Zoom B1 Four

[dannybuoy]

3 hours ago, Al Krow said:

You're obviously liking the dUg - I'm guessing you're getting quite a lot more flexibility with that to go from DG scooped right through to mid punchy as the need arises?

At the risk of pulling a Zoom thread severely off topic... I use the dUg and the B7K fairly similarly - set to low gain so that soft playing sounds clean but digging in produces plenty of upper growl that cuts through. But I prefer the dUg as it sounds cleaner with soft playing and dirtier with agressive playing. So it's versatile in the sense that I can get a dark punchy bass sound and a super growly sound from the same pedal with the same settings, just by how I play. But there's still that massive hole in the mids unless you turn mix mode off, which sounds so different that I feel the need to change the EQ settings. 

But if I want to flip to a warm, slightly driven, mid focused sound though, I'll just turn the dUg off. I haven't found anything that can touch the Tone Hammer for that application!

[krispn]

I’d agree that the Tone Hammer is a super versatile pedal too. I’m sure the zoom can recreate it with some patches but for a standalone eq or drive pedal it’s pretty neat. @dannybuoy did you try the settings listed on this post!

 

[dannybuoy]

Yes, I've seen that post on TB, it was an eye opener to the scooped BDDI tones that I'd never tried before. I can get somewhat close to the Tone Hammer with some of the amp sims but not quite close enough!

[krispn]

It the TH’s ability to shift those mids scooped or more prominent so easily that’s it’s strong point especially in AGS mode. Great unit which really does benefit from the info in that postI think. 

[Al Krow]

10 minutes ago, krispn said:

It the TH’s ability to shift those mids scooped or more prominent so easily that’s it’s strong point especially in AGS mode. 

Talk me through what you're getting at there? Sounds really good, but not sure what it means!

Apologies to the B1-4 thread followers for this mini thread hi-jack, but it may give us all some useful tips for patch shaping ideas!  

[krispn]

Sweepable mids from 180Hz-1kHz If you follow the description and settings explained in that link it describes how you can shift the mid freq to have a really useful impact on the tone.

"....At this point, if you want more depth, rather than boosting the bass, you move the mid frequency knob clockwise, which pools out upper mids and articulation. If you want more of that, then you move the knob counter clockwise to bring those upper mids back into the tone. The highs and lows stay the same, so it's an easy way to adjust your tone on the gig to get more/less articulation in the mix."

[krispn]

The eq of the pedal changes with the AGS mode engaged and therefore really needs to be heard/manipulated in context to fully understand what's going on. It's the interactivity of the controls rather than simply pooling the mids out at a particular frequency. I think it's more a case of it's the sum of it's parts rather one specific mid control as that's to oversimplify the pedal as a whole. Combined with a decent passive bass it's superior to many on baord eq units IME.

[Al Krow]

Thanks - sounds good and not a million miles from what's happening on the BB NE2 with it's sweepable mid cut to overlay the mid tone EQ.

[krispn]

Possibly but the interactivity of the TH pedal, how the treble becomes more of a presence control, AGS mode engaged introduces the drive circuit etc. Similar controls but quite different sounds.  I’ve seen TJ Spicer’s BBNE review and the sounds he gets are not the same as with the TH AGS engaged. Think more amp like than standard 3 or 4 band active eq a la a BDDI.

Edited May 19, 2019 by krispn

[dannybuoy]

You can certainly apply some of these aspects to your patches. With AGS on you get an overdrive circuit plus a ‘speaker sim’ consisting of a fixed HPF + LPF.

I prefer a simple LPF to remove top end fizz over a speaker sim, as they usually sound too dark in my experience. I don’t care that they might sound more like a real cab, if that just means it sounds muddy. So tip #1 - try the high and low EQ filters out in place of the cab sims.

Also, the mid EQ is before the overdrive circuit, bass and treble after. Therefore the mid knob affects the character of the overdrive, a bit like the character knob on the VT Bass or presence knob on the BDDI. So tip #2 - try cutting a frequency range before drive then boosting it back after (or vice versa)!

PS - that post says that AGS turns the treble control into a presence control. Thing is, presence is not really a technically defined term so everyone implements it differently. I thought it usually meant the frequency range above the treble control rather than below it, but then the Sansamp BDDI confuses matters by naming their pre-gain high-mid / treble boost as ‘presence’. AGS probably does not change the behaviour of the bass and treble knobs as such, it just sounds like that because of those additional filters. The HPF lets you boost bass while keeping things tight, and the LPF makes it sound like you’re boosting a lower treble frequency just because the upper ones are rolled off.

Edited May 19, 2019 by dannybuoy

[krispn]

Yeah and I think we’re in agreement that engaging the AGS changes the function of the pedal from a typical Aguilar OBP-3 preamp into something quite different and musical! It’s a great pedal and makes for a versatile ‘drive’ pedal for a range of classic bass tones. 

