What do audiences really want from the bass player?

[Al Krow]

@krispn Great post, buddy.

[Woodinblack]

17 hours ago, Bluewine said:

Maybe it's me, we can walk off stage after a great set and everyone in the band is approached by punters except me.

The only thing I can come up with is they think I'm famous or I'm some sort of Star and they know better than to try engage me in conversation.😂

 

I think I might be too scared

 

[skankdelvar]

18 hours ago, Bluewine said:

The only thing I can come up with is they think I'm famous or I'm some sort of Star and they know better than to try engage me in conversation.

Maybe that TV show you were in. They're probably a bit nervous.

 

Edited October 10, 2018 by skankdelvar

[Beedster]

11 hours ago, 51m0n said:

Best way to get punters to know what the bass does is write arrangements where you drop out for a section, it doesn't matter one jot how tight the rest of the band is, how powerful it sounds without you, or how musically illiterate or not the audience is, when you come back in the lift in intensity is absolutely palpable. You are suddenly noticeable, a tiny bit of showmanship and you can make this obvious without for a second being a tosser about it. I promise this works, its a killer way to make the point that the bassist dude is the one making you boogie more than anyone else.

 

Absolutely this. I still rate the greatest compliment I’ve ever received as a bassist as ‘We didn’t notice how good your playing was until you stopped playing’

[skankdelvar]

17 hours ago, Beedster said:

Absolutely this. I still rate the greatest compliment I’ve ever received as a bassist as ‘We didn’t notice how good your playing was until you stopped playing’

Lots of guitarists of a certain age say this. Here's why.

From the Bert Weedon 'Play In A Day' guitar instruction course 1961:

'As you learn your first chords, the day may seem very distant when you might get together with other people to make music; but it's never too early to learn the etiquette of playing in a combo.

If there's a bass player present you should wait for the end of the first song then say 'I didn’t notice how good your playing was until you stopped playing’. He'll thank you for it and it will help to break the ice with these most prickly of musicians. Say something similar to the drummer, the piano player and the trumpeter and they probably won't even notice; but the bass player will.

Now let's try playing Twinkle Twinkle Little Star in the key of C. It's really very easy!'

Edited October 11, 2018 by skankdelvar

[dmccombe7]

20 hours ago, Beedster said:

Absolutely this. I still rate the greatest compliment I’ve ever received as a bassist as ‘We didn’t notice how good your playing was until you stopped playing’

Something similar said to me when i left a band because of their in fighting and came back 6mths later and they all stated after first few songs at rehearsal "Can now see what you brought to the band. Its what was missing with other bassists we tried"

I was chuffed but it didn't last to long after that when they started again so i left permanently. Full year wasted really. Great band when we gigged tho.

Dave

[Bluewine]

21 hours ago, skankdelvar said:

Maybe that TV show you were in. They're probably a bit nervous.

 

Do you know I'm from Montclair New Jersey where many of the Soprano scenes were shot. All the scenes of Tony dropping his kids off for school were shot at my old high school, Montclair High School.

By the way, from growing up in Montclair when I first started watching The Sopranos my first reaction was:

" This seems normal"

Blue

Edited October 11, 2018 by Bluewine

[skankdelvar]

2 hours ago, Bluewine said:

... when I first started watching The Sopranos my first reaction was: " This seems normal"

Which is probably why the gig-going community of Milwaukee WI tread very gently around you.

Audience interaction the Montclair, NJ way

[itsmedunc]

I'm too busy setting up and packing up the PA to care! Funny how if there's any questions posed to the rest of the band they all refer them to me! I honestly don't care though! Too long in the tooth now.

[drTStingray]

I don't think anyone's said it yet so I will:-

SLAP BASS

Audiences love it. Go to any Stanley Clark gig or Level 42 gig and you'll see. It gets the biggest reaction by far, bar none - followed by:-

FRETLESS BASS - just play that Paul Young song. 

Followed by:-

MUSICMAN BONGO

Just about the only bass I've ever played which consistently gets the public coming to talk to you about - often women!! In glowing, complementary terms.

So I guess the answer to the OP is slap bass played on a Fretless Musicman Bongo - is what the audience wants to hear from the bass player.

Now then - that Bert Weedon book - when was it produced - 1958 or so? That was back when you couldn't hear the bass at all and people either used very low powered guitar amps (whilst guitarists used similar amps) or even home made concoctions!! (I bought the Mo Foster book - fascinating stuff went on back then). I think Bert was just humouring bass players with that comment as even then I'm sure they were not only struggling to be heard but the guitarists were always too loud as ever 😀

Edited October 11, 2018 by drTStingray

[skankdelvar]

7 minutes ago, drTStingray said:

I think Bert was just humouring bass players with that comment

I'm sure he was. Lovely man, Bert, and always the first to buy a round.

