What do audiences really want from the bass player?

[Cuzzie]

Do Royal Blood and Paris Monster have a Bassist in their band?

[thebigyin]

1 hour ago, MacDaddy said:

Well if I go and see a band with Billy Sheehan, Stu Hamm, or Victor Wooten, I'm probably going to want a bass solo at some point.

If I saw Iron Maiden, and Steve Murray just stood at the back not moving, I'd be quite disappointed.

If I saw Motley Crue or Kiss, and there was no fire or pyro involving the bassist, again I'd be disappointed.

If I see a Psychobilly band, I'd want the bassist to at least spin his DB a couple of times.

So it all depends...

Steve Harris on Bass....Dave Murray on Guitar....sorry.

[fretmeister]

2 minutes ago, EliasMooseblaster said:

You're right, and I've missed the subtle but important distinction, that people are aware of our presence, but not what we're doing musically to hold everything together.

I think that's very genre specific - particularly in a 3 piece.

 

Punk - probably. But in a Cream tribute...?

[ambient]

It’s interesting and got me smiling. If I do a show on bass then the whole audience will be watching me and would certainly notice if I wasn’t there, as I tend to play solo shows now 😁.

To be totally honest I don’t think the average person really takes any notice of anyone in a band except for the singer or the drummer. 

I did the most bizarre gig about 7 years ago. I was booked to play a New Year’s Eve gig at a club in Leicester. I asked if it was a reading gig or did he want me to learn a set; his reply was a bit odd “neither just turn up”. Anyway I kept in touch with him, a week or so beforehand I asked if he wanted a rehearsal, to which he said no, don’t worry, this is the easiest gig you’ll ever have to do. 

Come the night I arrive and introduce myself, the drummer is setting up an electric kit, I unload my gear and set up. As we’re about to soundcheck he comes up and turns my volume right down, and signals me and the drummer to follow him backstage. There he let’s us into the secret. He usually plays as a duo with his wife using prerecorded tracks, the venue didn’t want that they wanted a band, we were just there to make up the numbers, essentially miming to the tracks. Nobody at all noticed.

Edited October 5, 2018 by ambient

[Japhet]

In my experience (playing pub rock mainly), 85% of punters have no idea what the bass does, 14% are aware but not bothered and 1% appreciate and understand that you don't get a good band with a bad bassist or rhythm section. My anecdote about this;

Playing a crowded and lively pub, one of the punters was heckling and wise-cracking constantly. At one point he shouted out 'What's the bassist there for anyway?' So, I replied 'I'll tell you what mate, I'll drop out during the next song and you'll find out'. So, half way through She Sells Sanctuary, I dropped out and the others carried on to the end. It sounded crap, as you'd expect and got the crowd reation we expected. Then the singer asks 'Do you want bass in the next song then?' which got a big cheer. He then says 'Well, you better start being nice to him you muppet' pointing at the original heckler, which got a big laugh.

Occasionally you'll get a punter come up and say ' Great stuff mate, people have no idea what you do but there are a few of us who do' which is nice.

[dmccombe7]

23 minutes ago, Osiris said:

I've been gigging pubs and such like for more than 30 years now and in my opinion the average pub band audience just want to dance and sing along. That's it.

You'll get the odd muso and other bassists paying more attention than Sharon and Dave as they drunkenly sing and dance along, but other than that the punters see the band as a live disco and couldn't care less about your gear, your sound or anything else that we obsess about on Basschat. They just want to hear something that they know and enjoy themselves in their own way - which usually means tripping over the monitors while emptying half a pint of beer over themselves or whichever member of the band they are trying to request a song from. 

Hey watch it.........Dave's have feelings too you know.

Dave 👍

[dmccombe7]

Its all coming across as a wee bit negative and depressing here guys. Can't say i've really noticed anything too untoward when i'm playing. I generally get quite good comments after playing and never been heckled. Must be doing something right then.

Dave

Edited October 5, 2018 by dmccombe7

[discreet]

5 minutes ago, dmccombe7 said:

I generally get quite good comments after laying...

Wrong forum.  

[Lozz196]

26 minutes ago, Osiris said:

I've been gigging pubs and such like for more than 30 years now and in my opinion the average pub band audience just want to dance and sing along. That's it.

