Duffer's guide to writing lyrics....

[tauzero]

7 hours ago, MacDaddy said:

or try the'Disaster Area' approach:

Their songs are on the whole very simple and mostly follow the familiar theme of boy-being meets girl-being beneath silvery moon, which then explodes for no adequately explored reason.

I did write a song which was loosely based on that - it was actually an anti-racism song based on the premise of him being human and her being humanoid but green and with four arms. And there were three moons, none of which exploded.

[tauzero]

3 hours ago, Nicko said:

Personally I think when writing lyrics I dont think rhyme is that important, and there are some awful lyrics that seem to have been written just to get a rhyme (George Ezras Shotgun, Oasis' She's Electric), whereas its perfectly OK to have prcatically no Rhyme except repeated phrases:

As another example, Stairway to Heaven is a classic demonstration of how a song doesn't have to rhyme. It does get a bit more rhymey towards the end, possibly after someone nipped out and bought Percy a rhyming dictionary.

[lozkerr]

2 hours ago, RonMac said:

"Picture me posting a letter of where we went today. The park, the zoo, on the patio sat a table for two." ... At this point it could go either way, you could continue discribing your day but, maybe the day you are discribing is only in your head because that other person didn't show up. But, you still discribe this great day you had. "When the waiter asked, I had nothing to say. ................ (and) you" ... That completes the rhyme of today-say and two-you.   

I like this - I think I'll have a play with it and see where it goes. I've thought of an ending, though. It needs work, but the basic shape's about there:

So I'm sending you this letter saying what we did today
The sights, the sounds, the smells, I could go on and on
But when the waiter asked me, I had nothing real to say
For she was only there in memory, reality's long gone

 

[Happy Jack]

There was an old man of St. Bees,

Who was stung in the arm by a wasp.

When asked "Does it hurt?"

He replied "No, it doesn't,

I'm so glad it wasn't a hornet."

 

[Vinny]

The only advice I have on lyrics would be...

1. Listen to the complete works of Led Zeppelin.

2. Don't do any of that.

[SH73]

Most words in songs nowadays are recycled lyrics

They are not so much novelty, but more like gimmicks

If you struggle to compose originalism

Forget it, and opt for plagiarism.

 

1.to make it work in pop music, just add some 'ooh uuh'

2. for rap music, just add 'yo' or 'mother#%#@'

3. for metal 'yeah' ..if you're Metallica fan '##** yeah'

4.for classical don't add lyrics at all 

5. for blues add ' b b b b babyyy"

6. jazz add any words and notes , it will work

7. death metal, wait till you have a bad chest infection or vomiting bug then just go straight into recording it.

 

 

 

[Paul S]

6 hours ago, Vinny said:

The only advice I have on lyrics would be...

1. Listen to the complete works of Led Zeppelin Bon Jovi

2. Don't do any of that.

Fixed. 

And I am in a Bon Jovi tribute band....  

[Bolo]

Bon Jovi used my method described above pretty consistently, and made a buck or two!

[solo4652]

On 02/11/2018 at 16:56, lozkerr said:

I like this - I think I'll have a play with it and see where it goes. I've thought of an ending, though. It needs work, but the basic shape's about there:

So I'm sending you this letter saying what we did today
The sights, the sounds, the smells, I could go on and on
But when the waiter asked me, I had nothing real to say
For she was only there in memory, reality's long gone

 

I like that. A lot. Let us know where it ends up, please.

[lozkerr]

1 hour ago, solo4652 said:

I like that. A lot. Let us know where it ends up, please.

I've had another play with it, and it's coming together slowly. The idea is the narrator is reliving his last day with his true love. It's still more doggerel than lyricism, but this is where I've got to:

I'm sending you a letter saying where we went today. 
The park, the zoo, on the terrace on a seat for two.
A glass of wine, a bite to eat, we had so much to say
About our lives together, where we'd go and what we'd do

We arrived here bleary-eyed on the early morning train
The one on which, that fateful day, that she first caught my eye
The sunrise lit the fleecy clouds with a soft pink primrose stain
And we caught our breath in wonder at the castle in the sky

We ran through the dewy gardens, gazed at the flowered clock
Climbed the sandstone rocket and looked out across the bay
Her hair fluttered in the breeze as she said I was her rock
We would face the world together, starting right now here today

(split up and meet later - both want to do different things)

(accident)

(funeral)

(leaving - will return to relive perfect day)
As I walked with my head down I swore I would return

So I'm sending you this letter saying what we did today
The sights, the sounds, the smells, I could go on and one
But when the waiter asked me, I had nothing real to say
She was only there in memory, reality had gone

Once I've put something together for the verses described in brackets, I'll see if I can tidy it up a bit. It takes place in and around Princes Street Gardens - the 'castle in the sky' is Edinburgh Castle, the 'flowered clock' is the floral clock and the 'sandstone rocket' is the Scott Monument. Bit too purple at the moment, but I think it's heading in the right direction.