[StringNavigator]

In a combo (dr,bs,lg, rg) the BP lives under the tyranny of the Lowd Gitarrz... I think that moulds (sic) much of our thinking. But listen to Chicago, Blood Sweat And Tears, all of Motown and Stax... the single! guitar is comping chords, much like a bass player would be tied to the rhythm. He only lets go in a brief solo. The BP in these settings is suddenly projected into a distinguished role! Brass frees the bass. Once the guitaral pumping on the E and A strings is eliminated, and the bending string screech is dropped, the bass is far more noticeable. Same for the Fender Rhodes... Pity the BP who has to sneak through that cloud of sound! A drummer with a weak kick is another impediment to solid bass. As soon as you have heavy hand guitaring, the BP is relegated to the corner. Personally, as a BP, I'd be happy to avoid that instrument forever (and I play one!). Give me a piano trio, backing a female singer or a Hammond player or a seven piece horn band. The audience notices the BP in a horn band.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Bluewine]

7 hours ago, skankdelvar said:

Which is probably why the gig-going community of Milwaukee WI tread very gently around you.

Audience interaction the Montclair, NJ way

I wish I could find a pic my brother took of me standing in front of the diner where they filmed the closing end of the show scene. I was home on holiday in  Bloomfield NJ.

 

Blue

[StringNavigator]

On ‎05‎/‎10‎/‎2018 at 21:15, skankdelvar said:

What do audiences really want from the bass player? Newsnight asked 1000 regular gig-goers and here are their top 5 responses:

2. Please don't play a bass solo unless its going to last long enough for me to go and siphon the python or have a smoke outside. About 5 minutes should do it. Bye.

 

Hilarious!

But you made me think, and it's only my biased opinion, but I feel that bass solos are over-rated... I enjoy trading fours with the drummer. I enjoy prominent bass lines. I enjoy playing tic-toc with the guitar. Throwing in double-stops. Even a four bar funk filled escapade alongside the drummer. I enjoy a fancy bass on the intro or finale with whomever. But if the band stops playing and the BP actually plays "solo" all alone... I feel like the night is over and it's time to consider if I should wander off to another locale... As SD said, "Bye." I'm a fairly good BP, but I would never solo in public. Only at home, alone. I play classical things and even Glen Cornick's Bouree solo. But I would never bore people for 15 minutes with a load of licks and tricks, 'cuz bass is best when in the mix.  

[Al Krow]

15 mins of any instrument soloing would bore the pants of most audiences!

No one is going to disagree that generally bass is best in a band mix, but bass can also be a creative solo instrument. 

A bass playing solo mid gig doesn't have to be "night over" as you suggest, as I found out last night when the drummer deliberately dropped out mid song and told the guitarist to do the same and the band just let the bass hold the groove for a while, whilst the audience sang! Worked great and the audience loved it. 

Edited October 14, 2018 by Al Krow

[mikel]

19 minutes ago, Al Krow said:

15 mins of any instrument soloing would bore the pants of most audiences!

No one is going to disagree that generally bass is best in a band mix, but bass can also be a creative solo instrument. 

A bass playing solo mid gig doesn't have to be "night over" as you suggest, as I found out last night when the drummer deliberately dropped out mid song and told the guitarist to do the same and the band just let the bass hold the groove for a while, whilst the audience sang! Worked great and the audience loved it. 

Yep but there is a huge difference between "Holding the groove" and playing a solo. I find that traditional solo instruments mostly interpret the song in a melodic and appropriate way, whereas lots of drummers and bassists simply try to get every lick and trick they know into a "Solo" and play as fast as possible so they can say "Look how good I am"

[Al Krow]

Agreed. Playing solo (ie just the bassist alone holding the groove ) is very different to playing a solo in the manner you suggest. 

There is, however, also a place for solo melodic bass and some of our fellow BCers ( eg@ambient I believe?) are highly skilled at this. 

Edited October 14, 2018 by Al Krow

[Rayman]

#groove

[Bluewine]

7 hours ago, mikel said:

Yep but there is a huge difference between "Holding the groove" and playing a solo. I find that traditional solo instruments mostly interpret the song in a melodic and appropriate way, whereas lots of drummers and bassists simply try to get every lick and trick they know into a "Solo" and play as fast as possible so they can say "Look how good I am"

I've always felt bass solos are great in jazz arrangements on the double bass. Never been a fan of rock electric bass guitar solos.

Blue

[Maude]

Depends what call a solo. A guitar or bass 'solo' while the rest of the band are still playing I like. A true solo where it's just the one instrument showing off (not just a break down where one or two instruments hold the groove) is terrible. 

