

What do I get as a “prize”? The frank Sinatra back catalogue on 78’s?

[taunton-hobbit]

Wot, no reggae?

😎

[skankdelvar]

2 minutes ago, Bridgehouse said:

What do I get as a “prize”? The frank Sinatra back catalogue on 78’s?

Funnily enough, I dumped some Sinatra 78's out of my Dad's garage about 15 years ago. If I'd known about this thread I'd have kept them 

[Bridgehouse]

Just now, skankdelvar said:

Funnily enough, I dumped some Sinatra 78's out of my Dad's garage about 15 years ago. If I'd known about this thread I'd have kept them 

It’s a damn good job you didn’t!

[skankdelvar]

Just now, Bridgehouse said:

It’s a damn good job you didn’t!

They were from his later period and consequentially would not have troubled the morals police. 

[skankdelvar]

4 minutes ago, taunton-hobbit said:

Wot, no reggae?

😎

Outwith the rock spec on this occasion. Maybe next time 

[Bridgehouse]

9 minutes ago, skankdelvar said:

They were from his later period and consequentially would not have troubled the morals police. 

They’d have troubled my ears

[PaulWarning]

1 hour ago, skankdelvar said:

 

Here's my handy cut out and keep guide to the genealogy of Rock'n'Roll:

oh dear, the band I play in always do Jilted John and on occasions All The Small things