Musicman Stingrays - Overrated ?

[LukeFRC]

8 hours ago, Delberthot said:

I'm at the stage now after owning christ knows how many basses (140+ I think) that the most important thing is how it plays.

+1 

Based on this if I had to recommend a bass from a mainstream shop that would have ‘that’ playability the 2018 Ray is very very very good based on the one I tried. Then G&L and then Squier is what I would recomend

[customstocker]

you need to rip out the electronics & put an 8coil pickup inside 

 

[Max Normal]

You think Stingrays are over rated but ride a Harley. Hmmmn 😀

Srsly though, I play mine through an Ampeg which is a tonal paradox I know.  The punch of the 'Ray combined with the fatness of the Ampeg gives a sweet but fattish tone that cuts through the mix nicely, I love it.

It can sound a bit glassy through my Markbass tho.

[chris_b]

Stan Sergeant, bass player with Keb Mo, uses an MM SR5. I wish I could have got mine to sound like this.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j1CIGcpfJP0&list=OLAK5uy_k_LVk6DSgfbA6hEWe0IILp-Mc-h0nlkMQ&index=1

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Z2YSTEOOI4&list=OLAK5uy_k_LVk6DSgfbA6hEWe0IILp-Mc-h0nlkMQ&index=14

 

[4000]

On 22/02/2019 at 11:15, customstocker said:

you need to rip out the electronics & put an 8coil pickup inside 

 

Arguably the most aptly named bassist of all time.😉 Even if it is pronounced as per the fish, which spoils it a little.

Love Camel, although I’ll admit I have a preference for the original lineup. 

[No. 8 Wire]

20 hours ago, chris_b said:

Stan Sergeant, bass player with Keb Mo, uses an MM SR5. I wish I could have got mine to sound like this.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j1CIGcpfJP0&list=OLAK5uy_k_LVk6DSgfbA6hEWe0IILp-Mc-h0nlkMQ&index=1

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Z2YSTEOOI4&list=OLAK5uy_k_LVk6DSgfbA6hEWe0IILp-Mc-h0nlkMQ&index=14

 

Are you sure that's a ray in the recording? It sounds a lot like my p with flats.

I found this live video with the Stingray 5, it sounds very Stingray in this

 

 

Edited September 13, 2019 by No. 8 Wire

[No. 8 Wire]

On 22/02/2019 at 11:15, customstocker said:

you need to rip out the electronics & put an 8coil pickup inside 

 

I like the sound of that.  Although it's really hard to compare from YouTube videos.

What does the 8 coil do that's different from the standard humbucker (when used in the same mode)? Due it give more even string volume? It's each coil tweaked slightly for the different strings? Would like to know more.

Edited September 13, 2019 by No. 8 Wire
Autocorrect nightmare

[drTStingray]

Did someone say Stingray through Ampeg? Keb Mo again - I love this sound and my SR5 sounds exactly like that!! Though not the playing!! 

https://youtu.be/ygUV3e9nY9s

Edited September 13, 2019 by drTStingray

[chris_b]

1 hour ago, No. 8 Wire said:

Are you sure that's a ray in the recording? It sounds a lot like my p with flats.

You might be right. I assumed he'd used an SR5 with some flats on.

[chris_b]

8 minutes ago, drTStingray said:

Did someone say Stingray through Ampeg? Keb Mo again - I love this sound and my SR5 sounds exactly like that!! 

https://youtu.be/ygUV3e9nY9s

Brilliant. Thanks for posting. That's getting closer to the studio sound I posted.

[No. 8 Wire]

59 minutes ago, chris_b said:

Brilliant. Thanks for posting. That's getting closer to the studio sound I posted.

To me, that sounds great (Ray + Ampeg), however not anything like the recording.

Here's a live vid of the first song you posted, he's playing some kind of P bass there, probably with flats to my ear:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O6x9gRqdX5I

 

[drTStingray]

59 minutes ago, No. 8 Wire said:

To me, that sounds great (Ray + Ampeg), however not anything like the recording.

Here's a live vid of the first song you posted, he's playing some kind of P bass there, probably with flats to my ear:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O6x9gRqdX5I

 

He's playing some sort of PJ with a front loaded preamp - the front cover is of the Marcus Miller style. It's got a very lively and punchy sound in places - maybe result of the active circuit and a compressor. 

The sound on Give Me What You Got is certainly typical of an SR5 (possibly ceramic). Bear in mind he's a virtuoso player.

Im concious that it's rarely worth arguing with other people's opinions, but for me, the Stingray is shown across the board to be a versatile bass - if you want to lay back and groove, there's no better fat bass tone - if you want to step out occasionally, you can do that, if you want to play slap solos then the sound is great, if you want to play solo chordal work you can do that (though a Bongo may be better at that). It's sound could be described as iconic. 

Not sure why anyone would class a bass of that type as over-rated. 