I once left a Whitesnake concert half way through as for no reason there was a five minute guitar solo (no one else playing, not even part of a song), then a five minute bass solo, then the drums, I couldn't take and left. 

I was already annoyed as Black Label Society were support, the main reason I went, and they pulled out at the last minute. The solo's were the final straw. 

So what do I feel audiences want? No bloody solo's.

[StringNavigator]

On ‎13‎/‎10‎/‎2018 at 20:03, StringNavigator said:

I feel that bass solos are over-rated... if the band stops playing and the BP actually plays "solo" all alone... I feel like... it's time to... wander off to another locale... I would never solo in public...I would never bore people for 15 minutes with a load of licks and tricks, 'cuz bass is best when in the mix...  

Bias Alert!

I feel that I should clarify this. The context of my remarks is where a band with a rhythm section is performing music for a dancing audience at a wedding, bar, pub... Where patrons or guests are having a good time moving to music of various tempo and the expectation of the patrons or venue operators is to keep the floor moving. This scenario is the norm for most BP's.

A concert performance is a different animal. At a concert, the audience is accepting of long soloing sections and even craving many solos. As a BP of the former, I cringe at the thought of bass soloing as it destroys the momentum you've worked so hard to achieve. Still, it seems condescending to me, "Oh, it's only fair to let the bass have a solo, too!" As patrons find an opportunity to  order, make a phone call or use the facility.   

Even in jazz, when it's "time" for the BP to take a solo, they seem long winded and unrelated to the music that has just passed. But then, I'm a dance musician. I play danceable jazz. Even in Dixieland, BL's have indicated that I could solo, but I never care to. Maybe four bars at most, a little string slapping, and I'm back into walking. In fact, I feel that as a BP, I'm always soloing within the mix, anyway. That's why I play bass.

I realise there are 10 string BP's with FX pedal boards of 36 square feet who would like to kill me, now. And I probably only need two strings to do what I do to keep a floor hopping. In fact, I sometimes view the bass as just a glorified conga drum... But I feel there's a place for both BP types. Perhaps, not the same place.  

 

 

 

     

 

 

      

[StringNavigator]

On ‎11‎/‎10‎/‎2018 at 12:47, Bluewine said:

By the way, from growing up in Montclair when I first started watching The Sopranos my first reaction was: " This seems normal"

I just figured it out! These are bass players, aren't they? Examples of various types of Bass Face!

As a public service, perhaps we can codify and classify the Six Main Bass Faces prevalent in todays music scene.

Then we can just look into the guitarists' beady little eyes and show them one of these cards from the pack rather than get into a long winded discussion about how bass should be played. We need a 52 card deck, but these six are a great start.  

1. Mad Max! "Is this guitard actually telling me how to play?"

2. Pained and P*ssed Peter! "Well, that guitard needed to be replaced, anyway, see?" 

3. Happy D*ck! "The guitard's fiancé was a little late for work this morning."

4. Doubting Tommy! "So, you call yourself a guitar playah...really?"

5. Vincent the Visionary! "With a 10 string bass, who needs guitards, anyway?"

6. Freddy the Fixer! "Yeah... we had a guitarist... but... it didn't end well..." 

If you ain't got a Bass Face, you ain't really playing that bass...

 

 

Edited October 15, 2018 by StringNavigator
insert as*terisks where needed

[StringNavigator]

Hold on... this has already been done. Bass Chat has a Bass Face thread... See you later!

[Dropzone]

I frequently get platitudes greater than my ability, which is good but not exceptional, in a covers band. I put this down to playing for the way the rest of the band members play the song, being the glue between the guitarist and drummer. Understanding the accents in a song (when to play quietly and loudly and filling the percussion lost when not having a second guitar). A little bit of pantomime by throwing a shape at any big drops and rocking out when I am enjoying it. I am painfully aware I am still like a statue when we play any deftones numbers as I just don't like them but the rest of the band do, so I tolerate it. I saw Wayward Sons earlier this year and the bass player didn't stop moving and it inspired me to generally be doing something interesting rather than just looking bored focused .

[EliasMooseblaster]

1 hour ago, StringNavigator said:

Bias Alert!

I feel that I should clarify this. The context of my remarks is where a band with a rhythm section is performing music for a dancing audience at a wedding, bar, pub... Where patrons or guests are having a good time moving to music of various tempo and the expectation of the patrons or venue operators is to keep the floor moving. This scenario is the norm for most BP's.

I guess for the "pub band" situation, the key is make the bass solo part of the entertainment. My Generation is a great example of how to do it, where the bass solos are snappy, two-bar breaks which work as a call-and-response between the bass and the rest of the band. If you changed that out for a full 32-bar break for the bass player to go through his/her whole book of chops, then you'd lose that pace and the queue for the bar would probably grow quite quickly.

(So at least the landlord would be happy...)