Thats my detail over. As you were! 

[Al Krow]

Just noted that the MS-60B has a bitcrusher sim whereas I don't think the B1X-4 / B3n have one? I wonder if it's as good as an entry level bitcrusher like the Mooer Lo-fi? 

Bitcrush + OC2 (on my Valeton OC-10) could be quite a neat combination. I've heard @dodge_bass sounding pretty cool with that combination of sounds. 

Looks like I might need to hold on to my MS-60B for a little while longer... 

Edited May 25, 2019 by Al Krow

[JohnDaBass]

37 minutes ago, Al Krow said:

 

Looks like I might need to hold on to my MS-60B for a little while longer... 

+1☺

[Al Krow]

My two dedicated drive pedals have won a reprieve also! I'm pretty pleased with the drive patches I've made, but playing through headphones last night there was no question that B1X-4 effects sims were not retaining a fulsome low end in the way that my digital SA Aftershock drive multifx (with its clean blend) or my analogue Creation Grizzly bass (without separate clean blend) both manage to do. And that was even after having boosted the bass EQ settings on all my B1X-4 drive patches. 

[jrixn1]

Took it out tonight. The tuner is more visible now with its bright lights.

Just about fits on a Pedaltrain Nano too.

 

[LukeFRC]

This is the least basschat thread ever...

”you know the thousands you spent on your pedal board”

”yep, I replaced it with a big multi fx board - it’s amazing”

”I m thinking of getting the small stomp box version of your big multi fx board as I hear it’s amazing”

”oh it is amazing, it sounds great”

”that what you use?”

”nah, check out this £60 Zoom pedal, tbh I don’t need anything else”

 

[Al Krow]

@LukeFRC so true! 😁

It doesn't necessarily have to cost the earth to sound great. 

I also totally love the fact that @ped has a Ken Smith bass which he pairs with a B1on.

We're obviously trying to gently coax him to upgrade his Zoom and to splash out on a B1(X)-4...and he's (naturally!) trying to persuade me to get a Ken Smith. Let's see who buckles first 😂

[ped]

Well, I have a B1on but I rarely use it - VB99 is my unit

The Zoom is fun for travel though. 

[Al Krow]

@ped Can I just congratulate you on a milestone 10,000 posts!! (and for being a great mod whom we all appreciate!)

Sorry to have made you waste such an august post, by having to use it responding to me! 😁

[ped]

Wow I didn't notice! I'll get working on my speech!

It would be right of you to commemorate this occasion with a new bass.

[Al Krow]

On 12/05/2019 at 22:41, ped said:

Thanks for the FX list. I don’t get much/any noise when not playing so haven’t used the ZNR it’s more the digital noise under the notes. I’ll just have to try one. 

*@xx*r !! Just when I was absolutely loving this pedal!!

Upgraded my cab yesterday and have the best cab I've ever played through sitting in my basement studio. Obviously there's nothing else in the mix at home so I get to hear everything pretty well but more so than ever with the new cab.

But the downside of having a great cab is that the "digital noise under the notes" that you've been bringing to our attention is suddenly obvious to me and, whilst it's going to get completely lost in a band mix, I know I'm going to find it very annoying when working on stuff at home.

Zoom UK have a 60 day return period, so I should hopefully be able to get a full refund. [EDIT: although this pedal completely justifies being held on to, other than this one 'digital noise under the notes' point.]

What a shame...looks like I may need to go back "up market" for a multifx, after all. HX Stomp is the obvious choice, but I wonder when Mooer are finally going to get around to getting their GE 300 out? And the large display on the Headrush Gigboard does make that appealing...

Edited May 27, 2019 by Al Krow

[dave_bass5]

On 25/05/2019 at 09:43, Al Krow said:

My two dedicated drive pedals have won a reprieve also! I'm pretty pleased with the drive patches I've made, but playing through headphones last night there was no question that B1X-4 effects sims were not retaining a fulsome low end in the way that my digital SA Aftershock drive multifx (with its clean blend) or my analogue Creation Grizzly bass (without separate clean blend) both manage to do. And that was even after having boosted the bass EQ settings on all my B1X-4 drive patches. 

I guess there’s a reason this only costs what it does. 

[Al Krow]

2 hours ago, Al Krow said:

...but I wonder when Mooer are finally going to get around to getting their GE 300 out? 

To answer my own Q, apparently June 16th  

[dave_bass5]

Looks like the Stomp, only bigger. 

[Al Krow]

2 minutes ago, dave_bass5 said:

Looks like the Stomp, only bigger. 

Haha - you should have gone to Specsavers, Dave, it looks nothing like the Stomp! 

You'll be saying that a Cali 76CB and a Spectracomp look the same next! 😁😂