If you prefer a Precision then fine - for my money they're not as versatile and you'll struggle to do some of the things I mentioned well (lots of people don't want to anyway). But none of that makes the Stingray an overrated bass.

You may also notice Stan plays with the bass strung the other way round - I didn't see a problem with him pushing the B off the board - arguably far easier to do, with certain technique variation than the normal arrangement with the G there. 

Edited September 13, 2019 by drTStingray

[No. 8 Wire]

31 minutes ago, drTStingray said:

He's playing some sort of PJ with a front loaded preamp - the front cover is of the Marcus Miller style. It's got a very lively and punchy sound in places - maybe result of the active circuit and a compressor. 

The sound on Give Me What You Got is certainly typical of an SR5 (possibly ceramic). Bear in mind he's a virtuoso player.

Im concious that it's rarely worth arguing with other people's opinions, but for me, the Stingray is shown across the board to be a versatile bass - if you want to lay back and groove, there's no better fat bass tone - if you want to step out occasionally, you can do that, if you want to play slap solos then the sound is great, if you want to play solo chordal work you can do that (though a Bongo may be better at that). It's sound could be described as iconic. 

Not sure why anyone would class a bass of that type as over-rated. 

If you prefer a Precision then fine - for my money they're not as versatile and you'll struggle to do some of the things I mentioned well (lots of people don't want to anyway). But none of that makes the Stingray an overrated bass.

You may also notice Stan plays with the bass strung the other way round - I didn't see a problem with him pushing the B off the board - arguably far easier to do, with certain technique variation than the normal arrangement with the G there. 

Preaching to the converted!

I was just saying the bass on that particular studio version, didn't sound the like a ray, and the live videos seem to back that up. Not a comment on the merits of either type of bass.

A Stingray 5 is my favourite 5 string for  the tone of it...apart from a Wal.  However I can never aspire to owning a Wal, but a Stingray 5 is definitely achievable at some point.

[chris_b]

8 hours ago, No. 8 Wire said:

Are you sure that's a ray in the recording? It sounds a lot like my p with flats.

 

7 hours ago, chris_b said:

You might be right. I assumed he'd used an SR5 with some flats on.

 

Hold on. . . . . what am I talking about. . . . . these clips were from the Hot Pink album. That's a live album, recorded on tour over a year and to my knowledge Stan Sergeant only uses his SR 5 and a double bass on gigs with Keb Mo.

[OliverBlackman]

18 hours ago, drTStingray said:

 

Im concious that it's rarely worth arguing with other people's opinions, but for me, the Stingray is shown across the board to be a versatile bass - if you want to lay back and groove, there's no better fat bass tone - if you want to step out occasionally, you can do that, if you want to play slap solos then the sound is great, if you want to play solo chordal work you can do that (though a Bongo may be better at that). It's sound could be described as iconic. 

Not sure why anyone would class a bass of that type as over-rated. 

If you prefer a Precision then fine - for my money they're not as versatile and you'll struggle to do some of the things I mentioned well (lots of people don't want to anyway). But none of that makes the Stingray an overrated bass.

Warning long story! So when I was around 17 I had a bass tutor who played a MM SUB (USA one) and I loved the sound! I was really into RHCP at the time. I also tried one in a shop and really wanted one but being 17 didn’t have the money. Around the same time I went to Barcelona with the family and saw a USA stingray in teal and fell in love with the look of it. They wouldn’t let me try the bass being a foreign kid but I had this down in my mind as the holy grail of basses. My other basses at the time was a MIM P and a Warwick rockbass. So I continued to ask for a MM Sub for my birthday but my dad found out they had been discontinued. He must have rung every shop in the country and couldn’t get one. Roll on the next year and as it was my 18th the family secretly pooled together and bought me the USA Stingray in teal (made in 2007). Don’t get me wrong, I loved this bass for ages and would play chili’s songs on it all day and night. 

However, when I then went to study music at university I found it often lacked versatility. I was also experimenting with other basses at the time and in my second year traded it for a Overwater jazz 5. The Overwater was infinitely better and more versatile but i couldn’t get on with the 35” scale length. Anyway, bringing the story to the point (sorry it’s taken this long) as I got better as a musician and played more of a range of music the MIM P bass I got when I was 16 has become more and more my main bass. It wears flats and sounds good for anything, to adjust the tone I adjust how I play it whether that be finger position, technique or attack used. 

So to counteract your opinion - yes I think the Stingray is overrated. However the last 30th Anniversary 5 in white with the roasted neck that I tried was astonishing. If I didn’t hanker for a Ken Smith I’d be after one of those. 

[HazBeen]

Like many “this bass is this or that” threads to me it seems we are overlooking what actually makes up a large portion of your sound, your fingers and where you hit the string. Whatever bass I play, it will always sound like me and any 1 pickup bass (be it a P or Ray) has many different sounds in it by changing your technique.

