What do audiences really want from the bass player?

[LeftyP]

I know this thread is aimed at gigging bands in a pub setting but for another slant on things; I play bass in our church band.  I only play about once a month and I'm the only bass player so three weeks out of four there is no bottom end (apart from the piano left hand).  Word has got back that when I've played the general feeling from the congregation is that the band sounded very good.  I keep it simple so it's not my skills along the fret board but rather that, with the bass, the band has a more rounded sound.  No-one has actually complemented me on my playing but they just liked the overall sound.  My wife does get many complements about her clarinet playing, which annoys her because she plays oboe!

[discreet]

6 hours ago, Al Krow said:

I guess I wasn't expecting the barrage of despondency from my fellow bassists suffering from a collective existential crisis of not knowing or understanding what it is about our beloved craft that audiences not only notice, but LOVE. 

I'm not despondent and I'm not suffering from an existential crisis - I'm just realistic. I like what I do, I like my band, I like gigging. Maybe our situation is slightly different in that we don't do covers and we don't exclusively play pub gigs.

But you can't expect every punter to be totally cőck-a-hoop because of what is, at the end of the day, a random bloke in a band playing bass. People go to pubs for different reasons. Some people like live bands, some people tolerate them and some people walk out. Fair enough.

6 hours ago, Al Krow said:

Come on peeps! Bass is just GREAT and audiences love great live bands, almost all of whom have excellent bass players... 😎

You've never played in Deptford, have you? And I take issue with your contention that almost all live bands have excellent bass players. Not according to THIS observer, they haven't. And if I brightly addressed our typical audience with the words, 'Come on, peeps! Bass is just GREAT!' I'd probably get a smack in the mouth, and deservedly so.

Edited October 5, 2018 by discreet

[Al Krow]

47 minutes ago, discreet said:

Maybe our situation is slightly different in that we don't do covers and we don't exclusively play pub gigs.

You've never played in Deptford, have you?

We don't exclusively play pub gigs either; but they're probably our "hardest" audience. If you're playing at a birthday or wedding everyone is up for a good time.

Nope never played Deptford, but I play an old local at Bethnal Green where fights have been known to break out. And we play there regularly. 

47 minutes ago, discreet said:

And I take issue with your contention that almost all live bands have excellent bass players. Not according to THIS observer, they haven't.

Well I suspect you'd have much less to take issue over if you weren't misreading what I wrote. What I said was that "audiences love great live bands" and that almost all of these great bands have excellent bass players. I stick by that: dunno any top rated live bands that have useless bass players (they tend to get fired). Do you?

Very different, I hope you'll agree, to your mis-quote of "almost all live bands have excellent bass players" ('cos apparently there are a number of bands in the Deptford area that don't. I believe you 😂). 

47 minutes ago, discreet said:

And if I brightly addressed our typical audience with the words, 'Come on, peeps! Bass is just GREAT!' I'd probably get a smack in the mouth, and deservedly so.

Probably a good idea that you don't then 😂

Edited October 5, 2018 by Al Krow

[Al Krow]

1 hour ago, Maude said:

This thread has made me very happy to be in both of my bands. I couldn't be in a band where punters didn't notice the bass. First band is doublebass and lively so goes without saying that folks notice what I'm up to. Other band is Mod/Northern Soul/Ska, in songs like 'Tubestation At Midnight', 'The Real Me', 'The Night', 'Pressure Drop' etc people definitely know what I'm doing. I'm no wallflower in that band either and that's the way I like it. 

^^ Exactly this! Thank you!

Makes me want to come see you guys play live  

[discreet]

16 minutes ago, Al Krow said:

Well I suspect you'd have much less to take issue over if you weren't misreading what I wrote. What I said was that "audiences love great live bands" and that almost all of these great bands have excellent bass players. I stick by that: dunno any top rated live bands that have useless bass players (they tend to get fired). Do you?

Very different, I hope you'll agree, to your mis-quote of "almost all live bands have excellent bass players".

Sure, I'll misread your posts and misquote you, like I do everyone else - what makes you any different? It makes these threads more interesting. God knows they need titivating somewhat. 

And I'm quite sure people do like great top-rated live bands with excellent bass players, but you tend not to see them playing in pubs that much...

Yer average pub band tends to be tolerable at best. However, they can be improved via the judicious consumption of alcohol, whereupon Sid from Accounts can almost become Freddie Mercury. Almost.

[Al Krow]

1 minute ago, discreet said:

Sure, I'll misread your posts and misquote you, like I do everyone else - what makes you any different? It makes these threads more interesting. God knows they need titivating somewhat. 

And I'm quite sure people do like great top-rated live bands with excellent bass players, but you tend not to see them playing in pubs that much...

Yer average pub band tends to be tolerable at best. However, they can be improved via the judicious consumption of alcohol, whereupon Sid from Accounts can almost become Freddie Mercury. Almost.

Haha. Yup the right free speech is worth defending. 