You'll get the odd muso and other bassists paying more attention than Sharon and Dave as they drunkenly sing and dance along, but other than that the punters see the band as a live disco and couldn't care less about your gear, your sound or anything else that we obsess about on Basschat. They just want to hear something that they know and enjoy themselves in their own way - which usually means tripping over the monitors while emptying half a pint of beer over themselves or whichever member of the band they are trying to request a song from. 

Yep, we obsess over every tiny little detail but I`ve seen many pro bassists just turn up with a Squier (not JV I should add) Precision or Jazz, plug into whatever amp is there, get a workable sound at sound-check and the audience go crackers when the band play. As usually they`re singing along to the words, or yelling the guitar solos.

 

[Geek99]

2 hours ago, Silvia Bluejay said:

Um, do you mean Steve Harris? 😮

Edit: referring to MacDaddy's post.

Murray Head, but only when playing in Bangkok for one night, with oysters as a rider .

[Geek99]

1 hour ago, Al Krow said:

Exactly! Just 'cos you're in a covers band doesn't mean you have to be clones. We're not a tribute band.

But strip out the bass from any decent rock track and the audience will immediately notice. 

true anywhere. I took a precision bass to an OM night that was mostly weedy acoustics They noticed.

[Geek99]

45 minutes ago, Muzz said:

They want to hear a good band. If you're doing your job right, they will. That's all they want from a bass player, tho you'll very very rarely hear it expressed as such. If you want to be noticed individually, buy a Bootsy star bass, but brace for everyone calling it a guitar...

too true, my better half still calls it "a guitar". The argument that its "a different sized instrument, played differently, making a different sound, in a different way, with a different purpose" does not register. A cello is not the same as a violin.

[Marvin]

I’m not particularly interested in what a bass player is up to when I go to watch a band, so I can’t imagine anyone being interested in what I do.

 I saw The Winery Dogs with Billy Sheehan playing bass a couple of years ago...I spent the gig in awe of Richie Kotzen. Sheehan was brilliant with all his tapping etc, but Kotzen stole the show

[Al Krow]

38 minutes ago, Osiris said:

Get your guitarist to start it at the next gig. I bet the number of people who notice can be counted on one hand. And fewer still will care. 

Missing the point. The fact that it can be done another way is neither here nor there. When it's done with the bass playing the main riff they absolutely love it. 

Just take the bass line out of pub classics like Living on a Prayer, Jet - Do you want to be my girl or Sweet Child to name three songs off the top of my head and it's not going to be anywhere near as good IMO.

 

[Muzz]

22 minutes ago, dmccombe7 said:

Its all coming across as a wee bit negative and depressing here guys. Can't say i've really noticed anything too untoward when i'm playing. I generally get quite good comments after laying and never been heckled. Must be doing something right then.

Dave

Not really negative (OK, the example I gave was an extreme one, but to be fair, he was a d*ck (and a hammered d*ck at that)), if you gave me the choice I'd rather people complimented the band rather than me, because I know I'm an integral part of the band (we could blather on about degrees of this till the end of time) and its sound, so a compliment on that is also a compliment to me.

Edited October 5, 2018 by Muzz

[EliasMooseblaster]

2 minutes ago, Geek99 said:

too true, my better half still calls it "a guitar". The argument that its "a different sized instrument, played differently, making a different sound, in a different way, with a different purpose" does not register. A cello is not the same as a violin.

It's still a variation on the guitar though, isn't it? They might all serve different roles and be played differently, but a violin, viola, cello (or violoncello, to give it its full name) and double bass (bass viol, for the pedants) are all in the violin family. Similarly the guitar family includes tenor, baritone and bass variants on its more common form.

I don't mean to touch a nerve; I just vividly remember Talkbass absolutely exploding down the middle into two camps of people yelling "IT'S A BASS" and "ERM, NO, IT'S A BASS GUITAR" at each other.

[Al Krow]

I'm actually very surprised not at the overly high opinion we have of ourselves (we're generally a pretty modest bunch and know our place - and I'd be the first to say that my starting point with any band is to try find some great vocalists), but at the low esteem we seem to have for our trade and how it is viewed by our audiences.

