Can someone tell me what makes up the £8k difference in price between these two basses?

[TheGreek]

I held/played this one...some may recognise it...TBH I wasn't overly impressed with it. It didn't strike me as 5x or £8k better than my GB, Status or Overwater - all of which are around the £2-3K mark - suggests to me the real price for a custom bass.

The OP asks about the price difference between the two basses and there have been some interesting responses. What we do know is it isn't the cost of the materials.

Can I justify the extra £8K because it's made in a fashionable/ expensive part of NY? What about because of the perceived extra craftsmanship? Do these represent VFM anyway?

If you can't justify the additional cost for the invisible factors in the purchase price, then don't - I wouldn't. That's what capitalism is about. The old adage of "it's only worth what somebody will pay" and "supply & demand" ring true here, nobody forces somebody with too much loads of money to buy a Fodera, and for most it won't make a difference in how they play. May make a difference in how they think they play...but they won't fool many....and as we know, the average punter (or most bassists for that matter) can't tell the difference anyway.

For me the argument of a Rembrandt being more than a piece of canvas and some paint doesn't stand up for most people. You're paying for the name (and authenticity obviously) but you could pick up a fairly close copy done by one of the artists on Speakers Corner, London for virtually nothing and very few people would know....so to everybody but the most discerning it really doesn't matter. Pretty much the same with these basses.

Personally, I'd have the Maruszczyk anyway.

[kodiakblair]

I like Johnny Lee Long's thoughts on Fodera .

 

 

[lemmywinks]

11 minutes ago, kodiakblair said:

I like Johnny Lee Long's thoughts on Fodera .

 

 

I love that guy, he just always seems so excited to be playing bass. or even being in the same room as a bass. I'm pretty sure you could send him an email that just said "bass" and he'd squeal with laughter. He's got another Chinese Fauxdera too, I think he's quite handy at fettling basses though (he did a restoration of an old KS) so he can do any work himself.

Edited January 11, 2019 by lemmywinks

[kodiakblair]

Aye,I've no doubt he's handy when fixing up basses. On this one it was minimal,hardware change to gold and a $40 preamp. What's great is Johnny owns some serious bits of kit and he's saying " Damn ! this $300 bass is great ". The usual stuff like IP rights/Vinny & Co's craftsmanship/US fear of China etc, he just blows it off.

 

This one is from before the gold hardware. 

 

[ped]

1 hour ago, lemmywinks said:

 I'm pretty sure you could send him an email that just said "bass" and he'd squeal with laughter. 

😂😂😂

[lemmywinks]

1 hour ago, kodiakblair said:

Aye,I've no doubt he's handy when fixing up basses. On this one it was minimal,hardware change to gold and a $40 preamp. What's great is Johnny owns some serious bits of kit and he's saying " Damn ! this $300 bass is great ". The usual stuff like IP rights/Vinny & Co's craftsmanship/US fear of China etc, he just blows it off.

 

This one is from before the gold hardware. 

 

Earthing issue aside he makes that sound great, his style isn't the type I usually go for (that whole Wooten generic gospel funk stuff - give me some Brick any day) but his playing is so full of life. Great personality to have on YouTube.

 

Gonna have a look at those Tone Monster preamps, I've had Artecs in a few basses and you can get startlingly good sounds out of them. I can remember when budget preamps were universally awful things. pretty cool that there's drop in solder free replacements that cost the same as a pack of strings.

[NickA]

A new Wal will cost the best of £6000 and they are made in an ex cow shed outside Leatherhead.  So it isn't only location!

Smiths aren't cheap either, nor Alembics

These are lovingly hand made basses constructed to customer order and using very fancy wood, pickups and electronics.  In the case of the Wals even the pickups are specially hand made in house.

Doubtless, Fodera make lovely basses.  But the current prices are surely in part down to a couple of famous and brilliant bass players who have chosen to use them.