 

[Nicko]

On ‎03‎/‎11‎/‎2018 at 08:50, Paul S said:

Fixed. 

And I am in a Bon Jovi tribute band....  

You have my deepest sympathy. 

Lifes not a bed of roses.

 

[Dad3353]

1 hour ago, lozkerr said:

... this is where I've got to:...

Promise; much promise. It's evocative, the scansion is easy on the mind (nit-picking, one or two rhymes pass muster, but only just...). I hear moderate-slow c&w  guitars, maybe a pedal steel..? Hammond/Leslie organ, too. Good stuff, and impressive for the work already gone into forging this thus far.
Am I allowed a suggestion..? Just a thought, reading this through several times; maybe something to think about for another time..? At the end of each 'verse', I hear an extension, a 'half-line', rhyming with the previous line. A bit like an echo; it (to me, in my tiny head...) breaks up the rigour of the timing, lending 'breath'. Ignore, of course, if it's inappropriate; put it down to 'old duffer-ness' or the like. Eager, now, to read (hear..?) the completed work. Would it be indiscreet to ask if this is drawn from recent personal events..? No need to answer that, naturally, but there's a ring of authenticity that comes across with powerful emotion. Any thoughts yourself as to the music to match your intentions..? Celtic harp..? Nylon acoustic..? Far-distant, searing, soaring electric sustain guitars..? Not reggae/dub, I hope..? 

[skankdelvar]

2 hours ago, Dad3353 said:

Any thoughts yourself as to the music to match your intentions..? Celtic harp..? Nylon acoustic..? Far-distant, searing, soaring electric sustain guitars..?

Notwithstanding the Edinburgh locale I would - speaking only for myself - avoid the use of bagpipes to any significant degree. 

[Dad3353]

2 minutes ago, skankdelvar said:

Notwithstanding the Edinburgh locale I would - speaking only for myself - avoid the use of bagpipes to any significant degree. 

Isn't that a given..? 

[skankdelvar]

2 minutes ago, Dad3353 said:

Isn't that a given..? 

Not necessarily. I can see how it could happen. Someone says: 'Oh, sad. Must use uilleann pipes, obvs, think Titanic' and someone else says: 'But uilleann pipes are Irish not Scottish' and the first someone says: 'Well we could always use bagpipes' and there's a bit of a pause and the second someone says: 'I know this chap who's quite good and we can probably get him cheap' and then mission creep sets in, you've got a jaunty ceilidh number on your hands and then everyone gets sued by the estate of the late Mr Jimmy Shand for plagiarism.

[ahpook]

29 minutes ago, skankdelvar said:

Notwithstanding the Edinburgh locale I would - speaking only for myself - avoid the use of bagpipes to any significant degree. 

The only time to use bagpipes is when someone has suggested Northumbrian pipes and it's a matter of damage limitation.

 

[skankdelvar]

Just now, ahpook said:

The only time to use bagpipes is when someone has suggested Northumbrian pipes and it's a matter of damage limitation.

 

 You don't want BC luminary and supermod @wateroftyne hearing you say that. He's got a picture of the talented and lovely Kathryn Tickell tattooed on his chest.