Our guitarist is a firm believer that his playing improves "via the judicious consumption of alcohol."

Sounds like he has already read and misquoted the "Discreet guide to successful pub gigs". 😂

 

[discreet]

7 minutes ago, Al Krow said:

Our guitarist is a firm believer that his playing improves "via the judicious consumption of alcohol."

I used to think the same, right up until the time I soberly listened to a recording of myself playing while pıssed. In the 70s I did a lot of gigs while stoned, but magnesium bat field gazump hula hoop de Gaulle... daffodil.

[peteb]

11 minutes ago, discreet said:

And I'm quite sure people do like great top-rated live bands with excellent bass players, but you tend not to see them playing in pubs that much...

Yer average pub band tends to be tolerable at best. However, they can be improved via the judicious consumption of alcohol, whereupon Sid from Accounts can almost become Freddie Mercury. Almost.

I'm not sure where the really good 'top-rated' cover bands do play then if they are not playing in pubs, especially as the club scene is not what it was. A heavy rock covers band are not going to get much work on the function circuit or playing weddings, yet they can still pull decent audiences in the better pub venues. 

There are plenty of people out there working a day job who are still capable players / singers (not sure about Sid from Accounts). Some of them have built up a fair bit of experience / stagecraft and actually know what they are doing... 

[ambient]

27 minutes ago, discreet said:

 

Yer average pub band tends to be tolerable at best. However, they can be improved via the judicious consumption of alcohol, whereupon Sid from Accounts can almost become Freddie Mercury. Almost.

That has to be quote of the week :)

 

[discreet]

16 minutes ago, peteb said:

I'm not sure where the really good 'top-rated' cover bands do play then if they are not playing in pubs, especially as the club scene is not what it was.

I was quoting @Al Krow 's post where he referred to 'top rated live bands'. He didn't say anything about them being covers bands, though. At least I don't think so - I can't be bothered to scroll up and check quite frankly - this thread is starting to make my warts bleed.

[peteb]

Out of interest, how many non cover bands regularly play pubs?? Not many around here... 

[Woodinblack]

Quite a few around here

[peteb]

5 minutes ago, Woodinblack said:

Quite a few around here

Maybe another example of the North / South (West) divide...! 

[Woodinblack]

7 hours ago, dmccombe7 said:

I'm at the point i prefer playing my Jazz bass and that's gonna be the goto bass for this band. If not much difference in tone out front i'll play the bass i prefer and i'm most comfortable with.

That is the way I take it - it is rare there is much of a difference (although the guitarist often comments) so I take whatever I feel like taking along really, whatever I feel like playing or whatever image I have.

The drummers dad (who is in his late 80s) comes to a lot of our gigs. After he had seen about 20, with various different basses (probably about 10), I took my chequered iceman to a gig and he came up after the gig and said 'Have you got a new bass?'

 

[Woodinblack]

1 minute ago, peteb said:

Maybe another example of the North / South (West) divide...! 

In a way, the options have changed. There aren't really any clubs any more around here, and given that there is really nowhere else to play apart from the occasional coffee shop if you are a quiet acoustic act, there isn't much choice.

[peteb]

4 minutes ago, Woodinblack said:

In a way, the options have changed. There aren't really any clubs any more around here, and given that there is really nowhere else to play apart from the occasional coffee shop if you are a quiet acoustic act, there isn't much choice.

It's just that none of the established music pubs around here would consider putting on an originals band unless they had, say, a member who was a bit of a local star and could guarantee bringing a following.  

[Bluewine]

9 hours ago, Osiris said:

To them you're just a bloke in the corner of the pub playing a guitar 

 

I'm an out front guy. I am not a stand in the back by the drummer kind of guy. I probably look like l"m playing a guitar. 😂

Blue

 

 

 

Edited October 6, 2018 by Bluewine

[skankdelvar]

What do audiences really want from the bass player? Newsnight asked 1000 regular gig-goers and here are their top 5 responses:

1. Don't wear those pork-pie hats like that bloke out of Breaking Bad, the one that gets ill and turns into a drug dealer. They look good on him but they look sh*t on you
2. Please don't play a bass solo unless its going to last long enough for me to go and siphon the python or have a smoke outside. About 5 minutes should do it. Bye.
3. That thing you guys do when you turn round and accidentally smash the singer in the face with the sticky-out end of your big guitar is really funny. Keep doing that.
4. Don't keep trying to look like you're having a good time. It's creepy and it's not believable. Bass players should just be themselves and look glum and / or irritable
5. Whenever we ask to 'have a go' on your big guitar don't keep saying 'Only if I can have a go on your wife'. She'd never shag you in a month of Sundays.
    

Edited October 6, 2018 by skankdelvar

[Osiris]

7 hours ago, discreet said:

... Sid from Accounts can almost become Freddie Mercury. Almost.

But I don't work in accounts. Now who's misquoting, eh?