However, old Fender Precisions are also silly expensive for such basic things (http://andybaxterbass.com/details.php?id=1424).

With that budget to spend, I'd much rather have a Fodera (but a Shuker or an ACG would likely provide the same quality for a fraction of the price).

[kodiakblair]

24 minutes ago, lemmywinks said:

Gonna have a look at those Tone Monster preamps,

Great bit of kit and dead easy to install. Put 1 in a T40 and another in my Peavey Zephyr 5. Afraid there's no avoiding VAT and the collection fee 😞

The semi-parametric version is brilliant,comes in 4 or 5 knob options.

[lemmywinks]

1 hour ago, kodiakblair said:

Great bit of kit and dead easy to install. Put 1 in a T40 and another in my Peavey Zephyr 5. Afraid there's no avoiding VAT and the collection fee 😞

The semi-parametric version is brilliant,comes in 4 or 5 knob options.

I was looking at that one, I have similarly configured Artec in my backup bass (an old Korean Cort C5P with the piezo bridge removed) but the mid sweep doesn't work and Artec weren't very helpful, in fact I have two like that and only found out they were faulty when I went to install them a year after purchase. Shame as every other Artec pre I've had has been great.

Edited January 11, 2019 by lemmywinks

[kodiakblair]

@lemmywinks

If you do buy one and hit a snag,well don't panic. Nate who runs Guitar Fuel is a sound fella, I was convinced the blend pot was dodgy in the Tune Bass Maniac,forgot I'd put a T Monster in that 😃 Anyway he just posted me over a replacement. No shipping fee got mentioned.

 

I've a spare 4 knob version in the drawer if you fancy trying before buying 👍

[Hellzero]

3 hours ago, kodiakblair said:

I like Johnny Lee Long's thoughts on Fodera .

 

 

 

3 hours ago, kodiakblair said:

Aye,I've no doubt he's handy when fixing up basses. On this one it was minimal,hardware change to gold and a $40 preamp. What's great is Johnny owns some serious bits of kit and he's saying " Damn ! this $300 bass is great ". The usual stuff like IP rights/Vinny & Co's craftsmanship/US fear of China etc, he just blows it off.

 

This one is from before the gold hardware. 

 

These are what I call : proof by absurdity !

If, after that, you still think that Fodera's are worth the price asked, then you are a suitable case for treatment. So sorry for you.

And Johnny Lee is such fun to watch and listen to. 😉

[lemmywinks]

11 minutes ago, kodiakblair said:

@lemmywinks

If you do buy one and hit a snag,well don't panic. Nate who runs Guitar Fuel is a sound fella, I was convinced the blend pot was dodgy in the Tune Bass Maniac,forgot I'd put a T Monster in that 😃 Anyway he just posted me over a replacement. No shipping fee got mentioned.

 

I've a spare 4 knob version in the drawer if you fancy trying before buying 👍

Thanks for the offer, I think I'll just go for the 5 knob SBK 3A when I have some Paypal credit (I have very strict gear buying rules I set for myself!). the overall cost is very discouraging when ordering from the USA though. I have a pal who comes over a few times a year so I might see if he can sneak one over for me.

[kodiakblair]

18 minutes ago, Hellzero said:

These are what I call : proof by absurdity !

Aye. You're dead right there.  Of course contributors to Vinny's pension fund should just ignore it 😄

[kevvo66]

I was fortunate to have a go on fodera a couple of years back , can't remember the model ,looked great ,played it ,didn't like it ,but  I did think about investing some money into something like that at one point as investment I'd been left some money ,but came to my senses and buggered of to Cuba for two weeks which was more enjoyable and left money in the bank ,if your a pro bass player you'll get them for nowt probably, it a fickle business this music business 🤔

[thebassist]

12 hours ago, Hellzero said:

 

These are what I call : proof by absurdity !

If, after that, you still think that Fodera's are worth the price asked, then you are a suitable case for treatment. So sorry for you.