If bassists are such a waste of space why do gigging bands waste their gig monies by pretty much always having one?

Of the 1,000 best bands that we love, how many didn't have a bass player? For every one you can name without a bassist (and in my case in terms of my top 1,000 bands it would be "the Doors") there will be another 100 that do have one. Coincidence? I don't think so.

[dmccombe7]

20 minutes ago, discreet said:

Wrong forum.  

Sorted thanks for that but still all good for me whether playing or laying 

Dave 

[Muzz]

7 minutes ago, EliasMooseblaster said:

I don't mean to touch a nerve; I just vividly remember Talkbass absolutely exploding down the middle into two camps of people yelling "IT'S A BASS" and "ERM, NO, IT'S A BASS GUITAR" at each other.

Doesn't take much on that place... 😕🙂

I think the definitive definition (eh?) is the patent application from Clarence L Fender from 1953 that says 'Guitar'...

Edited October 5, 2018 by Muzz

[Geek99]

Well, he just didn’t know what he was talking about. Loser

[Lozz196]

I don`t think we underestimate ourselves, far from it, it seems that we all have a good awareness of what the bass is/does, which I`d hope would be so on a Bass Forum. It`s just that in general the bass is a support instrument, and sonically it`s easier to hear the notes of the guitar, so people are more aware of what the guitar does. I know in my band that if I were to just have a regular Precision straight to desk sound, and played the same notes but without the same aggression/attack the band would sound radically different, so I`m aware of what my contribution is to the overall sound - to be honest in a 3-piece there`s no real place to hide anyway. 

[Osiris]

19 minutes ago, Al Krow said:

Missing the point. The fact that it can be done another way is neither here nor there. When it's done with the bass playing the main riff they absolutely love it. 

Just take the bass line out of pub classics like Living on a Prayer, Jet - Do you want to be my girl or Sweet Child to name three songs off the top of my head and it's not going to be anywhere near as good IMO.

 

I think it's precisely the point - whether it can be done on bass or guitar, most punters won't notice any difference and fewer still will care.

Isn't that what you were trying to ascertain in your opening post on this thread i.e. what do we bass players bring to the gig??? I think that that part could be done on guitar with barely a raised eyebrow in the house. We as bass players may not like that but I don't think it's too far from the truth. 

You are right, we would notice and we would feel that the song suffers as a result if the bass was to not play on most of our sets. But I doubt that many in the audience would - and that's the point I'm trying to make. They might be vaguely aware that something doesn't sound quite right but they probably won't know what's amiss, nor really care. How many times have you seen people dancing to disco's where it's all sub bass obliterating the rest of the frequencies? There used to be a DJ in these parts who had an atrocious PA, not much going on below about 2 KHz, he was known locally as Trevor Treble, but he always had a full dance floor. Sound quality is not the punters priority, having a good time is. 

My opinion is nothing to do with having a low opinion of myself or other bass players, or to belittle what we as bass players do. It's an opinion built up from more than 30 years, and god knows how many gigs. We care, they don't. If other people have had more positive experiences than mine, then I genuinely envy them. Don't get me wrong, I still gig regularly and love every minute of it. But to Sharon and Dave (my deepest apologies @dmccombe7  ) it's not all about the bass...

[dmccombe7]

I'd like to know who this Sharon is that keeps hanging around my gigs 

[Al Krow]

22 minutes ago, Osiris said:

I think it's precisely the point - whether it can be done on bass or guitar, most punters won't notice any difference and fewer still will care.

I just can't agree on this one buddy. Forget 7 Nation, perhaps a bad example (of a song we play with bass leading to great audience reaction).

As I said, take the bass out of three pub classics like Living on a Prayer, Jet - Do you want to be my girl? or Sweet Child and see if it's anything close to the same?

Are you really saying it makes no difference to audience enjoyment if the bass isn't playing on these (and there's no bass-line substitution being done with octave down on guitar or keys)?

I guess what I'm saying is that bass-lines matter. And they are integral to pop and rock.

Edited October 5, 2018 by Al Krow

[Len_derby]

Some interesting insights here.

My thoughts are that any bass player who is concerned about being unappreciated, misunderstood or overlooked has possibly chosen the wrong instrument 😊