[lozkerr]

3 hours ago, Dad3353 said:

Promise; much promise. It's evocative, the scansion is easy on the mind (nit-picking, one or two rhymes pass muster, but only just...). I hear moderate-slow c&w  guitars, maybe a pedal steel..? Hammond/Leslie organ, too. Good stuff, and impressive for the work already gone into forging this thus far.
Am I allowed a suggestion..? Just a thought, reading this through several times; maybe something to think about for another time..? At the end of each 'verse', I hear an extension, a 'half-line', rhyming with the previous line. A bit like an echo; it (to me, in my tiny head...) breaks up the rigour of the timing, lending 'breath'. Ignore, of course, if it's inappropriate; put it down to 'old duffer-ness' or the like. Eager, now, to read (hear..?) the completed work. Would it be indiscreet to ask if this is drawn from recent personal events..? No need to answer that, naturally, but there's a ring of authenticity that comes across with powerful emotion. Any thoughts yourself as to the music to match your intentions..? Celtic harp..? Nylon acoustic..? Far-distant, searing, soaring electric sustain guitars..? Not reggae/dub, I hope..? 

Thanks Dad! I really appreciate that. The lines still need a fair bit of work - some of it feels cringey and it doesn't flow as well as I'd like - but I think the overall feeling is about there. There is some personal stuff in it - the last few years haven't been the easiest for me - but it's not relating a specific experience. I just let my imagination wander about a bit. The sound I have in my head is something like this:

Tanita Tikaram - Little Sister Leaving Town

and

Tanita Tikaram - Preyed Upon

Not an exact copy, but that sort of moody, sad and empty feeling. I think the drums are a tad too intrusive on Preyed Upon, but that's likely just me. Plenty of slides on the bass and yes, a distant sustained guitar would work well. I'll have to persuade my other half to dust off her Gibson 🙂  I think the trick will be to see what sort of bassline seems to work and build it from there. Melodies aren't my strong point though, so it might be a bit hit and miss.

And 100% agreed - no bagpipes! The chap on Castlehill was squawking away when I was jotting some of that down earlier and it was really jarring. 

[ahpook]

30 minutes ago, skankdelvar said:

 You don't want BC luminary and supermod @wateroftyne hearing you say that. He's got a picture of the talented and lovely Kathryn Tickell tattooed on his chest.

My wife could play them and it wouldn't change my opinion of them. Not that she does....jesus, what an idea

 

 

 

Edited November 12, 2018 by ahpook

[Nicko]

21 hours ago, skankdelvar said:

Notwithstanding the Edinburgh locale I would - speaking only for myself - avoid the use of bagpipes to any significant degree. 

 

20 hours ago, Dad3353 said:

Isn't that a given..? 

It worked for AC DC.

[Dad3353]

3 minutes ago, Nicko said:

It worked for AC DC.

Another good reason for the ban. 

[skankdelvar]

25 minutes ago, Nicko said:

It worked for AC DC.

Up to a point, Lord Copper.

[HengistPod]

On ‎01‎/‎11‎/‎2018 at 14:59, lowdown said:

Oh dear, look how the simple things in lyric writing have changed. Once upon a time, you just needed to wake up in the morning. 

One that's inexplicably stuck with me was an American comedian with coyote glove puppets that did a turn on, I think, a Ben Elton hosted show back in the 80s ...

"Woke up this morning, My woman was dead

Reindeer came down the chimney, And stood on her head."

Could always try doing a Jon Anderson. Use words that fit the rhythm of the song - use them for the sound they make rather than have them making any sense at all. That way people think you're being all mystical, and search for hidden meanings in the nonsense.

"I've seen all good people turn their heads each day, so satisfied I'm on my way."

 

[Low End Bee]

Some tips that have helped me become the Tim Rice of Middlesex on Thames.

Find something that piques your interest. Wikipedia random/on this day. Stuff in the news. Nutters on a bus. Whatever.

Find a song you know well and like. Write new lyrics that fit that tune on the subject. Fit the syllable count so it doesn't sound forced. Leave it in a drawer/folder for ages so you forget what you originally wrote it too.

Don't be precious and edit ruthlessly. Sometimes a verse from one song will fit the chorus from another.

They don't have to be epics. My favourite of the lyrics I've written has 57 words in total.

Oohs, Aahs and repeats can be your friend and even make a song. Masterpieces like Wimoweh and Tiger Feet prove this.

They don't always have to make it. I have written 5 sets of unused lyrics to each song that has got to a structured state. Some of them are being used in my new project. Keep everything.

I had to learn on the job when a singer/lyricist left the band I was in about 10 years ago. I volunteered to have ago and now I love the words nearly as much as the music. If I can do it with very little formal education anyone can. 

 

[lownote]

No one's raised Kate Bush's contribution to the genre:  "washing machine.... washing MACHEEEEENNNN"