Bands you think were better before they got big

[bartelby]

22 hours ago, Bassassin said:

I agree with 100% your points about all three bands - except IMO Opeth are always a delight live. I do like their last two albums (I'm progger at heart) but they'd benefit from a bit less restraint!

Mastodon are the only band where I'd bought tickets to a gig, but felt so let down by the album they subsequently released (The Hunter, follow-up to Crack The Skye) that I didn't bother to go. The fact that I'd seen them twice before & got the impression they were lousy live didn't really help.

Opeth's I got Pale Communion on vinyl for £5 from Amazon and enjoyed it enough to preorder the deluxe box set of The Sorceress . For the dull gig I went to, they were touring Heritage. I thought that album was incredibly boring, it being an album supporting tour the set was heavily weighted to it. In the middle of the set they did 25 mins of acoustic stuff, with only a couple of those songs being from Damnation. The rest were acoustic versions of heavier songs, that just didn't work (for me).

I'd always enjoyed Mastodon live before The Hunter tour. Yeah they had moments of sloppiness, but they were spot on for the Crack the Sky gig I'd seen. I didn't like The Hunter and it didn't help Dillinger Escape Plan were the support, I can't stand 95% of their output. So I already wanted to leave before Mastodon hit the stage.

 

21 hours ago, Jus Lukin said:

Possibly an unusual example because I believe it was a deliberate attempt to move away from that radio-friendly sound and have more organic approach- in fact almost inverse to many, in that they had the big polished sound and hit albums to start with, then got into a more ramshackle sound once they were massive.

The big change was Vedder was involved in more than just lyrics. The instrumentation for Ten and Vs was written by the others without input from Eddie. The next couple of albums were nearly 50% Vedder written songs. Then slowly over the next few albums the song writing became more evenly distributed, other band members started writing lyrics too. Then the last coupe were back to Vedder writing the bulk. 

[arthurhenry]

On 18/12/2018 at 12:36, chris_b said:

Cream before they discovered America were brilliant.

They were together for only two years!

[Jus Lukin]

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Edited March 2, 2022 by Jus Lukin

[Woodinblack]

On 18/12/2018 at 23:23, Frank Blank said:

Post-Gabriel Genesis, dreadful. The Lamb Lies Down on Broadway is my favourite prog album ever.

I love post Gabriel Genesis. Although some of their stuff before that was ok, I can listen to it, Collins Genesis would feature as one of my all time favourite bands. And strangely, Gabriel solo work would feature as some of my favourite 'solo' artist.

For me, Gabriel leaving Genesis was one of the best things that happened in music, they both became so much better afterwards.

[neilp]

On 19/12/2018 at 09:05, Lozz196 said:

Def, the all time best Motorhead line up imo too.

I knew Lemmy a bit in the early 90s and I got the impression his heart wasn't really in it ....

[Newfoundfreedom]

Black Lace.

They just started taking themselves too seriously after Agadoo. 

[davepb24]

Another one I'd throw in..."Mk 2" OMD. First four albums amazing. Added a brass section and I stopped listening. Although did see them on the Sugar Tax tour with Andy and hired helps and that was far better than I thought it would be.

[josie]

Any Cadillac Three fans here? I actually preferred their previous, four-piece line-up as American Bang. Recognisably the same band, but just slightly lighter, and more varied and interesting musically. Kelby Ray was playing bass then. They're still an awesome force live though 🙂 

[Johnny Wishbone]

On 22/12/2018 at 09:36, bartelby said:

The big change was Vedder was involved in more than just lyrics. The instrumentation for Ten and Vs was written by the others without input from Eddie. The next couple of albums were nearly 50% Vedder written songs. Then slowly over the next few albums the song writing became more evenly distributed, other band members started writing lyrics too. Then the last coupe were back to Vedder writing the bulk. 

Spot on, and much the worse for it in my opinion. Ed's voice changed after 'Vs' too and became much more raw-sounding, which works on a few songs but for the most part isn't as good as it was before.

Knowing him and his 'rejection' of fame, I've no doubt this shift to sound less accessible is completely deliberate.

[bartelby]

7 minutes ago, Johnny Wishbone said:

Spot on, and much the worse for it in my opinion. Ed's voice changed after 'Vs' too and became much more raw-sounding, which works on a few songs but for the most part isn't as good as it was before.

Knowing him and his 'rejection' of fame, I've no doubt this shift to sound less accessible is completely deliberate.

I've found that a lot of the songs I prefer on the last few albums are all Vedder's.  I do agree there was an intentional change, whether that was to move away from the Grunge scene or to try and avoid radio play I don't know.

[Bolo]

Morbid Angel in the Vincent/Azagthoth era was massive.

Slayer lost their way in the 90s after booting  Lombardo. (Absolutely adore Show No Mercy/Live Undead, they only got that intense again on Seasons in the Abyss)

HOWEVER Metallica was meh with Dave Mustaine. That split was the best thing to happen to both parties.

Faith no More Mosely-Patton different bands, both genious.

Funny how none of the vocalist changes really impacted Bolt Thrower's quality. I'll happily put any of their albums on repeat for an evening.

[mike257]

On 19/12/2018 at 14:16, Crawford13 said:

I was waiting for someone to say this... Blackened Sky was a great album, i think it was all down hill from there.