And the only thing Freddie and I have in common is the leotard.

[Al Krow]

7 hours ago, peteb said:

It's just that none of the established music pubs around here would consider putting on an originals band unless they had, say, a member who was a bit of a local star and could guarantee bringing a following.  

I'm in covers band, but even then pub venues we play at do obviously like it if we're able to drum up support. One of our vocalists, who is a Scot, seems to have a tag-along "expat" community turning up to most gigs, which kinda makes up for the fact that he's not actually managed to find us any gigs so far...

Originals bands (which a several of my band mates are in) often end up playing for free or a bit of "beer money" down in London. It's can be brutally competitive; although them getting to play at festivals can be fun and something I would love to do.

8 hours ago, discreet said:

Yer average pub band tends to be tolerable at best. 

I'm guessing that most of our gigging BCers, given the time and thought they put into tone, gear etc wouldn't want to settle for being in a "tolerable at best" band but would want to push on from there?

8 hours ago, peteb said:

There are plenty of people out there working a day job who are still capable players / singers (not sure about Sid from Accounts). Some of them have built up a fair bit of experience / stagecraft and actually know what they are doing... 

+1 ^^

My main covers band is also a function band. We all still really enjoy doing pub gigs, which is where we cut our teeth, as they tend to be more relaxed in terms of expectations so we can let our collective hair down a little!

But my point is you don't need to settle for being mediocre to be a pub band. Wanting to give punters a fun night out whether they are down the Dog n Duck or at someone's 60th or a wedding should make no difference.

1 hour ago, Osiris said:

And the only thing Freddie and I have in common is the leotard. 

Yup, the last time I looked Freddie was no more and besides I heard he'd delegated low end stuff to a geezer called "John" despite Freddie rumoured as being a reasonably competent keys player 😁

There's a reason that bass (and not keys) players predominantly play the bass lines, right? 

[Bridgehouse]

The bass player paradox..

Play a load of famous bass lines to your average punter and they will say “oh yeah, I like this one....”

Show them pictures of a load of famous bass players and they will say “Never seen them before in my life.. hang on, that one was that dodgy bloke on crimewatch, wasn’t he?”

[dmccombe7]

9 hours ago, peteb said:

I'm not sure where the really good 'top-rated' cover bands do play then if they are not playing in pubs, especially as the club scene is not what it was. A heavy rock covers band are not going to get much work on the function circuit or playing weddings, yet they can still pull decent audiences in the better pub venues. 

There are plenty of people out there working a day job who are still capable players / singers (not sure about Sid from Accounts). Some of them have built up a fair bit of experience / stagecraft and actually know what they are doing... 

Most of the venues i know are classed as "rock" venues and others are larger more club sized where you can hire the venue and take ticket money at the door. These venues tend to have dedicated audiences. Not always rock but sometimes a variation  ie thrash metal thru to Prog and everything in between. Also many rock tribute bands will play them. Not your typical average pub venue. My point being that people come in to see the bands and have a beer rather than  having a beer and "Oh there's a band on tonight".

Often the audience are down the front headbanging or dancing around while the band are on. Usually its a bit to loud to be having a conversation. When i used to do typical pub gigs they didn't want the band too loud so people could talk (loudly) I remember a 3 piece band where our drummer had an early Simmons kit and one of the venues said he liked when we played as we could even turn the drums down 

Most of the rock venues are based in or around Glasgow or Edinburgh with occasional ones outwith city centres. 

Dave

Edited October 6, 2018 by dmccombe7

[discreet]

1 hour ago, Al Krow said:

I'm guessing that most of our gigging BCers, given the time and thought they put into tone, gear etc wouldn't want to settle for being in a "tolerable at best" band but would want to push on from there?

I'm not sure how many pub bands I've seen over the years have had a 'gigging BCer' in them. Not many I bet, especially as BC hasn't existed for the 40 years or so I've been watching pub bands. In any case, the fact remains that most pub bands simply aren't that good.

[dmccombe7]

Must be the area you live in as i've seen some excellent pub bands over the years altho some have been mediocre at best but i'm kinda 50/50 on it. Maybe its because i generally only go to see the ones i expect to be the better ones and maybe because i know some of the band members or they have built up a good reutation in our area.

Dave

Edited October 6, 2018 by dmccombe7

[discreet]

7 hours ago, dmccombe7 said:

Must be the area you live in as i've seen some excellent pub bands over the years altho some have been mediocre at best but i'm kinda 50/50 on it. Maybe its because i generally only go to see the ones i expect to be the better ones and maybe because i know some of the band members or they have built up a good reutation in our area.

Well yes, it's averages. Some have been good but most just aren't. But I don't go out of my way to see them. Maybe my pub-band standards are unreasonably high, somehow.

A good band needs a good drummer, and they are few and far between. In fact, all band members need to be at least competent and the chances of this happening are slim, realistically. Especially as most pub bands tend to be amateur.

Edited October 6, 2018 by discreet