And Johnny Lee is such fun to watch and listen to. 😉

Here is my latest Fodera and I still think that Fodera are worth the price asked. What kind of treatment do you think I am suitable for because I have this instrument?

 

[prowla]

They're both ugly.

Edited January 12, 2019 by prowla

[chris_b]

5 hours ago, kevvo66 said:

. . . . if your a pro bass player you'll get them for nowt probably, it a fickle business this music business 🤔

Mass manufacturers may give gear away to generate sales, but if you are a boutique manufacturer and have a full order book stretching ahead for several years, you do not give away your products. 

Everyone, including Paul McCartney paid for their Wal basses and, from what I've read, the same goes for other boutique makes.

Edited January 12, 2019 by chris_b

[prowla]

2 hours ago, chris_b said:

Mass manufacturers may give gear away to generate sales, but if you are a boutique manufacturer and have a full order book stretching ahead for several years, you do not give away your products. 

Everyone, including Paul McCartney paid for their Wal basses and, from what I've read, the same goes for other boutique makes.

Rickenbacker gave Macca his, as I recall. 

[EBS_freak]

2 hours ago, chris_b said:

Mass manufacturers may give gear away to generate sales, but if you are a boutique manufacturer and have a full order book stretching ahead for several years, you do not give away your products. 

Everyone, including Paul McCartney paid for their Wal basses and, from what I've read, the same goes for other boutique makes.

Linda paid for Macca’s Wal.

[lemmywinks]

4 minutes ago, prowla said:

Rickenbacker gave Macca his, as I recall. 

Kinda proves what he was saying, they are a long way from being a boutique builder.

[kodiakblair]

2 hours ago, chris_b said:

but if you are a boutique manufacturer and have a full order book stretching ahead for several years, you do not give away your products. 

Do you think that applies to Anthony Jackson, Victor Wooten or Bona and Garrison ?

[Hellzero]

5 hours ago, thebassist said:

Here is my latest Fodera and I still think that Fodera are worth the price asked. What kind of treatment do you think I am suitable for because I have this instrument?

 

Go to a real (I insist on the term real, because there are so many clowns around) luthier and ask him how much he would really charge you to hand craft the exact same bass. No need for electroshock, you'll get it for free.

You know, the least expensive part in an instrument is the wood...

If you want a list of retail prices for a similar bass or any high end boutique bass, here it is :

Mike Pope preamp with the 3 switches : $374 USD

Hipshot bridge : $155 USD

Knobs : $60 USD

Dunlop flush mount Straplok set : $22 USD

Aero pickups set : $500 USD

Gotoh tuners set : $100 USD

Custom Fodera tool kit : $30 USD

Teardrop hardshell case : $220 USD

2 way truss rod : £13 USD

Slotted bone nut (in case they can't make it themselves) : $17 USD

Stainless steel frets : $14 USD

Aliphatic wood glue (hoping they are not using anything else) : $6 USD

AAAA body woods : $300 USD

AAAA neck woods including fingerboard : £250 USD

Inlays : $20 USD

Fodera strings (Anthony Jackson Signature, which are really good and the most expensive) : $71 USD

Lacquer, masking tape, sanding paper and finishing supplies : $45 USD

Screws : $3 USD

Grand total for supplies at retail price : $2200 USD

Cut this in two for their buying price as I've taken real high retail prices : $1100 USD

 

Don't you think, they are making huge profits !?!

Edited January 12, 2019 by Hellzero
Trying to grammar nazis...

[I Denby]

So, is it not a question of a Fedora being a superior bass, but whether it's THAT superior (reflected by the price)

[NickA]

" Don't you think, they are making huge profits !?! "

But hang on; these guys are trained and skilled craftsmen.  They deserve to make money more than any hedge-fund manager does.  Well, I reckon so.

[mcnach]

2 minutes ago, I Denby said:

So, is it not a question of a Fedora being a superior bass, but whether it's THAT superior (reflected by the price)