As much as the first three records are still my go-to more often than not, I think (especially if you dig in to albums/b-sides/live shows, rather than just the singles) they're one of the few bands that have managed to nail down a more broadly appealing songwriting approach whilst keeping a lot of what made them exciting in their early days. It's still full of musically clever bits, unusual time signatures squeezed in to the context of a catchy song, and little bits of weirdness amongst the more polished sound. They're still absurdly great live too. Albums 2 and 3 are probably my faves, but there's gold on every record. 

[spectoremg]

On 22/12/2018 at 13:05, Woodinblack said:

I love post Gabriel Genesis. Although some of their stuff before that was ok, I can listen to it, Collins Genesis would feature as one of my all time favourite bands. And strangely, Gabriel solo work would feature as some of my favourite 'solo' artist.

For me, Gabriel leaving Genesis was one of the best things that happened in music, they both became so much better afterwards.

Are you actually Alan 'Wings, the band the Beatles could have been' Partridge?

[ForestPoetry]

I love a bit of Collins era Genesis, guilty pleasures be damned. And if Gabriel hadn't left we wouldn't have albums like Peter Gabriel III, IV, So, Passion and Us which are all beyond-words levels of good. Everybody wins! 

[Shaggy]

18 hours ago, davepb24 said:

Another one I'd throw in..."Mk 2" OMD. First four albums amazing. Added a brass section and I stopped listening. Although did see them on the Sugar Tax tour with Andy and hired helps and that was far better than I thought it would be.

I'd agree with that - when I was at Liverpool Uni, OMD were kind of the "house band" in the student union just as they were breaking through, and I loved the early stuff, especially "Messages".   They were always pop, but I found the later material bland in the extreme 

Great times - Echo & the Bunnymen, Teardrop Explodes, and Wah Heat! played there too as local bands just hitting it big, though one of my favourites were Original Mirrors who never did

[Mickeyboro]

Wah! Heat... two classic singles and then a dwindle into the gutter of obscurity. Shame!

[Bilbo]

 

[Bassassin]

1 hour ago, Bilbo said:

 

Dead Leper were never as good, or rather, never any good - after the Getcha Rocks Off EP.

[Woodinblack]

4 hours ago, spectoremg said:

Are you actually Alan 'Wings, the band the Beatles could have been' Partridge?

No. I don't like wings, although I can't say I am a fan of the beatles either. Trick of the Tail though is one of my favourite albums every, of any group. Some of the earlier genesis albums are ok, but not lamb lies down, never could get into that. However, the first gabriel albums have moments of sheer genius.

[The59Sound]

5 hours ago, spectoremg said:

Are you actually Alan 'Wings, the band the Beatles could have been' Partridge?

Smell my cheese!

[honza992]

Marillion. 

Script and Fugazi are glorious. Fish at his most angry, Steve Rothery on guitar and the keyboard solos are amazing. I loved them as much as I have anything in my life. 

Then along came album 3, Misplaced Childhood, they started their sorry descent into blandness. 

"So here I am once more........" 

 

[PaulWarning]

1 hour ago, honza992 said:

Marillion. 

Script and Fugazi are glorious. Fish at his most angry, Steve Rothery on guitar and the keyboard solos are amazing. I loved them as much as I have anything in my life. 

Then along came album 3, Misplaced Childhood, they started their sorry descent into blandness. 

"So here I am once more........" 

 

most bands have only got a couple of decent albums in them, sometimes not even two,  they've got one way of playing and one style and when that's exhausted it's a descent into repetitiveness or, as you say, blandness

Edited December 25, 2018 by PaulWarning

[Bassassin]

1 hour ago, honza992 said:

Marillion. 

Script and Fugazi are glorious. Fish at his most angry, Steve Rothery on guitar and the keyboard solos are amazing. I loved them as much as I have anything in my life. 

Then along came album 3, Misplaced Childhood, they started their sorry descent into blandness. 

"So here I am once more........"

Wonder if that's the hit single paradox. Kayleigh, Lavender etc turned them into a chart act, despite the songs being part of a concept album - which was a pretty much unthinkable idea in 1985. I suppose though that hit singles became an expectation from the label/management and that affected the way they wrote subsequently.

Fish-era Marillion was a band that (at the time) I liked despite thinking I probably shouldn't - them being as old-school prog as they were circa Script. My then-girlfriend was a massive fan & I saw them on the Fugazi tour at the Hammy O, front row. Absolutely blew me away, made me a fan in the space of a few minutes.

Saw them again on the next tour when they played what - at the time - was unreleased new material, which Fish introduced as "a track from our next album - this one's called 'Side One'". That being half of Misplaced Childhood. I had a live recording from the radio of one of those shows, so was familiar with the early versions of the new songs for a long time before the album was finally released.

The finished versions were insipid compared to the way they'd been played six months or so earlier, and quite different in many respects - the lyrics & vocal melody to Kayleigh were completely changed, and I remember Heart Of Lothian having some lovely vocal harmonies (from bassist Pete Trewavas) which were absent from the finished version. Never liked the album, and after the rather dreadful follow-up, Clutching At Straws, I really lost any interest in them.

Which was a shame - because 25-odd years later, in a somewhat different life, I rediscovered Hogarth-era Marillion. Slowly working my way through the back-catalogue in (mostly) reverse order and finding them rather delightful!

I may have rambled a little, if so I apologise, but it's Christmas and there is alcohol present.