[Al Krow]

2 hours ago, HazBeen said:

Like many “this bass is this or that” threads to me it seems we are overlooking what actually makes up a large portion of your sound, your fingers and where you hit the string. Whatever bass I play, it will always sound like me and any 1 pickup bass (be it a P or Ray) has many different sounds in it by changing your technique.

No question that our technique, finger placement etc does have a significant bearing on our sound, but I wouldn't go so far to say that it was a "large portion" which kinda implies to me that it's a dominant factor?

Me playing my Yammy PJ in P mode sounds quite distinct tonally to my Spector Legend Custom or Ibanez SR Premium etc.

In terms of tone from a bass itself, before we get to the rest of the signal chain, IMO the following all have impact:

Significant tonal impact

• pups - type and placement
• strings
• EQ settings on the bass e.g. treble rolled off, and whether played actively or passively
• finger placement and technique
• properly set up => clarity / buzz etc

Relatively minor tonal impact

• Woods used
• Neck through or bolt-on

Edited September 14, 2019 by Al Krow
Additional point from Oliver added

[LukeFRC]

24 minutes ago, Al Krow said:

No question that our technique, finger placement etc does have a significant bearing on our sound, but I wouldn't go so far to say that it was a "large portion" which kinda implies to me that it's a dominant factor?

I'm not disagreeing with you at all, but I've always found it interesting how much my playing sounds like me playing a bass, regardless of the bass. Other people pick up my basses and sound so different. (usually better).

Different basses of course sound different, and some fit with my playing and some don't. 
I tend to think of it that the pups type and position/ strings/electronics are going to have the fundamental effect on where the bass is going to sit tonally. The specific pickups, and woods and construction technique I think are often contribute the "voice" of the bass- in the same way my voice is different to yours. 
Of course if we were singing BV in a band, the finesse of the voice is going to get lost to a certain extent. 

[krispn]

I’ve always taken the phrase “sounding like me” to be irrespective of the eq, if it’s a J, P, MM etc. their ‘musical voice’ rather than the ‘tone’ they refer to. How they play, hand placement etc all impact but I see it as similar to handwriting. We can use a cheap bic or a Mont Blanc but once we get over the quality of the tool we're using we’re still either gonna have a beautifully elaborate style or functionally legible scrawl - yes I’m talking to you G.P.’s and doctors 😀

I like to think of it as Punk’s ‘ALL CAPS’ to the flowing cursive of a classical piece. If you’re gonna play well and have your own voice it’ll translate regardless of the tool and if your gonna hit bum notes they’ll sound bad no matter how high end the gear MM or otherwise. 

 

I have figured this out from painful live experience 😀

Edited September 14, 2019 by krispn

[Al Krow]

I like the handwriting analogy! But I think we are now straying into the realms of how competent technically and the groove we play with etc.

Which for me is quite a different point to the impact that finger placement has on the tone you are getting out of a bass, and which is just one of the several factors mentioned above.

A great bass player will make any bass sound good.

Edited September 14, 2019 by Al Krow

[krispn]

I'm not meaning proficiency on the instrument - I think as other's have said we'll always sound like ourselves and while hand position, pick up's, eq can inflect certain tonal changes the 'voice' of the player will always come across.

I've heard Stingrays sound aggressive, clangy and up front ripping through a punk song yet I've heard them thick and supportive on disco tracks. If a player want's to develop their voice a single pick up instrument is a great tool with which to develop things like hand placement etc. ergo I don't thing they're over rated or a one trick pony the same way some might feel a p bass is.

I've always fancied spending some time with one to hear how I'd sound with it on gigs...but I'd probably just try and make it sound like a passive p bass

 

Edited September 14, 2019 by krispn

[Jus Lukin]

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Edited March 4, 2022 by Jus Lukin

[danny-79]

4 minutes ago, Jus Lukin said:

I have a friend and bandmate whom is selling a Stringray.

I don't know its age, serial number, etc, so am not sure of its market value,  but I made the mistake of letting him slip it into my hands at a weekly blues night we host. Given that I've had other Thursday gigs for a month now, I think it's fair to say that I've had Stingrays on the brain for some time now!

I'm waiting to buy a house and am technically homeless for the time being, so buying his or any other isn't really an option, but it's given me some nice daydreams to take my mind off matters a bit!

I think you either love them or hate them. Me, I’ve got 3 (and a Bongo H) wouldn’t want to play anything else (apart from the token Jazz I’ve got 😜) 

Edited September 14, 2019 by danny-79

[bassfan]

Hope I love them. Never had one and there’s one incoming! 😆

[OliverBlackman]

2 hours ago, Al Krow said:

 

Significant tonal impact

• pups - type and placement
• strings
• EQ settings on the bass e.g. treble rolled off, and whether played actively or passively
• finger placement and technique

Relatively minor tonal impact

• Woods used
• Neck through or bolt-on

Setup is also key to tone, buzz, clarity ect.